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Old March 30th, 2013, 08:08 PM   #481
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Originally Posted by kerryann View Post
Okay but you want additional costs added to the system to satisfy your beliefs. Why should I pay for your beliefs? I don't ask you to pay for me believing in eating organic, non gmo, and vegetarian because that is my belief system.
If we were to leave it the way since the founding of our country, there would be no additional costs.
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Old March 30th, 2013, 08:29 PM   #482
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I see that Iím coming in late, but Iím a bit confused about kerryann and L4CXís recent discussion, from reading the last few pages.

Kerryann (and anyone who sees what I may be missing here):

So as I understand what you said below, your thought is that we could get rid of marriage as a secular contract as you see it, and make one contract that everyone follows, which you say will cost money.

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Originally Posted by kerryann View Post
I think either we get rid of current marriage law as a secular contract (which it is) or we just made one form of secular bonding contract that everyone follows. Introducing extra legislation and process will cost money. In my opinion if everyone is equal there should only be one set of laws.
Then, L4CX agrees with you, under the condition that it is the best compromise for each side, though it would certainly be a lot of work.

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Originally Posted by L4CX View Post
I'm all for the extra legislation if it brings both sides the best option. I realize that it would be alot of work even changing the law to say "insert alternative here" but I think that would be best for both.
Now if I didnít miss anything from earlier, you now say that those who hold views similar to his should pay for the extra costsÖ.. ??? Didnít you just put the idea forward, while saying it would cost money?
I thought that was your thought on a possible solution; how did he and those who hold views like his end up being responsible for that cost? I didnít see him put that idea forward anywhere, so Iím confused.

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How about you and the people who hold those views pay 100% for the extra costs. Choices should have consequences.
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Old March 30th, 2013, 08:30 PM   #483
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If we were to leave it the way since the founding of our country, there would be no additional costs.
If the majority of American's voted to not allow it then I'd agree. This is easy, put it on the ballot.
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Old March 30th, 2013, 08:40 PM   #484
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people get offended when you speak the truth and they cant hangle it. Your not on a high horse. Your speaking it as many would interprete it from the Bible.



If I have a son/daughter/family member that was homosexual I wouldnt shun them, scold them, or tell them they are going to hell. I would pray for them and hope for the best. I would show them love. If they asked what I thought about gay marriage I would say I dont agree with it.

My roomate in college was homosexual and he was a great guy. He is still one of my closest friends. I wish the best for him, I have never told him what he is doing is bad/wrong. Its not my place to do so.

The beauty of the bible is no man should judge another. Sin is sin, no sin is greater then the other. If you cheat on your spouse, steal, lie, murder, or have homosexual relations its all on the same level in Gods eyes.
Thanks barry.
It is true people do and will get offended by others speaking what come from the bible. Christ said it would happen and that is exactly what is happening.
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Old March 30th, 2013, 08:43 PM   #485
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would anyone be kind enough to answer my question?
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Old March 30th, 2013, 08:49 PM   #486
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Originally Posted by kerryann View Post
How about you and the people who hold those views pay 100% for the extra costs. Choices should have consequences.
Oh don't worry we're all going to pay......

http://redflagnews.com/headlines/sex...nder-obamacare
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Old March 30th, 2013, 08:50 PM   #487
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would anyone be kind enough to answer my question?
wait for it.....wait for it....
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Old March 30th, 2013, 09:26 PM   #488
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 82cj7ltd View Post
I see that Iím coming in late, but Iím a bit confused about kerryann and L4CXís recent discussion, from reading the last few pages.

Kerryann (and anyone who sees what I may be missing here):

So as I understand what you said below, your thought is that we could get rid of marriage as a secular contract as you see it, and make one contract that everyone follows, which you say will cost money.



Then, L4CX agrees with you, under the condition that it is the best compromise for each side, though it would certainly be a lot of work.



Now if I didnít miss anything from earlier, you now say that those who hold views similar to his should pay for the extra costsÖ.. ??? Didnít you just put the idea forward, while saying it would cost money?
I thought that was your thought on a possible solution; how did he and those who hold views like his end up being responsible for that cost? I didnít see him put that idea forward anywhere, so Iím confused.
No he said earlier to let them be married but have a different process and a different form of union like a domestic partnership for homosexuals and a "marriage" for heterosexuals. I said either make it one process or make it no process. Making it two different processes will create more costs. If we let the government do anything there is going to a high amount costs involved.
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Old March 30th, 2013, 09:28 PM   #489
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Oh don't worry we're all going to pay......

http://redflagnews.com/headlines/sex...nder-obamacare
I am anti obama and obamacare too. I am also anti graduated taxes and big government. I think elective surgeries can be covered by insurance companies that are willing to do that without government intervention but if someone can have their twinkie cut off or their taco sewed shut why can't I get a facelift or a boob job covered too?
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Old March 30th, 2013, 09:59 PM   #490
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Originally Posted by kerryann View Post
No he said earlier to let them be married but have a different process and a different form of union like a domestic partnership for homosexuals and a "marriage" for heterosexuals. I said either make it one process or make it no process. Making it two different processes will create more costs. If we let the government do anything there is going to a high amount costs involved.
ahhh.

are you referring to this: ?

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Originally Posted by L4CX View Post
There is a pretty large group of people that have an issue with it being called Marriage. Whether they are believers or not, they still are citizens of the united states. Their opinion is no less important then the Homosexual side's opinion. Most of us are willing to re-name our governmental definition to something different.

What effect will it have on any of us if we call it something different? Why does it have to be called a marriage? Nobody has answered that question. Just sarcastically blew it off as us being bigots. Personally, I think it's a great compromise. It would appear to be right in the middle of the issue for both sides. I think if we can make both sides happy, it's a win-win instead of having someone loose.
I still don't see where he suggests a different process for them.... just that they don't have the same name for their partnership as a heterosexual marriage... what did I miss?
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Old March 30th, 2013, 10:18 PM   #491
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I agree with it being the same, but let the traditionalists and religious folks use the term "marriage" for what they want, and have the legal union of 2 people be called something else.
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Old March 30th, 2013, 10:19 PM   #492
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ahhh.

are you referring to this: ?



I still don't see where he suggests a different process for them.... just that they don't have the same name for their partnership as a heterosexual marriage... what did I miss?
How would you have just a different name in government? I am not trusting they would use the same forms and process for both. If it was a business with an emphasis on efficiency and profit then maybe.
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Old March 31st, 2013, 06:40 AM   #493
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If the majority of American's voted to not allow it then I'd agree. This is easy, put it on the ballot.
My guess is using California as a benchmark, if it was on a national ballot any changes would get voted down in a heartbeat.
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Old March 31st, 2013, 07:16 AM   #494
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I am anti obama and obamacare too. I am also anti graduated taxes and big government. I think elective surgeries can be covered by insurance companies that are willing to do that without government intervention but if someone can have their twinkie cut off or their taco sewed shut why can't I get a facelift or a boob job covered too?
If this would be the case through private insurance companies then that would be up to them and the individual. With things looking more like obamacare just might be the law of the land then having tax payers cover the cost for sex change operations is unacceptable. If they are uncomfortable in thier own skin then they need to pay for that on thier own.
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Old March 31st, 2013, 09:54 AM   #495
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I agree with it being the same, but let the traditionalists and religious folks use the term "marriage" for what they want, and have the legal union of 2 people be called something else.
We are on the same page
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Old March 31st, 2013, 10:00 AM   #496
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My guess is using California as a benchmark, if it was on a national ballot any changes would get voted down in a heartbeat.
Then they should let the people have their say.

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If this would be the case through private insurance companies then that would be up to them and the individual. With things looking more like obamacare just might be the law of the land then having tax payers cover the cost for sex change operations is unacceptable. If they are uncomfortable in thier own skin then they need to pay for that on thier own.
I am uncomfortable in my skin because I need hmmmm a boob job and maybe a tummy tuck. Should that be covered too ? Anything that is not medically necessary is considered elective surgery. The government should be staying out of private company business and let the demands of the consumers drive the offerings.
The whole reason that the government is getting involved (in my opinion) is because people are too blind to see why the costs of health care are going up(besides greed which is probably a 10% factor). First we have an aging population. Second we have a lot of people uninsured which though medical costs rising gets passed to the insured. Most importantly we have a society that wants to be obese and live on foods that aren't good for the body which is driving up the rates of diabetes and heart disease (and I suspect the chemicals in processed food contribute to the cancer rates) but instead of dealing with those root causes we want a miracle pill instead. I was reading a local grocery store ad today and saw them selling acai berry juice. I said to Mike that if people just ate better in general they wouldn't have to go hunting for these miracle antioxidants.
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Old March 31st, 2013, 07:55 PM   #497
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Originally Posted by kerryann View Post
then they should let the people have their say.



I am uncomfortable in my skin because i need hmmmm a boob job and maybe a tummy tuck. Should that be covered too ? Anything that is not medically necessary is considered elective surgery. The government should be staying out of private company business and let the demands of the consumers drive the offerings.
The whole reason that the government is getting involved (in my opinion) is because people are too blind to see why the costs of health care are going up(besides greed which is probably a 10% factor). First we have an aging population. Second we have a lot of people uninsured which though medical costs rising gets passed to the insured. Most importantly we have a society that wants to be obese and live on foods that aren't good for the body which is driving up the rates of diabetes and heart disease (and i suspect the chemicals in processed food contribute to the cancer rates) but instead of dealing with those root causes we want a miracle pill instead. I was reading a local grocery store ad today and saw them selling acai berry juice. I said to mike that if people just ate better in general they wouldn't have to go hunting for these miracle antioxidants.
x2
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Old April 1st, 2013, 07:35 AM   #498
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Originally Posted by kerryann View Post
Then they should let the people have their say.



I am uncomfortable in my skin because I need hmmmm a boob job and maybe a tummy tuck. Should that be covered too ? Anything that is not medically necessary is considered elective surgery. The government should be staying out of private company business and let the demands of the consumers drive the offerings.
The whole reason that the government is getting involved (in my opinion) is because people are too blind to see why the costs of health care are going up(besides greed which is probably a 10% factor). First we have an aging population. Second we have a lot of people uninsured which though medical costs rising gets passed to the insured. Most importantly we have a society that wants to be obese and live on foods that aren't good for the body which is driving up the rates of diabetes and heart disease (and I suspect the chemicals in processed food contribute to the cancer rates) but instead of dealing with those root causes we want a miracle pill instead. I was reading a local grocery store ad today and saw them selling acai berry juice. I said to Mike that if people just ate better in general they wouldn't have to go hunting for these miracle antioxidants.
You point is valid. More needs to be done and it is up to the people to do that and less government intrusion.
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Old April 3rd, 2013, 06:36 PM   #499
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Ok I knew it would only be a matter of time until..... but this is moving at light speed.

http://www.rethinksociety.com/govern...under-ca-bill/
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Old April 3rd, 2013, 08:24 PM   #500
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Ok I knew it would only be a matter of time until..... but this is moving at light speed.

http://www.rethinksociety.com/govern...under-ca-bill/
wow I figured it would happen at some point but this is messed up.
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