Doa 2007 - Page 3 - Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest

Go Back   Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > The Pub
GL4x4 Live! GL4x4 Casino

The Pub A friendly forum where everybody is nice, and will answer any questions you have about life.

greatlakes4x4.com is the premier Great Lakes 4x4 Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Search
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old May 21st, 2007, 09:50 AM   #41
Grandman
do i look old !
 
Grandman's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: West Branch Mi
Posts: 9,864
iTrader: (7)
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Default

I give up , As Bryce pointed out about some one else . Im just to sensitive as well .
Grandman is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old May 21st, 2007, 09:52 AM   #42
clarkstoncracker
lol
 
clarkstoncracker's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-03-05
Location: OC - MI
Posts: 42,566
iTrader: (40)
Mentioned: 122 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to clarkstoncracker
Default

My thoughts on the subject, There are three "groups" of wheelers who are active in Michigan and go online. Some are a member of two groups, some a member of all three. It is fine when your shooting the shit or giving tech advice to have three different sources, or websites to work with.

But if you're fighting something thats important to EVERYONE in the sport, something on a state level, including keeping trails open, teaching people about laws, etc, it is very very important to have a very united front.

IMO, if you have 1000 people each year helping clean the trails, it is probably in our best interest to have 1000 people flying the same flag, as that will have more pull with gov't/dnr. There is nothing wrong with 10 groups of 100 people, but strength comes in numbers...
__________________

Last edited by clarkstoncracker; May 21st, 2007 at 10:09 AM.
clarkstoncracker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 09:53 AM   #43
One Arm Steve
I was born in the desert
 
One Arm Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-20-05
Location: Harrison
Posts: 1,719
iTrader: (4)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

More people= problems all around, look at the world today. If people could just get along and treat each other like we want to be treated ourselves then the world would be a better place. But that will never happen. This is why I am not affiliated with any organization and have no stickers on my heap. I wheel alone 99.9% of the time. Arguing and discussing things over and over it a turn off to me. I do my part by cleaning the trails from the litter bugs and slobs who roam the forests. I would like to do more but I'm not interested in long winded speeches and talking about shit. I'm an Action Man.
One Arm Steve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:05 AM   #44
whiterhino
I'm not old, honest...
 
whiterhino's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-07-06
Location: Davisburg MI
Posts: 21,466
iTrader: (21)
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Default

Thanks Miffy!

Marv, you have some good points that I agree with and disagree with. You and I have talked in the past and wheeled together. I am pretty confident that I have not made you feel unwelcome.

I know I have put the pressure back on you when you have offered advice so it is me that you are talking about. No offense or defensivness here. But the issue that is tough is when a suggestion is made, it may be a GREAT suggestion. The problem is resources. I know you have pushed the legislative advocate issue. One problem is the funding. Another is how to go about it. Where do we start? Who do we contact? So, my reply has been to say "why don't YOU do it?". Maybe my reply has been too strong and I really should be saying "how do you suggest we do it?" or "Do you know anyone who could help with this?" or "Is there anyone you can contact for us?"

Regarding attending non GLFWDA events: Totally on a personal note, it has never met my schedule. As I told you in a PM, we always travel with our dog and for GOOD REASONS you are not allowing dogs at the spring fling. In addition, this year my driveway, seawall and yard are tore up and I have lots of stuff to do at home so the motorhome is in storage at the moment. The pig gig has always been a timing conflict because I always go to Canada for Labor Day and I find it too close on the calendar.

Like you, I am older than most (many on the forum are the same age as my kids) and maybe I am not real good at coming across as something other than "DAD".

CC is 1000% right. We need one united front. People get pissed at someone for one reason or another and it ends up being the dominant factor. We can't lose sight of the big picture.
whiterhino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:06 AM   #45
Stan
I got a gold chain
 
Stan's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-04-05
Location: Shelby Twp.
Posts: 15,712
iTrader: (8)
Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by One Arm Steve View Post
More people= problems all around, look at the world today. If people could just get along and treat each other like we want to be treated ourselves then the world would be a better place. But that will never happen. This is why I am not affiliated with any organization and have no stickers on my heap. I wheel alone 99.9% of the time. Arguing and discussing things over and over it a turn off to me. I do my part by cleaning the trails from the litter bugs and slobs who roam the forests. I would like to do more but I'm not interested in long winded speeches and talking about shit. I'm an Action Man.
Stan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:14 AM   #46
Grandman
do i look old !
 
Grandman's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: West Branch Mi
Posts: 9,864
iTrader: (7)
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Default

Whiterhino , Jim there was no direct pointing at you intended . As you stated we have wheeled together and i think your one of the best heads in GL ( of those i know personally ) You also are very good at making folks feel wellcome but the group as a whole has lacked on that . Not every thing i typed was my thoughts but things that have been mentioned to me in regards to GLFWDA .

Honestly if i had the knowledge to go at the legislative branch with these issues id be gald to step up . Thats just my oppinion on what will work and merly a suggestion .

I watched this in the towing industrie and it had huge impact but as stated by you it all so took some big coin to do .

I have no intention of bad mouthing GLFWDA in this thread . Im offering up things i have felt and or heard others state that could be worth listening to for the benefit of the organization .
Grandman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:15 AM   #47
whiterhino
I'm not old, honest...
 
whiterhino's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-07-06
Location: Davisburg MI
Posts: 21,466
iTrader: (21)
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkstoncracker View Post
hahahahahha

damnit.

I've done that about 40 times...

Sorry whiterhino, feel free to hit me with a trout.

I was afraid to ask. I just drove by there yesterday and I have been racking my brain trying to remember an Applebees.
whiterhino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:20 AM   #48
One Arm Steve
I was born in the desert
 
One Arm Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-20-05
Location: Harrison
Posts: 1,719
iTrader: (4)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan View Post

One Arm Steve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:26 AM   #49
Lothos
KD8GKB
 
Lothos's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-17-05
Location: .5 past lightspeed
Posts: 6,506
iTrader: (3)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Send a message via ICQ to Lothos Send a message via AIM to Lothos Send a message via Yahoo to Lothos
Default

FWIW, I don't want it to appear or sound like I'm badmouthing GLFWDA. I am merely pointing out an issue I have had and many others with it at large. The other problem people have in general is "what can/will/does GLFWDA do for me/us?". I for one know many of the things done and attempted to be done, but as has been said before it takes $$$ and numbers which we lack alot of both.

Honestly, given the numbers in GL and the current state situation there's really only two positions an association can take right now. You either drop everything but the legislature battles or you drop the legislature battles and try and focus on events to draw more members. The problem with the event approach lately had/has been the support for events for a primarily club run event from non-club members. Forgive me if I lack the proper words, but events that were GLFWDA events were for the most part simply a particular clubs events that had GL's name plugged on. From that standpoint it is more like just individual events without a feel of belonging to the association. A presence if you will. For example, Snoblind in the past when it was a GL sponsored event never had a feeling that there was a GL presence. Anyway, if you can follow my thoughts ( even I am a bit puzzled by them ) you can understand the present state.
Lothos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:45 AM   #50
Miffy
Senior Member
 
Miffy's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: My home
Posts: 5,826
iTrader: (0)
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Send a message via Yahoo to Miffy
Default

Just recived a UFWDA Book in the mail. (United Four Wheel Drive Ass. for anyone that did not know) These seem to be the people that we all should be working with to join together across the country. They seem to be getting the numbers and the $$. Each Group, Club, Ass. has it place in Building the Bridges and Opening the Gates Across the country so we can all enjoy our Sport. There should not be compitions between each of these or the per-say power strugles.
Miffy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:48 AM   #51
kickstand
sHaMoNe!
 
kickstand's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-20-06
Location: fenton
Posts: 31,208
iTrader: (46)
Mentioned: 32 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miffy View Post
Just recived a UFWDA Book in the mail. (United Four Wheel Drive Ass. for anyone that did not know) These seem to be the people that we all should be working with to join together across the country. They seem to be getting the numbers and the $$. Each Group, Club, Ass. has it place in Building the Bridges and Opening the Gates Across the country so we can all enjoy our Sport. There should not be compitions between each of these or the per-say power strugles.

I always looked at the GLFWDA as being a sub category of the UFWDA?

I think something that may help the GLFWDA is to have only individual memberships instead of club memberships......
kickstand is online now   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:49 AM   #52
whiterhino
I'm not old, honest...
 
whiterhino's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-07-06
Location: Davisburg MI
Posts: 21,466
iTrader: (21)
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandman View Post
Whiterhino , Jim there was no direct pointing at you intended . As you stated we have wheeled together and i think your one of the best heads in GL ( of those i know personally ) You also are very good at making folks feel wellcome but the group as a whole has lacked on that . Not every thing i typed was my thoughts but things that have been mentioned to me in regards to GLFWDA .

Honestly if i had the knowledge to go at the legislative branch with these issues id be gald to step up . Thats just my oppinion on what will work and merly a suggestion .

I watched this in the towing industrie and it had huge impact but as stated by you it all so took some big coin to do .

I have no intention of bad mouthing GLFWDA in this thread . Im offering up things i have felt and or heard others state that could be worth listening to for the benefit of the organization .

No offense taken. I realized that I had been the one talking to you about this and didn't want any other confusion.

So Marv, what about that big retirement fund from selling the towing business? Just kiddin of course!
whiterhino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:51 AM   #53
Miffy
Senior Member
 
Miffy's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: My home
Posts: 5,826
iTrader: (0)
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Send a message via Yahoo to Miffy
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UP_ROKTOY View Post
I always looked at the GLFWDA as being a sub category of the UFWDA?

I think something that may help the GLFWDA is to have only individual memberships instead of club memberships......
I would agree. it seems to be when the clubs join as a group there are too many Chief's and not enough indians.
Miffy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:52 AM   #54
whiterhino
I'm not old, honest...
 
whiterhino's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-07-06
Location: Davisburg MI
Posts: 21,466
iTrader: (21)
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UP_ROKTOY View Post
I always looked at the GLFWDA as being a sub category of the UFWDA?

I think something that may help the GLFWDA is to have only individual memberships instead of club memberships......
Yes, GL is part of united. In fact, part of the founding group.

GLFWDA has had individual membership voting for over a year now. It is no longer a club based organization.

You show up.......... you vote. Simple as that.

As a side note, UFWDA is headed the same direction right now.
whiterhino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:56 AM   #55
kickstand
sHaMoNe!
 
kickstand's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-20-06
Location: fenton
Posts: 31,208
iTrader: (46)
Mentioned: 32 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
Yes, GL is part of united. In fact, part of the founding group.

GLFWDA has had individual membership voting for over a year now. It is no longer a club based organization.

You show up.......... you vote. Simple as that.

As a side note, UFWDA is headed the same direction right now.
As you know I haven't been involved or a member of GLFWDA since 2002-2003. That is good to hear.
kickstand is online now   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 10:57 AM   #56
clarkstoncracker
lol
 
clarkstoncracker's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-03-05
Location: OC - MI
Posts: 42,566
iTrader: (40)
Mentioned: 122 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to clarkstoncracker
Default

Sounds like GLFWDA has changed a lot in the recent future, and all for the good.

Maybe someone needs to make a post about certain things like personal voting.. I believe it used to be club voting only.
__________________
clarkstoncracker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 11:07 AM   #57
Timmy
Senior Member
 
Timmy's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-04-06
Location: Oxtucky
Posts: 968
iTrader: (5)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
Yes, GL is part of united. In fact, part of the founding group.

GLFWDA has had individual membership voting for over a year now. It is no longer a club based organization.

You show up.......... you vote. Simple as that.

As a side note, UFWDA is headed the same direction right now.
Jim are you saying in the way of voteing?
Timmy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 11:09 AM   #58
Brian81CJ
Sellin' it all!
 
Brian81CJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-07-05
Location: Allen Park
Posts: 573
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan View Post

Like I said, you have a large untapped resorce here, us it.
Of course your going to find alot of younger members here and some old, that wont give a damn what your trying to do. But what do you have to lose.
I'm sure GLFWDA would love to tap the resource here, BUT, every time a thread involving GLFWDA is posted there is constant criticism! I realize that some of it is constructive criticism but come on... it's getting old! If anyone thinks they can do better... join up and show us!
Brian81CJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 11:11 AM   #59
SKIP
Past Pres. GLFWDA
 
SKIP's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-19-05
Location: Rochester Hills
Posts: 113
iTrader: (0)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Exclamation Why?

There is an immense irony in that people don't care about what GLFWDA did in the past for the sport, but only focus on issues that were real/exagerated/misconstrued/retold 5 different ways in the past.
It is utterly amazing the bickering & personality conflicts I have to deal with inside & outside the organization. Conflicts that have nothing to do with the sport but focus on peoples feelings.

Doesn't anyone notice that we/you changed the organization so that all members have a say in what goes on? Over half the board is independent members! With all the changes we made people still keep going back to the old complaints.

GLFWDA has been structured to be controlled by the majority of membership.
It is not run with this tight fist by a group of 3 people.

I have done my best to listen to new/old ideas, & all I ever asked is please think out what your asking & give the pros/cons to help with the idea.

I am not an outspoken loud person. I try not to speak of the cuff without verifying what I may say is true. What good do I do if nobody believes what I say? Kitson usual hits most things on the head, he may rub some people the wrong way, but he is an individual in GLFWDA who cares & wants to see our sport continue.

GLFWDA is not a clique!!!!!!!
It is an Association!!!!!!!
Not everyone has to get along like you would in a club. This is about the sport.

If you want to see the Association change or do something different then join & put your $.02 in. Look at all the good we are trying to do & realize that not everything is about you, directed at you, meant to belittle you, meant to make you feel small.

Every quarterly I ask the people in attendance what they want from me as President. Usually I get nothing. This time I had Joe hand out index cards for people to fill out & got 5 back. Feedback is important! Contructive feedback with well thought out suggestions is even better!

That's it, lunch is over & I haven't even eaten anything yet...
SKIP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 11:12 AM   #60
clarkstoncracker
lol
 
clarkstoncracker's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-03-05
Location: OC - MI
Posts: 42,566
iTrader: (40)
Mentioned: 122 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to clarkstoncracker
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateAir View Post
I'm sure GLFWDA would love to tap the resource here, BUT, every time a thread involving GLFWDA is posted there is constant criticism! I realize that some of it is constructive criticism but come on... it's getting old! If anyone thinks they can do better... join up and show us!
http://www.greatlakes4x4.com/showthread.php?t=46467
http://www.greatlakes4x4.com/showthread.php?t=44919
http://www.greatlakes4x4.com/showthread.php?t=38660

Those three threads have over 10,000 views between them, all deal with GLFWDA and not one thread has a negative post about them.

__________________
clarkstoncracker is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > The Pub

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:34 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright 2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd. Runs best on HiVelocity Hosting.
Page generated in 0.43785 seconds with 81 queries