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Old August 19th, 2014, 08:40 AM   #101
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1000 is lower than I was running when I bent the rods in the LQ4. and its less than Ill run with the new forged rods/pistons.


Like I said, Im going to run it as is. its already done/setup. I've learned everything I know the hard way, and I wouldn't have it any other way. I don't want to know an answer, I want the why.

I bet I can get pretty close up front... I guess we'll see.

It'll be awhile. Im moving, so Ill be without time to work or a shop, indefinitely soon.
So in the beginning of the thread you said it was 800, and you've also said it was a stock LQ4 longblock. And now you're saying it was over 1000hp? Not trying to be an ass, but do you have any actual dyno numbers to back this up? I know those motors are stout as hell, but the cranks are known for being able to handle 1000hp, sure as hell not the stock pistons and rods.....let alone with 25# of boost and no intercooler. Are you at least running meth injection?

It's cool that you're slapping together a go fast Jeep, but not everything has to be learned the hard way or half assed for the sake of getting it finished fast. You can find out the "why" through research as easily as anything else. Experimenting is fun and all, but so is doing it right the first time and having everything work.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 09:35 AM   #102
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A welded 14 bolt is less than $100 if you use the stock brakes, and with 1000hp (yes, I'm laughing) you shouldn't be too picky about gearing.

Does "doing things the hard way" always include working on a vehicle that is caked in mud?
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Old August 19th, 2014, 09:57 AM   #103
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So in the beginning of the thread you said it was 800, and you've also said it was a stock LQ4 longblock. And now you're saying it was over 1000hp? Not trying to be an ass, but do you have any actual dyno numbers to back this up? I know those motors are stout as hell, but the cranks are known for being able to handle 1000hp, sure as hell not the stock pistons and rods.....let alone with 25# of boost and no intercooler. Are you at least running meth injection?

It's cool that you're slapping together a go fast Jeep, but not everything has to be learned the hard way or half assed for the sake of getting it finished fast. You can find out the "why" through research as easily as anything else. Experimenting is fun and all, but so is doing it right the first time and having everything work.
I was planning on 800ish which is where most LS's max out a 72mm. I ended up running it well at much higher pressure ratios, which pulled more power out of it, like they do on pretty much every other platform.
Fuel calculations... Much more reliable than a dyno. Don't get your panties in a bunch. Im not making any hard claims. I didn't ask for a 1000whp badge. Similar setups (stock longblocks) have dyno'd 1150ish on a dynojet if that makes you feel better. I also have ridden in lots of fast cars, I know what power feels like.
I run E85, I leave windshield washer fluid where it belongs, at gas stations.

Again, careful with those panties.... You attaching value to opinions on the interwebs. I've proven a ton of setups than weren't supposed to work, becuase jim-bob said so, contrary to what the math says.

You say "doing it right the first time and having everything work"... I hear play it safe and build the same thing everyone else does. Im not interested in that.



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A welded 14 bolt is less than $100 if you use the stock brakes, and with 1000hp (yes, I'm laughing) you shouldn't be too picky about gearing.

Does "doing things the hard way" always include working on a vehicle that is caked in mud?
Wow, where were your innovative plans when I was cruching numbers... First... Im running 35" KM2s... indefinitely. So I have to run 15" wheels... SO I need to get wheels. Then I have to convert to disc brakes, to fit in the 15" wheels. Then, I have a giant 14B dragging everywhere because im on 35" tires. So naturally I need to shave it. I do care about gearing becuase Im looking for optimal highway cruise, so I have drive it to work and get decent mileage. Lastly, I need to narrow it so I can fit through my trails, and because my overall goal is to keep it small.

Working in mud really hasn't affected the build any. Its going to make a mess either way since the frames Im cutting off are rusty as fawk and full of mud.

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Old August 19th, 2014, 10:24 AM   #104
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I like this guy.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 10:52 AM   #105
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I was planning on 800ish which is where most LS's max out a 72mm. I ended up running it well at much higher pressure ratios, which pulled more power out of it, like they do on pretty much every other platform.
Fuel calculations... Much more reliable than a dyno. Don't get your panties in a bunch. Im not making any hard claims. I didn't ask for a 1000whp badge. Similar setups (stock longblocks) have dyno'd 1150ish on a dynojet if that makes you feel better. I also have ridden in lots of fast cars, I know what power feels like.
I run E85, I leave windshield washer fluid where it belongs, at gas stations.

Again, careful with those panties.... You attaching value to opinions on the interwebs. I've proven a ton of setups than weren't supposed to work, becuase jim-bob said so, contrary to what the math says.

You say "doing it right the first time and having everything work"... I hear play it safe and build the same thing everyone else does. Im not interested in that.
Sounds to me like your blown up LQ4 proved that a setup that wasn't supposed to work didn't work....But Jim-Bob already knew that, you prefer to learn the hard way That's cool, whatever floats your boat. My panties are just fine and my friends don't have to tow me places when my shit blows up or falls apart. I think it's cool that you make a lot of power and seem to get work done extraordinarily fast. It just looks to me like your style is throwing things together quickly, close enough is good enough, no real thought or planning behind it. SOME planning can go a long way though. I'm trying to not be too judgemental for 3 reasons:
1: I realize I probably only see 25% of the big picture of what you're actually doing.
2: I'm excessively OCD about builds, my shit takes forever because of it, and most people aren't like that. They'd rather be driving than building. My mindset is on the opposite end of the spectrum from where yours seems to be.
3: It's the internet and my opinion doesn't matter.

I could be totally wrong here since I don't know every last detail of your build and tuning, but throwing a non-cooled(intercooler, methanol, etc), non-wastegated turbo setup on a stock engine is destined for failure. You're pumping as much hot-as-hell air in as possible. What's the old saying? "Fast, cheap, and reliable....pick two". I'm no turbo expert but I've done my fair share of research. A proper turbo setup controls boost and air temps in order to protect the engine. Sounds like you're good at tuning, which is great and will help things last a little longer, but the setup itself looks pretty half-assed from my side of the table. You essentially just slapped a turbo on a stock engine with a fancy intake manifold, and tuned it to survive for a little while, right? Sounds harsh, but isn't that basically what it is, just a turbo and a tune? Why not spend a little more time and money to build it right AND tune it right? I just can't wrap my head around it.

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Old August 19th, 2014, 10:58 AM   #106
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#boltonsfordayssss
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:03 AM   #107
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here we go
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:09 AM   #108
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Why not spend a little more time and money to build it right AND tune it right? I just can't wrap my head around it.
From the photos he posted earlier, it *was* done right and saw plenty of time in a F-body. Seems to me he's getting things close enough to get the job done, then go out and enjoy it to see what the next weak link is...
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:15 AM   #109
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Cool Jeep bro ;)

I saw the LQ4 with the 73 trim turbo in action in my backyard. I can say I've never seen a Jeep like it. Or that big of a crowd even around a Jeep Wrangler. So don't be so quick to hate on it. This guy deserves respect for such innovative designing and building.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:16 AM   #110
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This guy is a fucking tool
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:17 AM   #111
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From the photos he posted earlier, it *was* done right and saw plenty of time in a F-body. Seems to me he's getting things close enough to get the job done, then go out and enjoy it to see what the next weak link is...
Stock LQ4 running 25# of non-cooled boost for a week before blowing up doesn't sound quite like "close enough" to me. Since there's been a more than 20% swing in the power output estimate throughout the course of the build I assume it was experimental or a work in progress. Like I said, assume. OP, correct me if I'm wrong. What was different about the setup in the TA that allowed it to last for thousands of miles but not in the Jeep?
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:18 AM   #112
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This guy is a fucking tool
Go drink a PBR ya hipster
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:23 AM   #113
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Sounds to me like your blown up LQ4 proved that a setup that wasn't supposed to work didn't work....But Jim-Bob already knew that, you prefer to learn the hard way That's cool, whatever floats your boat. My panties are just fine and my friends don't have to tow me places when my shit blows up or falls apart. I think it's cool that you make a lot of power and seem to get work done extraordinarily fast. It just looks to me like your style is throwing things together quickly, close enough is good enough, no real thought or planning behind it. SOME planning can go a long way though. I'm trying to not be too judgemental for 3 reasons:
1: I realize I probably only see 25% of the big picture of what you're actually doing.
2: I'm excessively OCD about builds, my shit takes forever because of it, and most people aren't like that. They'd rather be driving than building. My mindset is on the opposite end of the spectrum from where yours seems to be.
3: It's the internet and my opinion doesn't matter.

I could be totally wrong here since I don't know every last detail of your build and tuning, but throwing a non-cooled(intercooler, methanol, etc), non-wastegated turbo setup on a stock engine is destined for failure. You're pumping as much hot-as-hell air in as possible. What's the old saying? "Fast, cheap, and reliable....pick two". I'm no turbo expert but I've done my fair share of research. A proper turbo setup controls boost and air temps in order to protect the engine. Sounds like you're good at tuning, which is great and will help things last a little longer, but the setup itself looks pretty half-assed from my side of the table. You essentially just slapped a turbo on a stock engine with a fancy intake manifold, and tuned it to survive for a little while, right? Sounds harsh, but isn't that basically what it is, just a turbo and a tune? Why not spend a little more time and money to build it right AND tune it right? I just can't wrap my head around it.

No worries.

Yes, you are missing the big picture. I do a lot of thinking... Not that I care what you think(no offense) because as you said, you're just a screen name on the interwebs...



The most recent setup was actually not designed to survive.

5 years ago, I built a $15k long block N/A 454 LSx, with a billet crank, made power above 8000RPM. But I decided to step back and learn limits for myself. I spent a lot of money on that setup because Mr.jim-bob told me what to do. I got bored with that setup quick.

(For the record, that car took me 4 years to build, it was gorgeous. I enjoy doing things right. But Im tired of not being able to go play)

Since then I have been learning limits for myself. Saved a lot of money and learned even more.

I already proved I could make a non-intercooled 20# 6.0L live, and I got bored... So I tore it apart...

I was going to sell everything, then I figured I'd throw it in the Jeep. I had low hp goals, but figured why not see what it can do.

People said a 72mm couldn't make big power... well, it did. These engines are a dime a dozen, not too worried about using one to learn a limit.

Some people are fine with playing it safe. Im not.



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#boltonsfordayssss
Chea, son.

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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:27 AM   #114
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Stock LQ4 running 25# of non-cooled boost for a week before blowing up doesn't sound quite like "close enough" to me. Since there's been a more than 20% swing in the power output estimate throughout the course of the build I assume it was experimental or a work in progress. Like I said, assume. OP, correct me if I'm wrong. What was different about the setup in the TA that allowed it to last for thousands of miles but not in the Jeep?
I think he was seeing how far he could go, fully knowing what would be the outcome. :) Did you notice how fast he got another engine setup and running?
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:27 AM   #115
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I'll drop my Jeep off and you can be bored with that next after you're bored with this one
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:27 AM   #116
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I think he was seeing how far he could go, fully knowing what would be the outcome. :) Did you notice how fast he got another engine setup and running?
somebody has a man crush
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:29 AM   #117
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somebody has a man crush
Nah, I see someone enjoying their shit, instead of telling folks how to enjoy theirs.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:35 AM   #118
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Nah, I see someone enjoying their shit, instead of telling folks how to enjoy theirs.
And that's how it should be. I work with this guy. I know how he is. He does what he wants. Doesn't follow rules. Takes advice, but when somebody thinks they know something about his setup and how he did it wrong, he will prove them wrong.

I mean fukc the guy wears holey jeans on casual Fridays.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:37 AM   #119
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Nah, I see someone enjoying their shit, instead of telling folks how to enjoy theirs.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:40 AM   #120
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I think he was seeing how far he could go, fully knowing what would be the outcome. :) Did you notice how fast he got another engine setup and running?
I guess I just don't see the appeal of building something to fail. Pushing the limits is awesome and is how progress is made, but jumping a mile past them knowing full well that it's gonna fail just doesn't make sense to me. "Lemme run some 44" boggers on my Dana 35. I know it'll break, but Dana 35s are cheap." I'd rather enjoy something for a year at 95% capacity than for a week at 150% capacity...but again, that's just me.
In most cases, these things have been tried by plenty of people already who've proven the outcome. If nothing else, the math and science behind an internal combustion engine can prevent you from grenading a perfectly good motor.

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Nah, I see someone enjoying their shit, instead of telling folks how to enjoy theirs.
He can do whatever the hell he wants with his stuff. I just don't "get it".

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And that's how it should be. I work with this guy. I know how he is. He does what he wants. Doesn't follow rules. Takes advice, but when somebody thinks they know something about his setup and how he did it wrong, he will prove them wrong.

I mean fukc the guy wears holey jeans on casual Fridays.
That pretty much covers it. I have a very different mindset and like building things to be reliable. I get angry when I create something and it breaks. I feel like my head is gonna explode when I watch people throw things together and just shrug when it fails and THEN they change it up. I'm really not trying to be an asshole and wasn't even referring to just the engine in my initial posts, but that's what we ended up focusing on. Some people prefer build-wheel-break-fix-wheel-break-rebuild-wheel-break. Some days I'd rather be like that. But for whatever reason my mind is stuck on research-research-build-build-build-build-build-wheel-wheel-break-swear.

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