traction bar 101 - Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest

Go Back   Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > 4x4 Talk > General Tech
GL4x4 Live! GL4x4 Casino

greatlakes4x4.com is the premier Great Lakes 4x4 Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Search
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old January 14th, 2006, 09:23 AM   #1
Bones
skillicous
 
Bones's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Dearborn Heights, MI
Posts: 11,501
iTrader: (37)
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to Bones
Default traction bar 101

I have been reading POR about traction bars/ladder bars for a long time. About every year a new idea comes across. Here are links to different ideas.

This first one is the tried and true single ladder bar mounted a shackle.... looks like this





link 1 http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...=anti-wrap+bar

cliff notes are the link bar should be close to the same angle as your driveshaft. Only one bar is needed. Closer to center is ideal. Once you move away from center, there is a chance of limiting travel or "cork-screwing" your axle". Shackle can be mounted pointing up or down.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
The next desing is somewhat considered new school, but some people say they ahve been doing ti for years. This one still has doubts in my mind.

Basically is mounts a hard bar on your spring U-bolt pad, and another end on the frame inline with your leave spring. Both ends are bushings, but fixed mounted (unlike the shackle system above). Most eveyone run it with a hard bar, but some run it with a chain or cable setting.

looks like this


Everyone claims it will limit travel (me included), but the people who have done it swear by it (including the imfamous Chris Durham.

here is the cable version



Here is antoher person's setup


and his proof that is doesn't limit travel


link 1 (doesn't get good to page 3) http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...=anti-wrap+bar

I'll add more links as I find them.
__________________
Inviscid Motorsports

Special Thanks and Recommendations to;
Motorcity Machines
Ironman Offroad
Branik Motorsports
Maxxis Tires

Raceline Wheels
PAC Racing Springs
Joint Clutch and Gear

Last edited by Bones; January 14th, 2006 at 10:32 AM.
Bones is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old January 14th, 2006, 06:55 PM   #2
Monkeyevil
I <3 Miatas
 
Monkeyevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Posts: 8,987
iTrader: (16)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to Monkeyevil
Default

The first is the only way to do it.

Any single bar setup (like #2 or the Bambar) force the spring itself to be the lower link of the traction bar. While those methods may LIMIT axle wrap, they won't remove it... and they put different stresses on the springs.

The ladder bar on my YJ does not limit flex, and does not allow any wrap or wheel hop whatsoever.... you will also notice that it's super easy to burn the rear tires after the install.....
__________________
JcrOffroad
Zoom Zoom!
Monkeyevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 16th, 2006, 03:12 PM   #3
shawn
Resident HVAC/R Jambi
 
shawn's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Milford/Commerce
Posts: 10,110
iTrader: (24)
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Send a message via Yahoo to shawn
Default

Darryl, does JCR make ladder bars?
shawn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 16th, 2006, 08:56 PM   #4
Monkeyevil
I <3 Miatas
 
Monkeyevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Posts: 8,987
iTrader: (16)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to Monkeyevil
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shawn
Darryl, does JCR make ladder bars?
We can make almost anything

It's not part of our regular catalouge, but I would have no problem building one and sending it off, or building and installing one.
__________________
JcrOffroad
Zoom Zoom!
Monkeyevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2006, 08:51 AM   #5
Lothos
KD8GKB
 
Lothos's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-17-05
Location: .5 past lightspeed
Posts: 6,506
iTrader: (3)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Send a message via ICQ to Lothos Send a message via AIM to Lothos Send a message via Yahoo to Lothos
Default

Is the premise behind the devices to prevent the axle from traveling leterally backwards from the transmission thus dropping the driveshaft?
Lothos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2006, 09:10 AM   #6
Bones
skillicous
 
Bones's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Dearborn Heights, MI
Posts: 11,501
iTrader: (37)
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to Bones
Default

no, it is to stop axle rotation, which stesses the springs, drops the pinion to make a higher pinion angle, and causes the axle to "hop" when it grains/loses/regains traction.
__________________
Inviscid Motorsports

Special Thanks and Recommendations to;
Motorcity Machines
Ironman Offroad
Branik Motorsports
Maxxis Tires

Raceline Wheels
PAC Racing Springs
Joint Clutch and Gear
Bones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2006, 10:28 AM   #7
sodapop
Support the Sport!
 
sodapop's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-11-05
Location: Harrison Twp, MI
Posts: 2,015
iTrader: (18)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Option 2 might limit wrap but it looks like you'd be putting lots of stress on the main leaf which could cause it to break. Seems like that is part of the point of adding a antiwrap bar well that and the whole pinion angle thing. Bones have you check the bambar write-up on jeepaholics? I'm still not sure about that one either. When I go SOA, I'm just going to go with old faithful and use a normal ladder bar style.
sodapop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2006, 11:59 AM   #8
Bones
skillicous
 
Bones's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Dearborn Heights, MI
Posts: 11,501
iTrader: (37)
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to Bones
Default

do you have a link to the bambam bar? I'll add it to the top post.

I ended up just building the normal shackle style ladder bar. Haven't tried it yet though.
__________________
Inviscid Motorsports

Special Thanks and Recommendations to;
Motorcity Machines
Ironman Offroad
Branik Motorsports
Maxxis Tires

Raceline Wheels
PAC Racing Springs
Joint Clutch and Gear
Bones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2006, 02:36 PM   #9
Monkeyevil
I <3 Miatas
 
Monkeyevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Posts: 8,987
iTrader: (16)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to Monkeyevil
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bones
no, it is to stop axle rotation, which stesses the springs, drops the pinion to make a higher pinion angle, and causes the axle to "hop" when it grains/loses/regains traction.
Raises the pinion.
__________________
JcrOffroad
Zoom Zoom!
Monkeyevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2006, 03:16 PM   #10
shawn
Resident HVAC/R Jambi
 
shawn's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Milford/Commerce
Posts: 10,110
iTrader: (24)
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Send a message via Yahoo to shawn
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeyevil
Raises the pinion.
Or, lowers it (on teh front). I get bad wrap on the front springs, but not much I can do about that.
shawn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2006, 09:35 PM   #11
Buggy_Tim
(513) 891-8372
 
Buggy_Tim's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Sault Sainte Marie
Posts: 11,924
iTrader: (12)
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Default

The bar thing seems like it would not allow the spring pearch/plate to move rearward under compression without basicly wrapping the axle and pointing the pinion down. The spring gets longer as it compresses, shorter as it unloads. The pearch has to move forward and rearward a bit...more or less depening on your spring style.

Notice no pics of the compressed side.
Buggy_Tim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2006, 09:44 PM   #12
Monkeyevil
I <3 Miatas
 
Monkeyevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Posts: 8,987
iTrader: (16)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to Monkeyevil
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shawn
Or, lowers it (on teh front). I get bad wrap on the front springs, but not much I can do about that.
You can add a front traction bar... since the front axle rarely has as much rotational torque acting on it as the rear, a single bar setup may be just fine for your needs.
__________________
JcrOffroad
Zoom Zoom!
Monkeyevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 18th, 2006, 03:22 AM   #13
Bones
skillicous
 
Bones's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Dearborn Heights, MI
Posts: 11,501
iTrader: (37)
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to Bones
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuddyPaws
The bar thing seems like it would not allow the spring pearch/plate to move rearward under compression without basicly wrapping the axle and pointing the pinion down. The spring gets longer as it compresses, shorter as it unloads. The pearch has to move forward and rearward a bit...more or less depening on your spring style.

Notice no pics of the compressed side.
I'm not sure exactly what you are saying, as the lenth of a leaf spring never really changes

Here is the compressed side... looks like it compresses pretty well
__________________
Inviscid Motorsports

Special Thanks and Recommendations to;
Motorcity Machines
Ironman Offroad
Branik Motorsports
Maxxis Tires

Raceline Wheels
PAC Racing Springs
Joint Clutch and Gear
Bones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 18th, 2006, 09:03 AM   #14
brimy311
Smells like a Fork Liftis
 
brimy311's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Kzoo, mi
Posts: 4,092
iTrader: (42)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to brimy311
Default

I would say the best way would be the first option, single ladder bar. I used on my TPI YJ and it worked great. I had not problems with "limited flex".



I have since gone to 4link rears. Then you don't have to worry about spring wrap :)
__________________
JcrOffroad.com
Like us on Faceook!
brimy311 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > 4x4 Talk > General Tech

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:58 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright 2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd. Runs best on HiVelocity Hosting.
Page generated in 0.19151 seconds with 62 queries