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Old August 5th, 2013, 12:06 PM   #81
whiterhino
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Keith,
I know you get it and you've been there before. In fact, you have been part of more than one of the guy's runs that I have organized in the past where some of the most fun ever has happened. With that said, there is a reason that I for one stopped doing GG. It came to a point where I was "expected" to provide a good time and find a place for anyone with a 4x4 who attended. And for me, in Canada, that is just not possible. When I was approached about bringing this event back, my answer was quite simple. Yes, I would lead a run both days. No, I will not make any effort to accomodate anyone in particular. I am going where I want to go, regardless of difficulty or lack thereof and I welcome anyone who thinks it would be fun to tag along. Bottom line, this is my vacation too. I am taking days off work and spending several hundred dollars to enjoy the Canada "I" enjoy. GG-06 pretty much ruined it for me when I had a young kid ready to take a poke at me because I told him he couldn't go because he needed a winch. Why?, because we were going here and I knew it would be a winch fest;

Note in the background 'ol fatass himself on a hill that all but 2 winched.


I don't hate full size rigs, I just know they don't do well in the type of trails I like to run. There are some good places a fullsize rig on 33's - 35's could enjoy a full weekend. As far as camping goes, I have done a couple overnight runs in Canada. One a decent truck could have gone on, the other not a chance.

I would hardly like to take a heavy vehicle here. (and yes, we will be here this year too)

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Old August 5th, 2013, 12:19 PM   #82
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Well by all means I do not plan to wheel the Excursion up there. The Sami should be ready in time. If, and only if it is not, I will still come up and do some on-road exploring/helping out around camp.

I understand the worry (and dare I say hate?) for fullsize rigs, however I do feel events like these should take them into consideration as well. Jeeps themselves are getting bigger with each generation, and besides the Wrangler, the only U.S. built solid axle vehicles anymore are fullsize trucks. I am seeing a trend of people building bigger rigs, expo rigs, camping type rigs etc. and feel it will only grow.

Now I'm not saying we need to fire up the chainsaws and widen the trails, but instead find some appropriate routes for maybe one or two fullsize runs instead of planning to exclude them alltogether from big events like this.
Keith,

I dare say that no one 'hates' the big boys you guys are faced with at least three problems. One is; many 'decidious forest' trails areas is that trees NEVER stop growing and no one ever seems to want to spend the time necessary to keep them open for anything much wider than a SxS, Quad or Snowmachine. Even those vehicles are starting to brush the sides. If you examine the issue further you'll see that the eventuality is that all these trails WILL eventually close back up and be reclaimed by Mother Nature.

I have a vast quantity of maps from years gone by up there and you'd be suprised at how many of these trails no longer exist.

Even last year fall the run that Whiterhino took up on was totally un-recognizable at the exit point. Were it not for the fact we pushed through 50 feet of total brush overgrowth, you would have NEVER found that trail going in the opposite direction.

My trail that I'm going to use you would NEVER find it if we went in the opposite direction either. That's because they build a full blown logging road right on top of some of my old trail and covered it up. The best we can hope for is that with some relative consistient use some of these trails will develop back to a decent width that you can at least FIND them in the future.

Two, most of these trails were never designed for full size vehicles. At best some of these are just skidder trails that we've 'kept open' by our limited use. Some of that limited use is due to groups wanting to keep the trails to themselves. This attitude was perpetrated by the fact that many users are fearful of how the U.S. based Land Manager like to close every single trail once someone finds out how much how 'fun' that trail is because 'fun' is usually associated with environmentally damaging. Remember though, we can use these types of trails in Canada where in the U.S. you can not.

The other aspect of the big boys is that as Whiterhino pointed out, when you guys get stuck, it' s MAJOR undertaking to get you out. All too often there's only one and maybe two of you big guys. To make it more fun for all and not kill some small vehicles trying to get you guys unstuck, you need to travel with a few of you together to have adaquate equipment to get unstuck.

jim-kb8ymf

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Old August 5th, 2013, 12:44 PM   #83
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GG-06 pretty much ruined it for me when I had a young kid ready to take a poke at me because I told him he couldn't go because he needed a winch. Why?, because we were going here and I knew it would be a winch fest;
Let it also be known thatI got stuck with this guy after WR kicked him out of his group for the reasons he explained.
He had open diffs and nearly bald 33" All-Terrain's. At the end of the day after him badgering me for hours on end I took him to 'Fruitloop' off Robertson Lake Road. He made one run @ Mach 8 up a pretty challenging hill and proceded to literally 'toss' his radiator into his fan (Radiator was zip tied to the front cowl with two zip ties) and dump all his coolant probably 20 feet up a 400 foot long trail. He was stranded and didn't have a single tool in his vehicle. I believe hitched a ride back to the campground to get a trailer to retrieve the crippled truck.

I am of the same opinion as WR, I like this area but I'm going there for MY enjoyment. If you want to come and explore with me that's great. Not everyone likes exploring. If you want to be entertained and guaranteed XX miles of 4WD road, go find another event. This is meant to be an exploration run and a layed back trail ride.
I've been going there since 1980 and there's still plenty to explore and not keep going on the same trail each and every year.
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Old August 5th, 2013, 12:53 PM   #84
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I think they were MT Claws.
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Old August 5th, 2013, 05:27 PM   #85
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I am not upset at all, and I think you guys were on the same run I was years ago where a guy kept pulling out his chainsaw to widen trails so his Grand Cherokee wouldn't get scratched. That was unacceptable in my opinion.

I only brought up my comments as a question/thought. The pics you guys showed I would probably not take the Excursuon on. If I had to bring it up I would be looking at a color tour two track sort of thing and was just curious if anyone else was doing something like that. The old gitchee gumee I remember had everything from stocker runs to the more hardcore and I applauded the event for just that.

I feel our converstation here is good and productive. Maybe others reading it can get a good idea as to the types of rigs that this trip will be appropriate for.

Maybe an idea for the future would be to put right on the registration "full-size rigs not recommended for this event" or something like that.

I agree this is all our vacations and we should not be trying to make the event "one size fits all"

I'm hoping my rig will be ready. Maybe you guys can get a pic of my girlfriend hanging from a seatbelt :D
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Old August 5th, 2013, 07:59 PM   #86
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Are any of these trails the soft-top shredding kind of trails ? Wondering if I should put the hardtop on for this run.
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Old August 5th, 2013, 09:20 PM   #87
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Cheaper to replace a torn up softop than it is to replace a busted hardtop.
I never wheel with my hardtop unless it in the heart of winter.
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Old August 5th, 2013, 10:11 PM   #88
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Are any of these trails the soft-top shredding kind of trails ? Wondering if I should put the hardtop on for this run.
Go topless!
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Old August 5th, 2013, 10:19 PM   #89
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I gotta steal hardtop I doubt it's going to bust up but I would rather have scratch and dent my top then get to my face whipped with tree branches , I generally go topless but I sure would hate to be in a torrential downpour up there with no top
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Old August 5th, 2013, 11:28 PM   #90
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I gotta steal hardtop I doubt it's going to bust up but I would rather have scratch and dent my top then get to my face whipped with tree branches , I generally go topless but I sure would hate to be in a torrential downpour up there with no top
Yeah, I will probably be getting a top for my Samurai, the girlfriend is kinda freaking on that too :D
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Old August 6th, 2013, 06:08 AM   #91
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A soft top will be fine but expect to get some window pinstriping from the tight brush.
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Old August 6th, 2013, 10:06 AM   #92
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I gotta steal hardtop I doubt it's going to bust up but I would rather have scratch and dent my top then get to my face whipped with tree branches , I generally go topless but I sure would hate to be in a torrential downpour up there with no top
I've seen snow there that time of year too




this isn't sounding like a good year for me to come up. I just picked up a 2012 JK, and not ready to pin-stripe it and mud bath it just yet. I was lookign at a couple other vehicles to toy with, but I doubt they will happen with time for me to have ready and tested by GG

Hoping I can make it next year.
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Old August 6th, 2013, 10:43 AM   #93
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I've seen snow there that time of year too




this isn't sounding like a good year for me to come up. I just picked up a 2012 JK, and not ready to pin-stripe it and mud bath it just yet. I was lookign at a couple other vehicles to toy with, but I doubt they will happen with time for me to have ready and tested by GG

Hoping I can make it next year.
Aw shucks. We were going to run T17 just for you.
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Old August 6th, 2013, 12:16 PM   #94
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Aw shucks. We were going to run T17 just for you.
I do miss that trail, along with the rest of the trails up there.
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Old August 6th, 2013, 03:47 PM   #95
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is t17 off the whitman dam?
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Old August 6th, 2013, 07:25 PM   #96
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Yes, but its now a logging road/highway.
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Old August 9th, 2013, 11:01 AM   #97
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So I'm curious who has signed up?
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Old August 9th, 2013, 11:06 AM   #98
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I sent my registration in a month or so ago, so I think i'm in!
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Old August 9th, 2013, 01:47 PM   #99
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Old August 10th, 2013, 12:00 AM   #100
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so i'm curious who has signed up?
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