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Old January 11th, 2008, 10:01 PM   #341
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It was based on religious laws and is now a governmental law. Don't confuse the two. Christians aren't supposed to sleep with their neighbors spouse - religious law (and before you say it, she committed adultery, not me). If I am single and sleep with my neighbors wife, I didn't break a governmental law. A lot of governmental law started out from religious law. Not all religious law became governmental law, especially in the US.
so this religious law became a goverment law... so should we ignore it then? surely we don't want religion shoved down our throats.....
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Old January 11th, 2008, 10:04 PM   #342
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Not completely because there are too many variables to discuss in this format.

"Early on" and "late term" are vague statements. If your wife has an irregular menstrual cycle, she might not find out she's pregnant until weeks/months after conception. The meat of the discussion is how do you respond when you first receive notice of the situation. There are simply too many plausable "what-ifs" to peck in this format.

The point that I'm trying to make is if you're going to favor legislation that 100% abolishes the procedure, then you must weigh 100% of the conditions the procedure treats. If you're comfortable with 95% ban, 5% legal then I can respect that opinion.

If you want to stoke another multi-page abortion thread, then fire up a thread hashing out the (psuedo, ha-ha) importance of abortion in American law versus other topics with less emotion and more direct impact of daily life. (taxes, immigration, civil rights)
I understand well all the variables involved, but as I said, I do NOT support legislation for 100% removal of abortion, it would be too radical to even be voted in. Rather, I want to push for a part ban, a ban against convencience abortions. This would eliminate the VAST majority. Surely "mental health" would then be considered physical health and many would find their way out, but if the path was difficult to kill a child, that would be some MAJOR improvement. I want a 95% ban, and I hope I see it within my lifetime.
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Old January 11th, 2008, 10:07 PM   #343
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Friend, that is no flaw, if anyting you grant further support to what I am saying. If slaves can speak, and voice their concerns and fight for themselves, then how much more do the unborn need OUR voices for them, how much more do they need our FIGHT for them? They have no voice, which makes their case even more worth fightint for.
Wow, you do read everything with rose-colored glasses on. You can fight for them while I fight against you. By the way, my side is winning.:tonka:

Also, in all reality, slavery does exist. I have a few Mexicans that bust their asses for peanuts and will do about anything I want them to do. You should see my landscaping in the summer. Envy of the neighborhood.
The blacks picked cotton and tobacco. The Mexicans pick strawberries, apples, cumcumbers, etc.
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Old January 11th, 2008, 10:09 PM   #344
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Dave, do you only vote for people that are pro-life? Ever been to a pro-life rally? Picket outside an abortion clinic?
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Old January 11th, 2008, 10:23 PM   #345
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Dave, do you only vote for people that are pro-life? Ever been to a pro-life rally? Picket outside an abortion clinic?
no, but sounds like a good time. I pass those two places on 8 mile about every other day.

wanna check it out with me? p.s. why aren't you in friday night loser chat?
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Old January 12th, 2008, 12:45 AM   #346
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The fetus doesn't have any rights. Rights are what we want to hand out. This is why citizens of countries throughout the world have differing rights. The government decides when and how you get them. What about the right of an 18 year old to die for this country but he can't legally buy a beer. Who gave him these rights? The government. The government decides if the fetus has any rights. And I guess they agreed that the fetus has no right.
Yep. And I think that was Kerwins point of comparing abortion to slavery. At one point blacks were denied rights, and then society change it's mind and decided they should have the same rights as anyone else.

Right now the unborn do not have rights, but if Kerwin had his way they would be given rights.
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Old January 12th, 2008, 07:09 AM   #347
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Fair post, let me respond.

I will take your word on the difference, because I am not going to read half hour worth of data right now. But as I have said twice in this thread already, I would prefer to legislate against ANY part of abortion. There is a difference between how I would prefer laws to be put in place, and how I feel personally on this topic. I have never said that I want all abortions to stop, but I surely want the vast majority to.

I understand that all issues need to be discussed, but I also view it in as a categories of weighted factors. If 95% of pregnancies are normal, then 95% of time and 95% of decisions should be placed on them. Otherwise we are not focused on the actual issue here.

I am not opposed to a D&C (abortion) when the child is dead or dying or cannot live. But I would not personally abort unless the child was confirmed dead early on. If the child was dead, and it was late term, no way, I would want to bury my child.

Why is too much attention given to this? This is an issue of life and death. I don't think enough attention can come its way.

Does this answer your question?
Kerwin is a liberal. I on the other hand am a conservative. All and any abortion should be illegal, except for Oh theres nothing there! Todate I have not been convinced other wise. I have seen layperson opinions and opinions in articles by what is suppose to be educated people. But they are still opinions and like them I have one also. My opinion is driven by my religious convictions as well as science and the medical field. what I have found is the religious aspect has been more consistant. The medical field and science is influenced by government and money. And the government is influenced by special interest and money . And we all know polititions are sooooo trustworthy. So that makes me skeptical as to the true agenda of the medical and scientific community, not to mention if the truth is even allowed into the public.
Not an argument just an explanation on my opinion
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Old January 12th, 2008, 07:13 AM   #348
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no, but sounds like a good time. I pass those two places on 8 mile about every other day.

wanna check it out with me? p.s. why aren't you in friday night loser chat?
My first critiria in chosing a candidate is Pro Life.
I'm not allowed at Pro Life demonstrations they said I'm too conservative. I did offer to drive the bus.
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Old January 12th, 2008, 08:58 AM   #349
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I pity da foo who would not let Mr T drive the bus
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Old January 12th, 2008, 09:39 AM   #350
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I pity da foo who would not let Mr T drive the bus
I bet they would let him ride the short bus
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Old January 14th, 2008, 08:16 PM   #351
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Hey, I've driven the Short bus (or our equipment Hauler) and ours has some balls. It's not legally a School bus though. So....It's not realy the "short" bus.


And now....Back to the topic.
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Old January 15th, 2008, 06:23 AM   #352
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I bet they would let him ride the short bus
I bet they would let you ride the Short Bus. lol





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Old January 16th, 2008, 03:20 PM   #353
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Kerwin is a liberal. I on the other hand am a conservative. All and any abortion should be illegal, except for Oh theres nothing there! Todate I have not been convinced other wise. I have seen layperson opinions and opinions in articles by what is suppose to be educated people. But they are still opinions and like them I have one also. My opinion is driven by my religious convictions as well as science and the medical field. what I have found is the religious aspect has been more consistant. The medical field and science is influenced by government and money. And the government is influenced by special interest and money . And we all know polititions are sooooo trustworthy. So that makes me skeptical as to the true agenda of the medical and scientific community, not to mention if the truth is even allowed into the public.
Not an argument just an explanation on my opinion
Well if you're a republican then you're probably pro capital punishment then....? It's okay to kill in one case, but not another?

Probably support Bush's illegal war (occupation) where we are killing thousands of innocent people.

You may even be the type that boasts that he has a gun by the bed to kill some mf for breaking in to his house (does the punishment fit the crime?).

You're quite outspoken on this subject, but I wonder if your global view is in line with this issue.......
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Old January 16th, 2008, 03:23 PM   #354
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Kerwin is a liberal. I on the other hand am a conservative. All and any abortion should be illegal, except for Oh theres nothing there! Todate I have not been convinced other wise. I have seen layperson opinions and opinions in articles by what is suppose to be educated people. But they are still opinions and like them I have one also. My opinion is driven by my religious convictions as well as science and the medical field. what I have found is the religious aspect has been more consistant. The medical field and science is influenced by government and money. And the government is influenced by special interest and money . And we all know polititions are sooooo trustworthy. So that makes me skeptical as to the true agenda of the medical and scientific community, not to mention if the truth is even allowed into the public.
Not an argument just an explanation on my opinion
Religion is consitent? Shall I start listing the many biblical contradictions?

By the way, if Adam and Eve were the first 2 people, then they had kids, then their kids had kids and so on, aren't we then all products of incest? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
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Old January 16th, 2008, 04:02 PM   #355
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Well if you're a republican then you're probably pro capital punishment then....? It's okay to kill in one case, but not another?

Probably support Bush's illegal war (occupation) where we are killing thousands of innocent people.

You may even be the type that boasts that he has a gun by the bed to kill some mf for breaking in to his house (does the punishment fit the crime?).

You're quite outspoken on this subject, but I wonder if your global view is in line with this issue.......
Abortion and capital punishment are not the same thing. One is the killing of baby and the other is killing someone for a crime they committed.
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Old January 16th, 2008, 04:15 PM   #356
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Abortion and capital punishment are not the same thing. One is the killing of baby and the other is killing someone for a crime they committed.
Both are killing a human being. The 'why' doesn't change the 'what'. That's a terrible argument.
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Old January 16th, 2008, 04:16 PM   #357
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Abortion and capital punishment are not the same thing. One is the killing of baby and the other is killing someone for a crime they committed.
Besides, under the 'prolife' logic, there IS no curcumstance where abortion is permissible... So why the death penalty? No difference.
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Old January 16th, 2008, 05:00 PM   #358
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Well if you're a republican then you're probably pro capital punishment then....? It's okay to kill in one case, but not another?

Probably support Bush's illegal war (occupation) where we are killing thousands of innocent people.

You may even be the type that boasts that he has a gun by the bed to kill some mf for breaking in to his house (does the punishment fit the crime?).

You're quite outspoken on this subject, but I wonder if your global view is in line with this issue.......
Well Im not a republican.

Im not a big fan of the war in Iraq, especially after my brother got blown to shit by an IED.

I don't have a gun by my bed, but if the truth be known the first mf that has the balls to break into my house will go out in a body bag. I'll do it with my hands kinda up close and personal like. Weather the punishment fits the crime or not, you don't want to break into my house because you know the price. The question here is do you want to pay that price?

I dont think I'm outspoken its just my opinion












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Old January 16th, 2008, 05:10 PM   #359
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Religion is consitent? Shall I start listing the many biblical contradictions?

By the way, if Adam and Eve were the first 2 people, then they had kids, then their kids had kids and so on, aren't we then all products of incest? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
You could start a new thread on debating the bible. Im up for that one

You are assuming Adam and Eve where the only two people created by God.














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Old January 16th, 2008, 08:20 PM   #360
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Both are killing a human being. The 'why' doesn't change the 'what'. That's a terrible argument.
Please explain how it's a terrible arguement?

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Besides, under the 'prolife' logic, there IS no curcumstance where abortion is permissible... So why the death penalty? No difference.
There is a difference, one the person is innocent and the other the person committed a horrible crime and they deserve to be punished.
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