Pressure tank loosing pressure - Page 3 - Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest

Go Back   Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > The Pub
GL4x4 Live! GL4x4 Casino

The Pub A friendly forum where everybody is nice, and will answer any questions you have about life.

greatlakes4x4.com is the premier All Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Search
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old September 16th, 2013, 07:52 PM   #41
ckupq
Kitten I'm gonna eat you!
 
ckupq's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-07-05
Location: Cedar Rapids, IA 52402
Posts: 3,393
iTrader: (6)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuddyPaws View Post
I would have to go outside and put my ear on the well head to hear it run I think. It's like way down in a hole. I never hear mine run. That's why I was asking.
If you go to your pressure switch you can hear it. The switch will click loudly with every cycle on or off.
ckupq is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old September 16th, 2013, 08:31 PM   #42
Haggar
Covered in mud...
 
Haggar's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Oxford, MI
Posts: 17,598
iTrader: (55)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ckupq View Post
If you go to your pressure switch you can hear it. The switch will click loudly with every cycle on or off.
This, and you will hear the sound of it running, transmitted through the pipes.

If there is NO water being used in the house, and the pump is cycling, then there's a leak.

If the pump cycles very fast when you are using water, that is short cycling, and is usually improper air setting in the tank, or a bad tank.


In either case, the well pump is turning on and off too much. The on and off is what wears out the pump. The best is a nice big tank that takes a long time to fill.
Haggar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 16th, 2013, 08:53 PM   #43
HVYRTFT
Reed my teef
 
HVYRTFT's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-17-07
Location: Whitehall,MI
Posts: 2,436
iTrader: (9)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepfreak81 View Post
I thought he was Amish....




Hey, back on topic!
HVYRTFT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 16th, 2013, 10:18 PM   #44
Buggy_Tim
(513) 891-8372
 
Buggy_Tim's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Sault Sainte Marie
Posts: 11,743
iTrader: (12)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyBiz View Post
His, like mine has the pump down the well. I can't hear it when I'm outside, but I still easily hear mine kick on and off if there is water flowing when I'm inside. He didn't realize it wasn't supposed to do that. It wasn't until a friend of his came over, that he realized it. Silly city boy.
I have never heard mine cycle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ckupq View Post
If you go to your pressure switch you can hear it. The switch will click loudly with every cycle on or off.
Hmmm.....never heard a switch click. Now i'm on a mission to find it.
Buggy_Tim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 16th, 2013, 10:42 PM   #45
MonkeyBiz
Master Cocksman
 
MonkeyBiz's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Whitehall
Posts: 8,301
iTrader: (10)
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Send a message via Yahoo to MonkeyBiz
Default

How big is your pressure tank MP? Mine is small, so if I flush the toilet, it will kick on. My parent's is huge. You have to run the shower for 15 min before it turns on.
MonkeyBiz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 16th, 2013, 11:47 PM   #46
Buggy_Tim
(513) 891-8372
 
Buggy_Tim's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Sault Sainte Marie
Posts: 11,743
iTrader: (12)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

ok, first full disclosure. I'm a city boy. LOL Just moved into this house and never had a well before. Second, I know what a pressure tank looks like.

Do all well systems have a pressure tank? If this house has one, I can't find the damn thing.
Buggy_Tim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 12:11 AM   #47
MonkeyBiz
Master Cocksman
 
MonkeyBiz's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Whitehall
Posts: 8,301
iTrader: (10)
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Send a message via Yahoo to MonkeyBiz
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuddyPaws View Post
ok, first full disclosure. I'm a city boy. LOL Just moved into this house and never had a well before. Second, I know what a pressure tank looks like.

Do all well systems have a pressure tank? If this house has one, I can't find the damn thing.
Yes. That's what keeps pressure in your system. It is usually right where the water line comes into the house. Think..utility room in the basement. If you don't have a basement, it's in the crawl space, or that goofy really small building in the back yard that the Realtor called a pump house.

I have seen/heard of them being in the attics, but that's usually in the south.

Go out side. Stand at your well. Find (what is usually) the shortest distance to the foundation. Then, go inside, and look in the area that you previously identified. It's usually in there. Unless you live in a mansion, they are kinda of hard to hide.

If all else fails, start tracing back water lines.

Last edited by MonkeyBiz; September 17th, 2013 at 12:16 AM.
MonkeyBiz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 04:05 AM   #48
Rob the plumber
Licensed master plumber
 
Rob the plumber's Avatar
 
Join Date: 06-14-06
Location: New Baltimore, Michigan
Posts: 5,632
iTrader: (32)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Big Blue tank usually.
Rob the plumber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 04:13 PM   #49
MonkeyBiz
Master Cocksman
 
MonkeyBiz's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Whitehall
Posts: 8,301
iTrader: (10)
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Send a message via Yahoo to MonkeyBiz
Default

My new one is tan, my old one was red.
MonkeyBiz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 04:18 PM   #50
jeepfreak81
81 inches of fun
 
jeepfreak81's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-10-05
Location: Lennon, Mi
Posts: 12,180
iTrader: (21)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to jeepfreak81 Send a message via MSN to jeepfreak81 Send a message via Yahoo to jeepfreak81
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuddyPaws View Post
ok, first full disclosure. I'm a city boy. LOL Just moved into this house and never had a well before. Second, I know what a pressure tank looks like.

Do all well systems have a pressure tank? If this house has one, I can't find the damn thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyBiz View Post
Yes. That's what keeps pressure in your system. It is usually right where the water line comes into the house. Think..utility room in the basement. If you don't have a basement, it's in the crawl space, or that goofy really small building in the back yard that the Realtor called a pump house.

I have seen/heard of them being in the attics, but that's usually in the south.

Go out side. Stand at your well. Find (what is usually) the shortest distance to the foundation. Then, go inside, and look in the area that you previously identified. It's usually in there. Unless you live in a mansion, they are kinda of hard to hide.

If all else fails, start tracing back water lines.
It can also be buried in the ground. The house we are buying has it buried next to the well. There is a second small (1/2"?) pipe coming up next to the well standpipe on ours, this has a valve like a bike tire for adjusting the pressure in the bladder. This was done in the 70's, then when you go inside the house all we have is a pressure switch where the water line comes into the house.
jeepfreak81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 06:45 PM   #51
Buggy_Tim
(513) 891-8372
 
Buggy_Tim's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Sault Sainte Marie
Posts: 11,743
iTrader: (12)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

I don't have one. Unless it's buried somewhere out in the yard. There is nothing in the basement.
Buggy_Tim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 07:11 PM   #52
MonkeyBiz
Master Cocksman
 
MonkeyBiz's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Whitehall
Posts: 8,301
iTrader: (10)
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Send a message via Yahoo to MonkeyBiz
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuddyPaws View Post
I don't have one. Unless it's buried somewhere out in the yard. There is nothing in the basement.
That really surprises me... especially given you location. I can't imagine they would have put one outside that far north.


Are you sure your not on city water, and just have an old well in the back yard?
MonkeyBiz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 08:09 PM   #53
Buggy_Tim
(513) 891-8372
 
Buggy_Tim's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Sault Sainte Marie
Posts: 11,743
iTrader: (12)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

LOL

No, I live way outside the city. Well and septic. When we bought the house the PO explained how to change the pump if needed and had a receipt for a pump installed a couple years or so ago.

But I have looked all over the basement....finished basement. All the stuff down there is all in one room (furnace, water heater, central vac etc) and there is no tank in there.

I wonder if it's a long skinny one and it's in the drop ceiling.
Buggy_Tim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 08:17 PM   #54
MonkeyBiz
Master Cocksman
 
MonkeyBiz's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Whitehall
Posts: 8,301
iTrader: (10)
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Send a message via Yahoo to MonkeyBiz
Default

Are is there a water line running into the long skinny one?
MonkeyBiz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 08:36 PM   #55
jeepfreak81
81 inches of fun
 
jeepfreak81's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-10-05
Location: Lennon, Mi
Posts: 12,180
iTrader: (21)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to jeepfreak81 Send a message via MSN to jeepfreak81 Send a message via Yahoo to jeepfreak81
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuddyPaws View Post
LOL

No, I live way outside the city. Well and septic. When we bought the house the PO explained how to change the pump if needed and had a receipt for a pump installed a couple years or so ago.

But I have looked all over the basement....finished basement. All the stuff down there is all in one room (furnace, water heater, central vac etc) and there is no tank in there.

I wonder if it's a long skinny one and it's in the drop ceiling.
Follow the water line where it comes into the house if you can. If it leads you to a pressure switch I bet the tank is in the ground someplace.

Did you have a well and septic inspection when you purchased the house, or any inspection? My inspector found all that and showed it to me.
jeepfreak81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 09:10 PM   #56
Buggy_Tim
(513) 891-8372
 
Buggy_Tim's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Sault Sainte Marie
Posts: 11,743
iTrader: (12)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyBiz View Post
Are is there a water line running into the long skinny one?
I don't know if there is a long skinny one. I was just pondering it that maybe it was in the drop ceiling. I'm too lazy to go that far looking for it. LOL
Buggy_Tim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 09:11 PM   #57
Buggy_Tim
(513) 891-8372
 
Buggy_Tim's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Sault Sainte Marie
Posts: 11,743
iTrader: (12)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepfreak81 View Post
Follow the water line where it comes into the house if you can. If it leads you to a pressure switch I bet the tank is in the ground someplace.

Did you have a well and septic inspection when you purchased the house, or any inspection? My inspector found all that and showed it to me.
Had an inspection but I wasn't present for it.
Buggy_Tim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 09:17 PM   #58
wrath
Project Antitube
 
wrath's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-09-05
Location: Chelsea, MI
Posts: 456
iTrader: (2)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to wrath
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HVYRTFT View Post
Ok great lakers

House is ten years old. The shallow well submersible pump is short-cycling because the pressure tank is loosing pressure. Here is what I know:

The tank's pressure is correct
2psi above/below what the pressure switch cuts in at? Or thereabouts? Depending on your well you may either want to keep some water in the tank (pressure lower than cut-in which is usually used with deep well/jet pumps) or use every less morsel of water you can store (pressure higher than cut-in which is usually used with shallow submersible pumps).

Quote:
Originally Posted by HVYRTFT View Post
The pressure switch is functioning correctly
Are you sure? If the pump is fighting something when trying to fill the tank it will trip out prematurely. What I'm getting at, is if you have a 20gpm pump but can only get it to the tank at 5gpm the pump will build up pressure before the tank is filled.

Keep in mind that a pressure tank with a bladder rated at 42gallons only has ~6 gallon draw down at 30/50.

A water logged bladder tank (ruptured bladder) is probably the most common reason for pump short-cycling. They usually have a five year warranty because at 5 years and 1 day they poo the bed.

You can check them fairly easy. The easiest way is to look at the specifications of the tank and then use 5 gallon buckets to measure output.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HVYRTFT View Post
No leaks in the house. No leaks in the copper.
Have you isolated everything? IE: turn off the valve between the well and the tank and the tank and the house to isolate where the water is going?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HVYRTFT View Post
There is NOT a check valve right where the water supply enters the building.
I am assuming there is one somewhere I cannot get to without pulling the well pump.
You just need one somewhere if you have a submersible pump. Doesn't really matter where but preferably before the pressure tank and the pressure switch. Unless you buy an expensive check valve (think $200+) there will be significant pressure loss across the valve (like 5psi at 5gpm). The pump is sitting in a well casing so sinkholes don't make sense unless your pulling sediment out of the well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HVYRTFT View Post
I'm guessing the water or air is flowing back into the well.
Is my tank bad or the check valve on the well side bad?
It's quite possible that water is flowing back. I lose pressure over the course of a couple days because I have a bad check valve and my dishwasher leaks (lets air in to the hot water side). I have a cheap check valve that is severely oversized in an attempt to avoid paying a lot for something that doesn't restrict flow. I bought it over a year ago and still haven't put it in.

My pump puts out about 17gpm. It cycles in roughly 30 seconds to go from 50psi and turns off at 76psi. I have another 82 gallon equivalent to 35 gallon tank that I have to put in. In theory, that will give me about a 15 gallon draw down between the two tanks.

I do have a disclaimer... I'm fairly new to this. I'm used to nursing along a 240' well that flows roughly .75gpm through a 2" pipe. I now have a 5" well 43' deep with the pump at ~25' and water at 14'.
wrath is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 09:37 PM   #59
Buggy_Tim
(513) 891-8372
 
Buggy_Tim's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Sault Sainte Marie
Posts: 11,743
iTrader: (12)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

I found the damn thing. It's built into the bottom of a shelving unit in my gun room.
Buggy_Tim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2013, 09:57 PM   #60
MonkeyBiz
Master Cocksman
 
MonkeyBiz's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Whitehall
Posts: 8,301
iTrader: (10)
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Send a message via Yahoo to MonkeyBiz
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuddyPaws View Post
I found the damn thing. It's built into the bottom of a shelving unit in my gun room.
I have this mental video in my head of you reading about his on GL, thinking hey, where is mine? Then, in only your underwear, (tighty whities ) frantically searching, getting frustrated, drinking a beer, and another and another until your drunk. Waking up at 4 am hungover, confused why your in your basement in your underwear, seeing the lap top open, remembering and continuing the frantic search. Finally, after 30 hours of searching, drinking, passing out, waking up, drinking (repeat) you approach your gun cabinet, tired, drunk (again) ready to rip the fucker out of the wall. Then you open a cabinet door, and lights shine on it, and holy music plays. You've found your holy grail. Congratulation.


I have a vivid imagination.
MonkeyBiz is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > The Pub

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:54 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright 2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd. Runs best on HiVelocity Hosting.
Page generated in 0.25420 seconds with 80 queries