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Old May 17th, 2007, 10:22 PM   #61
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Scrambler the less educated line was uncalled for

Although you seem to know alot about oil companies I think that G unit has some valid points.

If the oil companies really wanted to they don't have to make multi billions from us at a time when there is alot of other economic hardship going around.

They are gouging as are many gas stations. What prevents them from doing so ...Granholms idle threats? .why else would there be such a wide range of prices in the same small areas and huge jumps overnight. Within many cities you see 10-30 cent price differences they are all required to buy the same special environmental blends right?

At least we can all agree that it was the unions fault right )
You mean like Walmart diesel for $2.77 and the BP 1/4 mile away was $3.30 today ? Simple economics , no gouging envolved
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Old May 18th, 2007, 06:24 AM   #62
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Im sure you will . If it makes you feel any better i finished law school with a 3.89 gpa . But we learned the word " humble " some where along the way .

Arrogance was thought to be distasteful .
Finished or graduated? What law school?

I get a little testy when people that have little knowledge or experience of things that I do on a daily basis insist that they know more than I do. I would never dream of questioning you on how to hook up a semi truck recovery operation. I could make a go of it, but I guarantee I would be wrong. You misread my temper for arrogance.
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Old May 18th, 2007, 06:43 AM   #63
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If the oil companies really wanted to they don't have to make multi billions from us at a time when there is alot of other economic hardship going around.

They are gouging as are many gas stations. What prevents them from doing so ...Granholms idle threats? .why else would there be such a wide range of prices in the same small areas and huge jumps overnight. Within many cities you see 10-30 cent price differences they are all required to buy the same special environmental blends right?

At least we can all agree that it was the unions fault right )
Oil companies are FOR PROFIT. They are not in business to subsidize their customers. They are in business to make money. People have already forgotten the 1980's when oil businesses were crumbling and going out of business right and left. It's a business cycle. The 80's was the bottom. It turned around (not without billions in government assistance unfortunately) and now they have returned to making money. I don't remember any people saying poor SOHIO. They are suffering from "economic hardship", let's give them a few extra dollars to help them out. But, you expect them to subsidize your gasoline consumption because the MI economy is floundering? It wouldn't do any good. People would not pocket the savings. They would just drive more. I want oil companies to make large profits. If they don't, they have no way of investing in R&D or exploration, or they start laying of tens of thousands of employees, further crushing our crappy state economy.

It seems very easy to compare retail prices at gas stations in the same area. It isn't. Gas station owners don't all pay the same prices for their supply. There are long-term contracts, short-term contracts, and spot prices. Long-term is usually anything over a year in length. Short-term is for 2-12 months. Spot prices are basically what you pay if you just call up a supplier and say send me 10,000 gallons of 87 tomorrow. So, that station down the street may have signed a 5-year supply deal with a supplier for $1.85. The next station over may have only signed a 1-year contract at $2.00, while the station across town may have decided to play the spot market and didn't sign any long-term or short-term contracts and are paying the current wholesale price of say $2.30/gallon. It isn't a simple apples to apples comparison. These contracts are what I do on a daily basis. It is my job to research the forward/futures markets to decide what is the best mix of long, short, and spot term deals to best optimize our sales. I'm dealing in electricity, but it's the same thing. Just a different energy commodity.

You also have the issue of locally owned, corporate oil owned, or large string of stations owned by the same company. A local independent can raise or lower prices at will. Corporate stations are normally told when to raise and lower prices. Speedway stores are told by a corporate office what prices to charge and when to change them. Some stations react very quickly to changes in the wholesale market. Others only change on certain days of the week.

You see, it isn't just a simple analysis. There are soooo many details and contributing factors that affect prices at the pump. But, unless you deal with this stuff on a daily basis, it is difficult to grasp the underlying issues. So, in a nutshell, blanket statements such as have been repeated over and over in this thread are just indications that the person that said them really has no concept of how the system works. That's fine because very few people do. Had I not been involved in trading energy and moving electricity all over the country, I wouldn't understand it very well either.
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Old May 18th, 2007, 07:13 AM   #64
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You know too much go away we like our answers simpler :)



really thanks for the long read it was actually quite interesting.
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Old May 18th, 2007, 07:15 AM   #65
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:tonka:
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Old May 18th, 2007, 10:43 AM   #66
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My fuel bill has went from $50-75 every 2 weeks to $200+/2 weeks, no offense but that is bullshit. And that includes me not driving around town anymore, I use a moped with a milk crate on the back now and just take the ribbing I get from friends and family. My round trip commute is 62 miles in a company vehicle I am required to drive and put fuel in. Not everyone makes 50k+ a year and that isn't even much. When you make less then that it really hurts. Honestly I don't know how the people with lower wage jobs are even getting to work right now without MI having public transportation. People can only cut out so much. I don't want to hear any comparisons to Europe either... they pay higher taxes on the fuel, but have less taxes on other things, not to mention they have better public transportation, and get all the cool fuel efficient cars... it's NOT apples to apples.


I guess the only thing to come of it, was the owner of the company I work for was riding with me and complaining about gas prices, so much he has parked his Escalade and started driving a Saturn, So I told him my fuel bill in their truck... he he said we are going to get some more fuel efficient cars :tonka:

It's not living beyond your means, it's just trying to make a living...


Edit: I should just put I agree with UP_RokTOY lol its the F-in random jumps I cannot plan for that get me.
Gas has gone up around a dollar since winter so.....

@ ~$2.25 a gallon you were spending $50-75 every two weeks
@ ~3.25 a gallon you are spending $200 every two weeks

75/2.25=33.1.3 gallons
200/3.25=61.5 gallons

Maybe you were spending $75 every week and now your spending $100 dollars a week. That math would almost work if you rounded off the numbers.

Why do you commute 62 miles when you can't afford gas?
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Old May 18th, 2007, 10:45 AM   #67
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The important thing is we all agree on one thing..

THIS IS HORSE SHIT !
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Old May 18th, 2007, 11:06 AM   #68
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The important thing is we all agree on one thing..

THIS IS HORSE SHIT !
You know nothing about farming do you , its cow shit
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Old May 18th, 2007, 11:12 AM   #69
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84Scramler, thanks for the good read.

What kills me about the comments about how much it costs now, compared to how much it cost during the winter is this; every year it does the same fukking thing. It goes up in the spring stays there for a bit and then goes back down. Last year it was actually below $2 in some places. When was the last time gas was that low? People kill me with their whining about it every time it jumps up. They cry the usual cry; "it's 3.50, it will be 4.00 this summer". Seems they forgot the last time gas prices went up.......and then went back down.
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Old May 18th, 2007, 11:14 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by 3-foot View Post
Gas has gone up around a dollar since winter so.....

@ ~$2.25 a gallon you were spending $50-75 every two weeks
@ ~3.25 a gallon you are spending $200 every two weeks

75/2.25=33.1.3 gallons
200/3.25=61.5 gallons

Maybe you were spending $75 every week and now your spending $100 dollars a week. That math would almost work if you rounded off the numbers.

Why do you commute 62 miles when you can't afford gas?
I also think you missed the post about my boss issuing me a truck that gets half the mileage of my commuter car I used to use

Try to sell a house in Michigan lately Besides 62 miles a day is hardly anything... 30 mins each way, that is better then most people.

Last edited by jeepfreak81; May 18th, 2007 at 11:51 AM.
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Old May 18th, 2007, 11:18 AM   #71
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What the gas stations need to do is.......

Once they buy the fuel and put it in the tanks, underground...... They shouldn't be able to raise the prices until the tank hits 10% capacity...... Once the fuel truck comes out to refill the tank...... they can re price the fuel prices.

That's the way it used to be here in Michigan!
I think you should stick to riding bikes, and not participating in any form of management of any type of sales.

That is the most insane thing I have ever read about gas stations.

Who is going to enforce this law? Did you know every gas tank in the ground has 2-5% water? I've seen some instances of 10% water. (this is why you NEVER fill up if you see a tanker dropping fuel)
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Old May 18th, 2007, 12:11 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by KartRacer View Post
84Scramler, thanks for the good read.

What kills me about the comments about how much it costs now, compared to how much it cost during the winter is this; every year it does the same fukking thing. It goes up in the spring stays there for a bit and then goes back down. Last year it was actually below $2 in some places. When was the last time gas was that low? People kill me with their whining about it every time it jumps up. They cry the usual cry; "it's 3.50, it will be 4.00 this summer". Seems they forgot the last time gas prices went up.......and then went back down.
Once the refineries catch up from the summer blend switch, prices will drop. Oil companies have legions of people that calculate supply and demand issues. If the price didn't go up when supplies go down, we would run out of gas at the pump. The price increase is calculated to reduce demand enough that the supply is adequate. It's a price signal to the market.

Now, for long term relief from supply shortfalls, we either need to can these summer blends, or allow new refineries to be built. Summer fuel blends forced the Alma refinery to close. As I understand it, there was no way to update the plant to produce fuel that met the new standards. Not sure if it was a physical engineering or financial constraint though that did them in ultimately. Probably some of both.
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Old May 19th, 2007, 07:06 AM   #73
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Originally Posted by jeepfreak81 View Post
My fuel bill has went from $50-75 every 2 weeks to $200+/2 weeks, no offense but that is bullshit. And that includes me not driving around town anymore, I use a moped with a milk crate on the back now and just take the ribbing I get from friends and family. My round trip commute is 62 miles in a company vehicle I am required to drive and put fuel in. Not everyone makes 50k+ a year and that isn't even much. When you make less then that it really hurts. Honestly I don't know how the people with lower wage jobs are even getting to work right now without MI having public transportation. People can only cut out so much. I don't want to hear any comparisons to Europe either... they pay higher taxes on the fuel, but have less taxes on other things, not to mention they have better public transportation, and get all the cool fuel efficient cars... it's NOT apples to apples.


I guess the only thing to come of it, was the owner of the company I work for was riding with me and complaining about gas prices, so much he has parked his Escalade and started driving a Saturn, So I told him my fuel bill in their truck... he he said we are going to get some more fuel efficient cars :tonka:

It's not living beyond your means, it's just trying to make a living...


Edit: I should just put I agree with UP_RokTOY lol its the F-in random jumps I cannot plan for that get me.
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Originally Posted by jeepfreak81 View Post
I also think you missed the post about my boss issuing me a truck that gets half the mileage of my commuter car I used to use
Where did you say this? Here's what I read....

"My round trip commute is 62 miles in a company vehicle I am required to drive and put fuel in."

It says nothing about half the mileage that you were getting or any commuter car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepfreak81 View Post
Try to sell a house in Michigan lately Besides 62 miles a day is hardly anything... 30 mins each way, that is better then most people.

If 62 miles isn't that far, then why are you complaining about paying for the gas it takes to drive it?

Have a and relax, summer prices will end in a few months.
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Old May 19th, 2007, 07:41 AM   #74
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i showed them no gas in the jeep in 6 weeks and counting
mostly cause its in a million pieces right now
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Old May 19th, 2007, 10:50 AM   #75
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G-Man... You never said what law school you attended and if you actually graduated or just "finished". :tonka:
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Old May 19th, 2007, 11:06 AM   #76
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G-Man... You never said what law school you attended and if you actually graduated or just "finished". :tonka:
I graduated , spent 3 years in law enforcement . Hated pretty much every segment of law from the street to the court house . Had no interest in being an attorney and went into business .

Now go keep the lights on as you said you would .
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Old May 19th, 2007, 11:19 AM   #77
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Wasn't it like 6 months or so ago that the prices dropped to 1.99 a gallon? I'm pretty sure it was winter WTF with demand higher for oil in the winter why are the prices going up in the summer? If they keep climbing the my shits not leaving the garage this year. It takes over 45.00 to fill the tank and that only gets me 230 miles or so down the road. The only way I see around spending 300.00 or more a month in gas to travel to Grayling every other week is to keep the rig up there and get me a hybrid that gets 50 or 60 miles to the gallon to drive back and forth. Probably a good idea it would save a lot of wear and tear on the Jeep. I feel for the people on the west cost where the gas is well over 4.00 a gallon (pretty sure).
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Old May 19th, 2007, 11:27 AM   #78
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I graduated , spent 3 years in law enforcement . Hated pretty much every segment of law from the street to the court house . Had no interest in being an attorney and went into business .

Now go keep the lights on as you said you would .
What law school? :tonka:
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Old May 19th, 2007, 11:39 AM   #79
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What law school? :tonka:
In need of a history lesson today ?

Its ancient history and frankly none of your business .

I did not attend Harvard if that helps you any .
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Old May 19th, 2007, 01:04 PM   #80
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Seriously??? I would have never guessed.

I love your old and wise routine even though you are barely 20 years older than I am. :tonka:
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