MI right-to-work vote - Page 4 - Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest

Go Back   Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > Politics, Government, or Religion Chat
GL4x4 Live! GL4x4 Casino

Politics, Government, or Religion Chat Bring your flamesuit!

greatlakes4x4.com is the premier Great Lakes 4x4 Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Search
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old December 7th, 2012, 08:47 PM   #61
mudrunner456
Senior Member
 
mudrunner456's Avatar
 
Join Date: 10-29-06
Location: north muskegon, MI
Posts: 747
iTrader: (7)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

You know its really sad that when unions are talked about everyone thinks uaw. They are probely one of the biggest but by far not the only one. They may have in the past protected the lazy but i think that they are starting to get better. Good paying jobs without much education are hard to come by now. And if you want to keep one you have got to work hard and keep the people you work for happy just like any job. Union or not if an employer wants you gone they will find a way. All i know is i am a proud union member and i will always fight to save them.
mudrunner456 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old December 7th, 2012, 08:57 PM   #62
jeepmojo
Member
 
Join Date: 07-17-12
Location: Union City
Posts: 45
iTrader: (0)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

To all of you that claim UAW members get paid insane amounts of money for doing nothing:

I am a UAW Member. I work for $9.67/hr. Out of that I pay $57/week for insurance and once a month $20 in dues. Then of course Uncle Sam gets his cut. I bring home $250 a week to support a family of 5.



And as for Union Reps getting paid out the ass. I am the steward for my department and dont get any more pay than the people I represent.
jeepmojo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7th, 2012, 09:12 PM   #63
3stratman
Let's Go Red Wings!
 
3stratman's Avatar
 
Join Date: 12-27-08
Location: Michigan
Posts: 717
iTrader: (0)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

I've had a great dislike for unions ever since I came back to Michigan in '94. After working 10 years as a high voltage electrician in the Air Force, and then 2 years doing line work for companies in Colorado Springs and Indiana (with an outfit from N.C,) I came home and went to IBEW Local 17 in Detroit to inquire about work. They said they wouldn't even talk to me since my work experience was with non-union shops. Seriously? Line work is the same, union or not. And then, to top it off, a buddy in Indy told me to go talk to a union rep down there. Went and talked to him, and the next thing you know I'm taking the journeyman test, passed it and am getting an offer to work with a contractor right away. Except I wanted to be here with the wife and kids so I declined the offer.

The all union or nothing clowns at Local 17 can still kiss my ass 18 years later.

And anyway, I don't think RTW is really going to affect the union shops much, since I'm sure they simply won't hire anyone who won't join their union. Unless many of their existing employees cancel their union memberships.
3stratman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7th, 2012, 09:18 PM   #64
barry1me
Just another day
 
barry1me's Avatar
 
Join Date: 06-09-06
Location: Howell, MI
Posts: 3,026
iTrader: (9)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

My cousin is a union rep that works at autoalliance in Flatrock and she always brags about not working and giving everyone a hard time. Im pretty sure she is rocking 100-120k a year.
barry1me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7th, 2012, 10:25 PM   #65
scottie
American Leyland??
 
scottie's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: not in Georgia
Posts: 8,517
iTrader: (2)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to scottie
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepmojo View Post
To all of you that claim UAW members get paid insane amounts of money for doing nothing:

I am a UAW Member. I work for $9.67/hr. Out of that I pay $57/week for insurance and once a month $20 in dues. Then of course Uncle Sam gets his cut. I bring home $250 a week to support a family of 5.



And as for Union Reps getting paid out the ass. I am the steward for my department and dont get any more pay than the people I represent.

So why are you still working there?
scottie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 03:10 AM   #66
brewmenn
Grumpy old man.
 
brewmenn's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Inkster, MI
Posts: 10,579
iTrader: (9)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scottie View Post
so why are you still working there?
x98457209348562093487650293486509
brewmenn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 05:29 AM   #67
Rob the plumber
Licensed master plumber
 
Rob the plumber's Avatar
 
Join Date: 06-14-06
Location: New Baltimore, Michigan
Posts: 5,788
iTrader: (34)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

My only concern is for wages across the board. Plumbers/tradesman make significantly less, on the average, in non-Union States. States like Florida pay licensed plumbers around $16-$18/hr. I am self employed now, but made between $26 and $35 an hour at jobs here for the last 10+ years.
Rob the plumber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 07:28 AM   #68
alterego
Senior Member
 
alterego's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-05-11
Location: Ionia County / Michigan
Posts: 199
iTrader: (0)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

I have worked at union mechanical contractors offices for 22 years. As a project manager, and estimator, estimating and running work. Their are goods and bads on both sides union or not.

This change will drive the over all wages down, along with the standard of living for all.

The economy needs to be inflated right now, our economy will not survive,

Substantially lower reproductive rate,
Substantially higher percentage of individuals retired drawing medicare medicade and social security.
More people drawing public assistance than ever before.

All of the items above are paid for via a percentage of the over all payroll tax.

If the payroll amounts are driven down, even if the percentage paid after we go over the fiscal cliff is higher, it will not make up the differance.

The government is busy trying to bring our standard of living down to make us more competative with the third world countrys. Yet they are passing legislation that will entitle every one to every thing.

This is an unsustainable path, it can not succede.

The countrys that we are trying to compete with should not be allowed to import their goods into our country unless they meet our same, safety, environmental, wage, retirement, and social requirements, not the other way around.

To all of you morons saying the unions pay rediculous too high of wages, you are welcome to work for minimum wage for the rest of your life, stop trying to bring every one down to serfdom.
alterego is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 07:31 AM   #69
knaffie
Senior Member
 
knaffie's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-13-08
Location: home is where I hang my hat
Posts: 1,916
iTrader: (11)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by alterego View Post
To all of you morons saying the unions pay rediculous too high of wages, you are welcome to work for minimum wage for the rest of your life, stop trying to bring every one down to serfdom.
The people who are talking about union wages being too high aren't morons, they are RIGHT.
knaffie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 07:51 AM   #70
alterego
Senior Member
 
alterego's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-05-11
Location: Ionia County / Michigan
Posts: 199
iTrader: (0)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default union wages

Quote:
Originally Posted by knaffie View Post
The people who are talking about union wages being too high aren't morons, they are RIGHT.
I have estimated and ran work for union and non union plumbing and mechanical contractors that were bid competatively with public bid openings for over 22 years.

The owners of the union contractors and the non union contractors were all millionairs.

I have seen people working for 18 dollars next to people making 35 dollars doing the same work for 22 years on competatively bid public bid opening projects.

If you want to work for less and justify in your mind that the other guy is being paid to much, you too are a moron.
alterego is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 08:05 AM   #71
knaffie
Senior Member
 
knaffie's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-13-08
Location: home is where I hang my hat
Posts: 1,916
iTrader: (11)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by alterego View Post
I have estimated and ran work for union and non union plumbing and mechanical contractors that were bid competatively with public bid openings for over 22 years.

The owners of the union contractors and the non union contractors were all millionairs.

I have seen people working for 18 dollars next to people making 35 dollars doing the same work for 22 years on competatively bid public bid opening projects.

If you want to work for less and justify in your mind that the other guy is being paid to much, you too are a moron.
Nope, I am a not a moron. I'm a realist. Just because things are, doesn't mean they should be. Unskilled labor does not deserve to be paid the same wage or more than trained, degreed, highly-skilled workers. Especially so when those people sit on their ass and do nothing for most of the day. The unions have been out of control for years. You can fill thousands of pages with real life examples.

Something has to and will soon change. Shout all you want, it will not keep the sinking ship from going down.
knaffie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 08:21 AM   #72
jimhri
Senior Member
 
jimhri's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-17-07
Location: it's Tuesday so it must be Belguim
Posts: 3,378
iTrader: (3)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by phittie1100 View Post
I was disappointed to see on the news that a number of Democrats simply walked out of the session instead of casting a vote - repeating a pattern established in WI recently when similar legislation was being voted on. How does that benefit the people who elected them (or in my case the guy I am stuck with because everyone else in town voted for him)? I can see standing up for your principles, and I can respect that even if I don't agree with your position, but I don't see how walking out and not representing any of your constituents accomplishes anything other than ?
perhaps their walking out was a way to prevent to need to publically vote against something they/their constituents didn't want and the rep did not want to expose themselves to the union's rath.
jimhri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 08:32 AM   #73
jimhri
Senior Member
 
jimhri's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-17-07
Location: it's Tuesday so it must be Belguim
Posts: 3,378
iTrader: (3)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

and two other things:
1] have read that in situations where a union member claims they cannot pay dues for religious or other reasons, the union may charge them a processing fee each month for not taking their money which is greater than the amount of the dues. punishing

2] read this morning how one union member from WI said the michigan vote is a means to kill unions. B.S.
.....a] what should a guy in WI care about here in MI and why is he here protesting in OUR capital?
.....b] also, i welcome unions to the free market place. just like all you business owners out there, the union is going to have to compete in the market for membership. they are going to have to prove they have a product to sell that people want to buy. no more automatic subsidy by forcing the unwilling to pay dues for a service they may not want. forcing union dues payment is another form of taxation or corporate welfare to a non-corporate entity.
jimhri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 10:48 AM   #74
3stratman
Let's Go Red Wings!
 
3stratman's Avatar
 
Join Date: 12-27-08
Location: Michigan
Posts: 717
iTrader: (0)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Worth a listen...http://www.wjrpodcasts.com/podcasts/...orkNumbers.mp3
3stratman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 10:55 AM   #75
camccardell
tiger blood
 
camccardell's Avatar
 
Join Date: 10-14-08
Location: Homer MI
Posts: 1,361
iTrader: (20)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by knaffie View Post
The people who are talking about union wages being too high aren't morons, they are RIGHT.
So making $20 an hour is too high a wage?
camccardell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 11:40 AM   #76
Rebel2345
NOT GL4x4SucksVideo guy.
 
Rebel2345's Avatar
 
Join Date: 02-01-07
Location: MI
Posts: 3,091
iTrader: (6)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by camccardell View Post
So making $20 an hour is too high a wage?
To push buttons in a Hostess factory? Yes.
Rebel2345 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 11:51 AM   #77
montecarlo33
The Violator
 
montecarlo33's Avatar
 
Join Date: 08-23-07
Location: Otsego County 49735
Posts: 4,617
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by camccardell View Post
So making $20 an hour is too high a wage?
to put nut a on bolt b straight out of high school or dropped out like people did in the automotive rush? yes.
montecarlo33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 12:20 PM   #78
XXXJ
Desert Rat
 
XXXJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-09-07
Location: Memphis, Mi
Posts: 5,663
iTrader: (13)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

For me, Prop 4 on the 2012 ballot is the face of labor unions.
XXXJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 12:44 PM   #79
Ebs
Senior Member
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: MI
Posts: 3,396
iTrader: (8)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by alterego View Post

The economy needs to be inflated right now, our economy will not survive,
Google 'wage-price spiral'.

It's silly and illogical to think you can artificially jack up wages and everything else will remain the same.

It's not my place to say if someone is overpaid or not. However, wages are subject to supply and demand just like anything else. The basic model would suggest, if the supply of available workers exceeds the current demand for labor, a decrease in wages is needed.
Ebs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2012, 04:54 PM   #80
Nuggets
I fix stuff!
 
Nuggets's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-15-06
Location: Bay City, MI
Posts: 13,456
iTrader: (13)
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yetti View Post
well if its any consolation all the people who work hard at sucking managers dicks will have loads of knee time to look forward too. as it will be the only thing to keep you on the job after you crush the unions
Hmmm..... I've never sucked any managers dicks in the 36 years in the work force. All I've done in the past is take interest in my job and go above and beyond to learn extra things that would be of value. Most every place I've worked I was the top dog pay wise but I tried extra hard to add value to my position. And all this without a Union (or "knee time").
Nuggets is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > Politics, Government, or Religion Chat

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:38 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright 2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd. Runs best on HiVelocity Hosting.
Page generated in 1.42654 seconds with 81 queries