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Old October 8th, 2007, 11:26 AM   #21
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Someone once said that God explaining Himself to us would be like us trying to explain calculus to a third grader. When Job questenioned Him He never gave an answer, He gave Job a series of more questions. Read Job 42:1-6.
I think it is much worse to someone who even denies the exsistence of a Creator.
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Old October 8th, 2007, 01:25 PM   #22
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So logically speaking you can't prove or defend your logic so you won't openly talk about it? I don't see how your logic can work if you can't defend it or know how, why, or what your logic is based on?
Let me re-state what I have already said. I ASKED A QUESTION about logic. What part of that is unclear? What exact issue do you have with it? You are being rediculous, and your e-boner needs to stop pitching a tent.

How about you start a separate discussion about logic and faith, and I will be happy to discuss it, ON TOPIC, there.
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Old October 8th, 2007, 01:32 PM   #23
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Even though for us to say that it would be logical for a child to go to Heaven, does not mean God does.... and there really is no scriptures to prove or disprove what God finds logical.
I don't think God is in a position where he needs to prove anything to man. Why would a King go into a dissertation to the people of his kingdom about every decision he makes?

You did not respond to what I said, what are your thoughts?
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Old October 8th, 2007, 01:54 PM   #24
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Im not sure I have a clear view on this as I have what I believe would and should happen, however I have no scriptures that would support what I think should happen.

With the work that I do and have done, one thing I have learned is never to assume anything, always have something backing you to support your findings and/or beliefs. In this instance I have beliefs with nothing that supports them. This is why the question was posed as you are far more familiar with the Bible and Christianity than I am.
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Old October 8th, 2007, 02:05 PM   #25
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Where's Jesus when you need him?
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Old October 8th, 2007, 02:07 PM   #26
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The Bible DOES speak on salvation Bill, and that part you know. There is no other name under heaven, given to men, by which we can be saved. The final answer is that we DON'T know if God treats children differently. We can assume that he does not for those who make concious decisions, to accept or deny Jesus as savior. But for those children who die, for example, in the womb, we can imagine God being consistant with his own nature. Remember, we are dealing with God who forgives us despite ourselves. What then would he do with an innocent child who never even had the chance to screw up? I think it is safe to say he is merciful in that circumstance.
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Old October 8th, 2007, 02:49 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Article I quoted
The Biblical age of accountability is CONCEPTION.
I was not referring to unborn children...

did you read the article I quoted?
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Old October 8th, 2007, 03:31 PM   #28
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If you are talking about the uber long one, no. Need cliff notes. Can't stare at the screen that long!

There is no such thing in the Bible about age of accountability. What we DO know is the qualification to salvation (ie, faith alone in Christ alone). So you have your answer, but I think your issue is what it may imply.

What I challenge you to do is to explore the scriptures to understand God's character, and how he treats mankind. As I mentioned, he is already unfair to you and I (but in our favor). Why does God command us to care for the needy, the widows, the orphans? Why did Jesus rebuke his disciples for not allowing the children to come to him?
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Old October 8th, 2007, 03:45 PM   #29
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I must say I have really enjoyed this topic, even though I am not as one might call a "religous person".

I do have a question .... Which GOD is the correct GOD?

Everyone has the right to believe in a god, no matter which that might be.
Here is a list of the worlds religions and approx. number of followers. Just thought I would share an incredible fact with everyone. (http://www.adherents.com/Religions_By_Adherents.html)

Christianity: 2.1 billion

Islam: 1.5 billion

Secular/Nonreligious/Agnostic/Atheist: 1.1 billion

Hinduism: 900 million

Chinese traditional religion: 394 million

Buddhism: 376 million

primal-indigenous: 300 million

African Traditional & Diasporic: 100 million

Sikhism: 23 million

Juche: 19 million

Spiritism: 15 million

Judaism: 14 million

Baha'i: 7 million

Jainism: 4.2 million

Shinto: 4 million

Cao Dai: 4 million

Zoroastrianism: 2.6 million

Tenrikyo: 2 million

Neo-Paganism: 1 million

Unitarian-Universalism: 800 thousand

Rastafarianism: 600 thousand

Scientology: 500 thousand

So my thought is how many of these religous believers are going to be shocked when they finally get to heaven and the old man standing there with the "Who Farted" hat on says "Ya'll come on in", but in hebrew?
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Old October 8th, 2007, 03:47 PM   #30
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Bossman, look at the claims of all the religions, then look at what was done to back them up. You will end up finding very few that are even worthy of consideration. Then you will find one that stands tall with the answers to life.
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Old October 8th, 2007, 03:54 PM   #31
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What I challenge you to do is to explore the scriptures to understand God's character, and how he treats mankind.
5] And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

[6] And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

[7] And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

You cannot tell me that everyone but Noah was worth saving in the eyes of a human.
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Old October 8th, 2007, 04:02 PM   #32
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5] And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

[6] And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

[7] And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

You cannot tell me that everyone but Noah was worth saving in the eyes of a human.
This has already been done, and God has said it will never happen again, did you miss that part? Do you know that is what a rainbow ACTUALLY means?
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Old October 8th, 2007, 04:07 PM   #33
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Buddhism: 376 million
Remember, Buddha was not, is not, nor will ever be a God; he was a person to reach full enlightenment and find nirvana.

Buddha was a guide and a teacher, like Jesus was, but non-theistic.
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Old October 8th, 2007, 04:33 PM   #34
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Remember, Buddha was not, is not, nor will ever be a God; he was a person to reach full enlightenment and find nirvana.

Buddha was a guide and a teacher, like Jesus was, but non-theistic.
And those who are buddhist don't worship Buddha, so they are following their own way, which is the humanist approach. Not so much a religion as it is a thought on living life. Somewhat atheistic, correct?

Sorry, back on topic.
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Old October 8th, 2007, 06:44 PM   #35
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And those who are buddhist don't worship Buddha, so they are following their own way, which is the humanist approach. Not so much a religion as it is a thought on living life. Somewhat atheistic, correct?
By definition, yes. I like to take responsibility for my actions and try my best to be a good person. No carrot on a string for me (heaven) or horrible motivator (hell), just me trying to treat others as I wish to be treated.
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Old October 8th, 2007, 07:25 PM   #36
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By definition, yes. I like to take responsibility for my actions and try my best to be a good person. No carrot on a string for me (heaven) or horrible motivator (hell), just me trying to treat others as I wish to be treated.
gotta love that golden rule. it's served me well.
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Old October 8th, 2007, 07:34 PM   #37
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gotta love that golden rule. it's served me well.
Which one? "Do unto others", or "Be nice or burn in hell"? :tonka:
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Old October 8th, 2007, 07:35 PM   #38
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the former
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Old October 8th, 2007, 07:43 PM   #39
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Which one? "Do unto others", or "Be nice or burn in hell"? :tonka:
Scot, your understanding of the message of Christ is skewed, as is most people I talk to. I don't mean this as an insult as you are an educated man, but most think that Christ offers some form of a performance based salvation. THE OPPOSITE is true. To gain eternal life, it is by faith. God does not measure us up, and toss us into hell if we were 51% bad and 49% good. Again, God's gift of eternal life is NOT performance based. If we walked four old ladies across the street when we really should have walked 6, that does nto disqualify or remove our position as sons of God. You see, when we put our faith in Christ, we become a part of God's family, through adoption. We did not belong to him, but he forgives our sins (by faith in Christ) and adopts us as his own. He becomes our Father, and noting can then separate us from the love of God. My motivation in following Christ is not to gain heaven, because I have already received an eternal inheritance. My motivation now is out of love for Christ. Why do you do nice things for your wife, because otherwise she will divorce you, or because you love her? I propose the later is true. I know that if I prepare a hot cup of java in the morning for my wife, she feels very loved. Because I love her, I do that for her, not because I think she will drop me if I don't. Likewise, service in the Kingdom of God is based out of relationship with the almighty, I have been forgiven much, so I love much. Jesus said "If you love me, you will obey my commands." My love for Jesus allows me to do nothing else but to serve him, follow his commands, love his people, and so on. Anyone who's live has been touched by the love of God feels the same way. God accepting me was never based on performance, I am still a screw up, yet he takes me as his son regardless. How great is the love of God!
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Old October 9th, 2007, 06:32 AM   #40
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Dave, I think I have a handle on the faith based reward system - that has always been and may well always be the limiting factor for me; Faith.
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