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Old December 10th, 2012, 01:37 PM   #161
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Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
Then you do not need the union.

Pay should be merit/skill based. Not how long a person has been milking the system.
Should be but it never happens that way in the real world.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 01:43 PM   #162
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Or just be good at your profession..............there's always that option.
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Or people could just work hard if they want to go somewhere. The hard workers get rewarded and the lazy asses / dumb asses go nowhere or get fired. Sounds pretty fair to me!
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If you are working a job where the only think that keeps you above minimum wage is your union representation or dick sucking skills maybe you should consider obtaining some marketable skills. My pay rate, which is several times the minimum wage, is based on what I can provide to my employer.
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All of you that think RTW is a good Idea I hope oh all get laid off!
I spent 23 years doing my job and working hard. While at least 10-12 people that I know of wenr out drinking and smokeing dope everyday at lunch time and often times just during there shift. They are still working so do not give me that crap about doping a good job to get ahead. They are still working and I was fired. You guys need to get a feel for what it is like in the real world. And no I did not have union representration. I had no write ups and absolutely no attendennce problems. We voted the union out a couple years before that. You do know in Mi. at most places you are an "at will" employee and the company can fire you with out any reason. The reason I was fired never given one just told on one Thur. you are done pack your tools and hit the road. Thats what happens when you do not kiss ass.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 01:43 PM   #163
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I'm not saying that these people will I'm saying I hope they do. Normally I agree with you 99% of the time Bruce. But this your just way out in left field on. Where I work if the union shops in my company didnt make their 22 and some change and hour I wouldn't make my 35 and some change an hour. No I'm not union but I'm glad they are here to keep my wage high. I get paid incentive so the more efficient I work the more I make. Some weeks I drop a little less than the 35 dollar mark with inclement weather and such. Then there are weeks I make more. So if the union goes away so will our wages then there is no fear of us voting in the union.
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My pay rate is based on my skills and abilities. I don't have or need a union to over inflate my pay.
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Same as mine. If I was a union member I'd make a lot less. So since my company does not want the union in our shop I shouldn't be rewarded if I work hard?
Re-quoted for your convince where you very clearly stated that the reason you get the pay you get is because of the pay the union gets.

So it pretty much has to one or the other.

Either you get paid what you get paid because you have skills and abilities and work hard and are rewarded for it, and so the fact that there is a union has no effect. Or the presence of a union has over inflated your pay above what it would be in a free market, which is part of the problem.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 01:59 PM   #164
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I hate Unions personally. When I worked for UPS up until last spring the Union Agents were more or less useless. Drivers who were on the brink of retirement were getting canned for shit they always did (like taking too long at a stop because the person was disabled and they were waiting for them so that they would not need to bend over to get the package). Or another one got fired because his stop that they felt he was taking too long on had a very long driveway that you could not get down in the winter so he would have to walk it. They yelled at him for being over quota at that stop and told him to speed it up so he started jogging the driveway (UPS policy is safety first, walk don't run) and they canned him for following unsafe work methods. The Union did nothing in both cases to help these long time loyal drivers get their jobs back.

I could go all day long on events that happened there and how corrupt the Union really is. The Unions had their place back in the day, but in my eyes not so much anymore.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 02:03 PM   #165
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I spent 23 years doing my job and working hard. While at least 10-12 people that I know of wenr out drinking and smokeing dope everyday at lunch time and often times just during there shift. They are still working so do not give me that crap about doping a good job to get ahead. They are still working and I was fired. You guys need to get a feel for what it is like in the real world. And no I did not have union representration. I had no write ups and absolutely no attendennce problems. We voted the union out a couple years before that. You do know in Mi. at most places you are an "at will" employee and the company can fire you with out any reason. The reason I was fired never given one just told on one Thur. you are done pack your tools and hit the road. Thats what happens when you do not kiss ass.
You don't just suddenly get let go after 23 yrs without doing or saying something that pissed someone off. If you honestly believe that, maybe it's you that doesn't live in the real world. I know that's not the case, so something isn't right with that story.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 02:10 PM   #166
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unions spent more than 400 milion on the elections. i guess they can afford to lose some dues money.

Last edited by joe_jeep; December 10th, 2012 at 03:39 PM.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 02:11 PM   #167
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As I stated earlier if I dragged my feet all day I would make less. But I work hard and efficiently so I am rewarded. If it was not for the union shops in our state I would be paid less. Shops in other states like FL which is a RTW state the guys that do the same job as I and others at my shop make a flat rate of 12-14 an hour based on performance.

So if you want to say my wage is over inflated thats fine but I do the work of two guys everyday. So I earn two guys salary. If the company wanted they could cut my route in half and put another truck out there. But to them it does not make sense. If it was bad for the company to pay me what they do believe me they would not pay me what I get. Not everyone makes what I do there are plenty of guys that make less and many guys that make more.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 02:13 PM   #168
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You don't just suddenly get let go after 23 yrs without doing or saying something that pissed someone off. If you honestly believe that, maybe it's you that doesn't live in the real world. I know that's not the case, so something isn't right with that story.
I know exactly what you are saying and it is also what I would have said a few years back when I heard these things. That said it is also my belief that if they had really felt there was a ligitemate reason they would have not given me a chup buy out. They also never contested my unemployment so was there really a reason or was it just the my boss did not like me due to a personality conflict. I also believe it has to do with the fact that I was one of the top 10 in seniority so my wages and vacation were also toward the top. Get the old guys out and hire younger guys to work for less. Let me tell you I was not exactly getting rich though. The best year I ever had in those 23 years I made $38,000 and I worked lots of overtime that year.
When it is all said and done though I should probably thank them for getting rid of me as I really perfer the job I have now where I am my own boss. The pay is not that great but the working conditions are defineitly better.

Last edited by dmcjeep; December 10th, 2012 at 02:19 PM.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 02:17 PM   #169
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As I stated earlier if I dragged my feet all day I would make less. But I work hard and efficiently so I am rewarded. If it was not for the union shops in our state I would be paid less. Shops in other states like FL which is a RTW state the guys that do the same job as I and others at my shop make a flat rate of 12-14 an hour based on performance.

So if you want to say my wage is over inflated thats fine but I do the work of two guys everyday. So I earn two guys salary. If the company wanted they could cut my route in half and put another truck out there. But to them it does not make sense. If it was bad for the company to pay me what they do believe me they would not pay me what I get. Not everyone makes what I do there are plenty of guys that make less and many guys that make more.
Its sounds like you will be fine if this law passes.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 02:29 PM   #170
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unions spent more than 400 milion on the elections. i guess they can afford to lose some dues money. screw em.
Thats the fear that is driving the hard core protesting by the dems . . . buh bye gravey train!!
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Old December 10th, 2012, 02:48 PM   #171
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As I stated earlier if I dragged my feet all day I would make less. But I work hard and efficiently so I am rewarded. If it was not for the union shops in our state I would be paid less. Shops in other states like FL which is a RTW state the guys that do the same job as I and others at my shop make a flat rate of 12-14 an hour based on performance.

So if you want to say my wage is over inflated thats fine but I do the work of two guys everyday. So I earn two guys salary. If the company wanted they could cut my route in half and put another truck out there. But to them it does not make sense. If it was bad for the company to pay me what they do believe me they would not pay me what I get. Not everyone makes what I do there are plenty of guys that make less and many guys that make more.
How long have you been driving a garbage truck if you don't mind me asking?
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Old December 10th, 2012, 02:52 PM   #172
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How long have you been driving a garbage truck if you don't mind me asking?
Off and on with my company since 2002. I left the driving for a bit to do sales but returned this year to driving. But I have been driving truck since 1997.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 02:57 PM   #173
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Off and on with my company since 2002. I left the driving for a bit to do sales but returned this year to driving. But I have been driving truck since 1997.
Do you work for a smaller, privately owned company or big corporation like WM, Veola, etc.?
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Old December 10th, 2012, 03:29 PM   #174
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Do you work for a smaller, privately owned company or big corporation like WM, Veola, etc.?
I work for WM why do you ask? You in the trash industry?
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Old December 10th, 2012, 03:37 PM   #175
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I spent 23 years doing my job and working hard. While at least 10-12 people that I know of wenr out drinking and smokeing dope everyday at lunch time and often times just during there shift. They are still working so do not give me that crap about doping a good job to get ahead. They are still working and I was fired. You guys need to get a feel for what it is like in the real world. And no I did not have union representration. I had no write ups and absolutely no attendennce problems. We voted the union out a couple years before that. You do know in Mi. at most places you are an "at will" employee and the company can fire you with out any reason. The reason I was fired never given one just told on one Thur. you are done pack your tools and hit the road. Thats what happens when you do not kiss ass.
You are right. None of us have ever worked in any industry as we are all still high school kids.

I was held back by 2 unions. I have advanced in my career without the help of a union.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 03:55 PM   #176
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You are right. None of us have ever worked in any industry as we are all still high school kids.

I was held back by 2 unions. I have advanced in my career without the help of a union.
I am pretty sure that you are not all high school kids. I also have to believe that you have seen situations where people have been fired without any real reason union or not. It is what it is. I was fired from 2 jobs in my life. The first one when I was 13 and working cutting celery in a mud bog and the last one when I was 40 years older. Hopefully I will never have to go to work at a real job again. I think that I had my life planned out pretty good so if all goes well and I can afford to buy health insurance I should not have to get a job again. End of story. I will sign out of this tread for now. If anyone would care to chit chat about it off line I would be more than happy to explain more.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 03:55 PM   #177
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Good luck to everyone in whatever future endeavors you all are in. I truely hope that everyone has a good full life and can still be able to retire at a reasonable decent age. I really have no complaints so far. Job or no job. It is all about attitude.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 04:17 PM   #178
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Seems as the teachers are taking a stand according to the news reports.
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Old December 10th, 2012, 04:36 PM   #179
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Seems as the teachers are taking a stand according to the news reports.
Which means looking out for #1 (themselves as usual) and not the children.

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/T...z/-/index.html
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Old December 10th, 2012, 04:37 PM   #180
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In case anyone cares:

Obama blasts Michigan right-to-work legislation as politics
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/o...-election.html
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