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Old December 23rd, 2012, 09:40 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by kp99xj View Post
Why not just allow people to legally carry in schools who are legal to carry everywhere else? I am all for having armed security, but why disarm the staff and parents when they come into the school? It would cost nothing extra to simply allow the people who are already there to protect our children more effectively.
Through this you would also have a possibility of having hundreds of armed guards in a single school, rather than one.
The reason these cowards go into schools,churches,and movie theaters is because they know they are full of unarmed people unable to shoot back.
You never see a mass shooting at a shooting range.
If some punk had been educated on the canon his science teacher was packing in his breif case he may think twice about shooting up a school.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 09:43 AM   #22
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what about some nut who walks by the windows and opens fire from the outside of the building? Not much can be done about that scenario.
Ban windows, duh!!!!!!!
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 09:51 AM   #23
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Watching Lapierre on MTP right now and this shit annoys me.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 10:23 AM   #24
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In my old school we had 2-4 off duty police officers come in every day.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 10:34 AM   #25
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I love how people are all freaked out about having armed security in schools. But, we have had on and off duty cops patrolling many schools for 25+ years already. OMG!!! GUNS IN SCHOOLS!!!! The kids are all gonna die!!!!
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 10:38 AM   #26
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Even if they just had a handfull of "qualified" staff that could deploy in a situation would be better than nothing. And I don't mean arm all teachers as there are many that just shouldn't. Make it a cpl + certification or something that could be gotten.

The more that the good guys have the less the bad ones will try stupid shit cause you never know who will fire back.

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Old December 23rd, 2012, 10:53 AM   #27
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In reality-

Shit Happens.








And you can't buy insurance.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 11:44 AM   #28
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Here's something to chew on - there was an armed security officer at Columbine when they had the shootings there (in fact, if I recall correctly, there were actually two on duty there that day). Lot of good they did...

There was only one way into the school at Sandy Hook and the shooter blew the door off the hinges as he walked up to it and then shot the principal as soon as she stepped out of the office.

And only good guys with guns stop bad guys with guns? There was somebody in the crowd in Tucson who had a firearm with them - they didn't stop the shooter from killing six, including a 9-year-old girl.

An armed guard at every school sounds like a nice idea but it's just about as retarded as the guy making the argument. What about all the shootings that take place outside of schools? Oak Creek, Aurora, Tuscon (and those are just the ones I can remember off the top of my head as being relatively recent). If we are serious about stopping crimes like this before they occur, we need to be serious about making firearms more difficult to obtain.

I say don't bother with trying to ban everything, but make them more expensive instead. Require purchasers to place a significant bond when buying a firearm (maybe something like $5k or $10k and it would be refundable if they legally sell the firearm to somebody else when that purchaser places their bond) and then also be required to buy liability insurance. If you are buying a single-shot hunting rifle or shotgun, have taken a hunter's safety course, etc. your rates would be lower than somebody who's never had any training buying a semi-automatic handgun. Levy a federal excise tax on the ammunition and also close the gun-show loopholes and ability to buy firearms over the internet.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 11:54 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WSU JK View Post
Here's something to chew on - there was an armed security officer at Columbine when they had the shootings there (in fact, if I recall correctly, there were actually two on duty there that day). Lot of good they did...

There was only one way into the school at Sandy Hook and the shooter blew the door off the hinges as he walked up to it and then shot the principal as soon as she stepped out of the office.

And only good guys with guns stop bad guys with guns? There was somebody in the crowd in Tucson who had a firearm with them - they didn't stop the shooter from killing six, including a 9-year-old girl.

An armed guard at every school sounds like a nice idea but it's just about as retarded as the guy making the argument. What about all the shootings that take place outside of schools? Oak Creek, Aurora, Tuscon (and those are just the ones I can remember off the top of my head as being relatively recent). If we are serious about stopping crimes like this before they occur, we need to be serious about making firearms more difficult to obtain.

I say don't bother with trying to ban everything, but make them more expensive instead. Require purchasers to place a significant bond when buying a firearm (maybe something like $5k or $10k and it would be refundable if they legally sell the firearm to somebody else when that purchaser places their bond) and then also be required to buy liability insurance. If you are buying a single-shot hunting rifle or shotgun, have taken a hunter's safety course, etc. your rates would be lower than somebody who's never had any training buying a semi-automatic handgun. Levy a federal excise tax on the ammunition and also close the gun-show loopholes and ability to buy firearms over the internet.
What part of 'infringed' do you not understand?

And none of what you propose will prevent the acquisition of guns illegally.


How about- you use a gun in a crime, you die. Period.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:04 PM   #30
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:05 PM   #31
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cant restrict to one door, from a fire safety point.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:07 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by BlooMule View Post
What part of 'infringed' do you not understand?

And none of what you propose will prevent the acquisition of guns illegally.
A tax is not an infringement.

I can think of quite a few ways you can design the tax, bond, and insurance system so that it makes it more attractive to keep the guns you purchase legally more secure and therefore less likely to get into the wrong hands. You can offer lower rates for purchasers of more secure gun safes or for firearms with biometric trigger mechanisms that can only be fired by the person who legally purchases it. If initially purchasing a firearm is more expensive, it will disincentivize more from ever being bought in the first place which will mean that there are fewer that could potentially fall into the wrong hands....

Yes, I understand tat you may never stop all criminals from getting guns but that doesn't mean we shouldn't bother making it more difficult.

Saying that we need more guns to prevent future gun violence is like saying we need more cancer to prevent future cancer or more AIDS to stop future AIDS.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:23 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WSU JK View Post
A tax is not an infringement.

I can think of quite a few ways you can design the tax, bond, and insurance system so that it makes it more attractive to keep the guns you purchase legally more secure and therefore less likely to get into the wrong hands. You can offer lower rates for purchasers of more secure gun safes or for firearms with biometric trigger mechanisms that can only be fired by the person who legally purchases it. If initially purchasing a firearm is more expensive, it will disincentivize more from ever being bought in the first place which will mean that there are fewer that could potentially fall into the wrong hands....

Yes, I understand tat you may never stop all criminals from getting guns but that doesn't mean we shouldn't bother making it more difficult.

Saying that we need more guns to prevent future gun violence is like saying we need more cancer to prevent future cancer or more AIDS to stop future AIDS.
totally agreed, now we need stiffer penalties for every crime, I'm talking dark ages stiff...make it so the world knows if you fukc up in the US you will be dealt with...start with the border jumpers, give them 30days to vacate or else, then with the petty crimes. I think we should be more like china with or criminal system
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:29 PM   #34
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At my kids school, during the school day there is only one door you can get in which goes to the office.
You have to be buzzed into the office for an ID check, and then buzzed out of the office to go either outside or into the school.
Similar thing has been instituted in my kid's school 3 years ago... At first I hated it, but have come to realize that this was the best thing. Ring door buzzer, look at camera, secretary let's you in if she knows who you are or comes to the door to see you if she doesn't... Kids and teachers may be near the door and will not open it... Not fool proof but pretty good system.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:32 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by WSU JK View Post
Here's something to chew on - there was an armed security officer at Columbine when they had the shootings there (in fact, if I recall correctly, there were actually two on duty there that day). Lot of good they did...

There was only one way into the school at Sandy Hook and the shooter blew the door off the hinges as he walked up to it and then shot the principal as soon as she stepped out of the office.

And only good guys with guns stop bad guys with guns? There was somebody in the crowd in Tucson who had a firearm with them - they didn't stop the shooter from killing six, including a 9-year-old girl.

An armed guard at every school sounds like a nice idea but it's just about as retarded as the guy making the argument. What about all the shootings that take place outside of schools? Oak Creek, Aurora, Tuscon (and those are just the ones I can remember off the top of my head as being relatively recent). If we are serious about stopping crimes like this before they occur, we need to be serious about making firearms more difficult to obtain.

I say don't bother with trying to ban everything, but make them more expensive instead. Require purchasers to place a significant bond when buying a firearm (maybe something like $5k or $10k and it would be refundable if they legally sell the firearm to somebody else when that purchaser places their bond) and then also be required to buy liability insurance. If you are buying a single-shot hunting rifle or shotgun, have taken a hunter's safety course, etc. your rates would be lower than somebody who's never had any training buying a semi-automatic handgun. Levy a federal excise tax on the ammunition and also close the gun-show loopholes and ability to buy firearms over the internet.
Was watching the news the other day, they were crediting the guard for lives saved at columbine. Students had time to escape and more would have died had that guard not been there. The mere knowledge that an intruder would be met with resistance would help prevent these mass shootings from happening. I just found out that my kids have LEOs walking the halls of their school, I didnt know this. It should be a well known thing in the community that armed guards are in the schools.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:33 PM   #36
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A tax is not an infringement.

Yes, it is. It makes it so that only those with money can legally own firearms. 2A does not say 'the right of the wealthy people'

I can think of quite a few ways you can design the tax, bond, and insurance system so that it makes it more attractive to keep the guns you purchase legally more secure and therefore less likely to get into the wrong hands. You can offer lower rates for purchasers of more secure gun safes or for firearms with biometric trigger mechanisms that can only be fired by the person who legally purchases it. If initially purchasing a firearm is more expensive, it will disincentivize more from ever being bought in the first place which will mean that there are fewer that could potentially fall into the wrong hands....

That sounds like a pretty good description of infringement

Yes, I understand tat you may never stop all criminals from getting guns but that doesn't mean we shouldn't bother making it more difficult.

Saying that we need more guns to prevent future gun violence is like saying we need more cancer to prevent future cancer or more AIDS to stop future AIDS.

And making more gun laws is like saying we need to cure cancer by making it illegal

Harsh penalties for using a gun to commit ANY crime will do a better job of deterring criminals, with the exception of the mentally ill, or those that wish to commit 'suicide by cop'.

Elimination of areas that a criminal knows will have no defense ( pistol free zones) will have a better chance of preventing attacks than trying to prevent criminals from obtaining guns- which even the most anti- 2A people admit will still occur illegally.

Switzerland has never been invaded. The Swiss are issued firearms, and adult males are required to serve in the military. Coincidence?

Military_of_Switzerland Military_of_Switzerland
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:34 PM   #37
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cant restrict to one door, from a fire safety point.
Restriction is for entering only, all doors open from the inside...
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:40 PM   #38
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:53 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by WSU JK View Post
A tax is not an infringement.

I can think of quite a few ways you can design the tax, bond, and insurance system so that it makes it more attractive to keep the guns you purchase legally more secure and therefore less likely to get into the wrong hands. You can offer lower rates for purchasers of more secure gun safes or for firearms with biometric trigger mechanisms that can only be fired by the person who legally purchases it. If initially purchasing a firearm is more expensive, it will disincentivize more from ever being bought in the first place which will mean that there are fewer that could potentially fall into the wrong hands....

Yes, I understand tat you may never stop all criminals from getting guns but that doesn't mean we shouldn't bother making it more difficult.

Saying that we need more guns to prevent future gun violence is like saying we need more cancer to prevent future cancer or more AIDS to stop future AIDS.
And this folks, is a prime example of the mentality of an enslaved man. An excessive tax on firearms is exactly how guns were banned under the racist Jim Crow laws in certain states.

I guess only rich people should have the right to self defense?
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 12:58 PM   #40
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Restriction is for entering only, all doors open from the inside...
Not necessarily......I went to high school in Detroit all doors were chained up except the front main entrance and the rear entrance that was for teachers only. Of course this was 20 years ago.....
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