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Old February 23rd, 2012, 07:37 AM   #61
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Tab (and everyone else for that matter) is giving you good advice. You really need to complete the installation as outlined in Rustys instructions. They have tons of these kits out on the roads and trails and have for several years. I would guess that your Jeep is no different then all the others running it.

I just breezed through this quick so forgive me if this has already been stated. Radius arm setups require a lot of load to flex. You are basically binding the front suspension as soon as the front axle begins to articulate. The arm design turns the front axle into a torsion tube. You will not have enough force in the static situation you are in to properly flex the suspension to its full potential. Plus, I think you are getting the cart in front of the horse by not completing the installation and testing it. This will allow you to see if there is really a problem and then be able to accurately share that issue with Rustys tech support so they can better help you. Plus the worst thing you can do is start changing things before you are completely done with the install. You are going to "fix" a preceived problem and most likely screw something else up down the line.

My only other little bit of advice is that the track bar should be the last thing you install. This needs to be adjusted and installed with the suspension complete and the full weight of the vehicle on the suspension (setting at ride height). That will be the point when you adjust the length to match the mount to mount distance when the axle is center under the vehicle. If you have the track bar installed and axle center with the suspension at full extension it is going to bind like crazy when you try to compress it.

The best solution is to just buy one of our 4 link long arm kits and be happy you switched Sorry, just had to throw that in there since I was giving out free advice.
Correct on all counts.
I tried to explain the radius design but not sure it's getting through.
I'm done until it is run for real.
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 09:01 AM   #62
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Finish install. Drive. Report back.



Fuck you are making this difficult.
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 10:27 AM   #63
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finish install. Drive. Report back.



Fuck you are making this difficult.
x 10000000000000000000000000.9
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 12:48 PM   #64
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Finish install. Drive. Report back.



Fuck you are making this difficult.
im asking questions so if i do still have probs after the installation is complete i know what i have to do to correct the probs. i am finishing it theway it is and will try it. because of the quetions i asked i have a better understanding of what its going on and why thanks toall the helpful people on here. if u feel im making it difficult then you dont have to feel obligated to respond. thanks for all the good info and ill post some pics and let everyone know what happens as soon as its complete. thanks again.
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 12:53 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt-BDS View Post
Tab (and everyone else for that matter) is giving you good advice. You really need to complete the installation as outlined in Rustys instructions. They have tons of these kits out on the roads and trails and have for several years. I would guess that your Jeep is no different then all the others running it.

I just breezed through this quick so forgive me if this has already been stated. Radius arm setups require a lot of load to flex. You are basically binding the front suspension as soon as the front axle begins to articulate. The arm design turns the front axle into a torsion tube. You will not have enough force in the static situation you are in to properly flex the suspension to its full potential. Plus, I think you are getting the cart in front of the horse by not completing the installation and testing it. This will allow you to see if there is really a problem and then be able to accurately share that issue with Rustys tech support so they can better help you. Plus the worst thing you can do is start changing things before you are completely done with the install. You are going to "fix" a preceived problem and most likely screw something else up down the line.

My only other little bit of advice is that the track bar should be the last thing you install. This needs to be adjusted and installed with the suspension complete and the full weight of the vehicle on the suspension (setting at ride height). That will be the point when you adjust the length to match the mount to mount distance when the axle is center under the vehicle. If you have the track bar installed and axle center with the suspension at full extension it is going to bind like crazy when you try to compress it.

The best solution is to just buy one of our 4 link long arm kits and be happy you switched Sorry, just had to throw that in there since I was giving out free advice.
appricate the free adviseand i will still check out your 4 link kit cause i didnt know one was avalable. and i did set up the trac bar with weight of jeep on it and then dissisambled it to correct a few prob i was having during the mockup. thank you very much forinfo
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 01:52 PM   #66
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appricate the free adviseand i will still check out your 4 link kit cause i didnt know one was avalable. and i did set up the trac bar with weight of jeep on it and then dissisambled it to correct a few prob i was having during the mockup. thank you very much forinfo
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 07:29 PM   #67
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well there is allways beer in the garage and i can say for shure i owe a few to several of you guys lol anytime u want to collect lmk
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Old February 28th, 2012, 05:15 PM   #68
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well got the suspension setup and drag link centered and sitting on its own and temp set the knuckles back on and steering and to no surprise they are at diff angles. so i guess i have 2 options and any input on which is right way to go would help alot.

1 do crossover steering with a stock pitman arm and raise the trac bar up some but keep tight to coil kind like in pic from earlyer but not as high so trac bar should still have a good length.

2 run the steering mounted like now and the couple inch drop pitman arm and then raise trac bar up very little and inside to correct the angle but that would put draglink and trac bar still at a steeper angle. also going 1ton tre or heim joints eather way.

or if there is anyother ideas please any help would br appricated. thanks guys
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Old February 28th, 2012, 06:04 PM   #69
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Don't look at the bars themselves, but instead draw imaginary lines between the mounting points. I can't see where the axle side track bar mount is, but I took a swag in this pic, and seems reasonable to me.

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Old February 28th, 2012, 06:11 PM   #70
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I wonder how many times people are going to say trust Rusty's and put it together before he puts it together.
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Old February 28th, 2012, 06:15 PM   #71
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wait wat if it works? you mean this isn't the first kit they sold?
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Old February 28th, 2012, 06:28 PM   #72
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I wonder how many times people are going to say trust Rusty's and put it together before he puts it together.
Lol i never said i didnt trust the trac bar and this kit was made for a dana 30 with lower steeringunder the knuckle not like my wagoneer setup. I am trying to just make shure its right cause if not i would rather correct it now while its appart and parked. I just would like to make it drive the best it possably can so i can enjoy it . I guess im worried about the twist that is now going to be worston the tierod because of the steeper angle of the draglink.
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Old February 28th, 2012, 06:36 PM   #73
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Is this seriously still a subject????
Buy the pitman arm that they normally sell with the kit and bolt it on.....
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Old February 28th, 2012, 06:38 PM   #74
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wait wat if it works? you mean this isn't the first kit they sold?
Shure they have sold tons but prob not somany for my setup thats all since there telling me oppsite then what i have been told on here. Im going with what u guys are saying and not doing a ota trac bar right away thats all so i guess thats means i am listening to wghat u guys are saying after all. I really do like everyones insite thats all
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Old February 28th, 2012, 06:42 PM   #75
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There is no kit for this setup since its not the factory axle or steering. The drop arm that i didnt show in pic because it makes stering at alot less of an angle and farther off the tracbar. Out of the three drop pitman arms i have this is the best so far just wasnt shure if it was enough
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Old February 28th, 2012, 06:47 PM   #76
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I have just the pitman arm for you. With high steer arm attached already
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Old February 28th, 2012, 06:55 PM   #77
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I am just trying to do it right. More pitman means less angle on draglink and farther from trac bar angle. I know that much just not shure what is best thats all
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Old February 28th, 2012, 06:56 PM   #78
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Lol i never said i didnt trust the trac bar and this kit was made for a dana 30 with lower steeringunder the knuckle not like my wagoneer setup. I am trying to just make shure its right cause if not i would rather correct it now while its appart and parked. I just would like to make it drive the best it possably can so i can enjoy it . I guess im worried about the twist that is now going to be worston the tierod because of the steeper angle of the draglink.
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Originally Posted by CHEROKEEMUDMAN01 View Post
Shure they have sold tons but prob not somany for my setup thats all since there telling me oppsite then what i have been told on here. Im going with what u guys are saying and not doing a ota trac bar right away thats all so i guess thats means i am listening to wghat u guys are saying after all. I really do like everyones insite thats all
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Originally Posted by CHEROKEEMUDMAN01 View Post
There is no kit for this setup since its not the factory axle or steering. The drop arm that i didnt show in pic because it makes stering at alot less of an angle and farther off the tracbar. Out of the three drop pitman arms i have this is the best so far just wasnt shure if it was enough
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Old February 28th, 2012, 07:12 PM   #79
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Holy shit....

I didnt even read all of it but this will be my 5 minutes of gl4x4 for this month.

1- your shit is bound up worse than a senior's center that ran out of prune juice.

2- lower it as much as possible. mock it up at full stuff without springs or shocks, take pictures- ask for advice- take 95% of the advice is BS someone heard from someones friend who knew someone who built a pulling trucks suspension and knows everything about making something that quite literally does not move.

3- now, for the real world "DUH!!!!!!!!!!!" take the bolt out of one of the frame side lower links, drop the same side of the axle about a foot, now you can drink a beer and take another dosage of wheaties for the day.... try to lift the lower control arm that is unbolted and nowhere near where it should be and attemp to put it back into place on the frame bracket. it aint gonna happen. the dual radius arm style front ends some of the less than intelligent self proclaimed experts of designing and making a sellable suspension kit for those vehicles would rather make a cheaper part than a properly functioning system. basically, you need compliance in something (OEM systems are in the large deflection the rubber joints offer) as you replace the compliant joints with rigid joints you force the deflection to come from the next weakest link. in the case, you have a built in sway bar.

4- once you establish where your ride height will be, make the track bar mount on the axle side as high as reasonably possible, find a way to put high steer on it so you can have a vehicle that drives predictably by getting the angles and lengths of the track bar and drag link in a reasonable range for what you are working with.

5- just because the track bar and drag link are paralell it doesnt mean you wont have bump steer. you can get bump steer simply by the amount of sweep the huge angle on the track bar. just like bump steer, the axle shifting side to side means the axle is shifting relative to the body rather than the axle shifting relative to the steering wheel. granted, it's not quite as significant as the typical bump steer that everyone has come to associate with the term but the body still turns relative to the axle as you hit a bump.

6- put bushings in with more compliance, get rid of the dual radius arms in favor of a stock style 4 link with a track bar

7- figure out whats wrong with the kit, sell it, then buy an engineered system, or take on a new project, or pay someone to do it correctly.

8- ill probably show back up in another 6 months-or so....

9-

10-

ok, I lied, 5 minutes turned into 3 times that... gotta go!
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Old March 1st, 2012, 06:56 PM   #80
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I hear crickets!

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