Go Back   Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > The Pub
GL4x4 Live! GL4x4 Casino

The Pub A friendly forum where everybody is nice, and will answer any questions you have about life.







Search
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old July 31st, 2011, 02:24 PM   #1
FlatFender
Tap Tap Splat
 
FlatFender's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Raleigh NC
Posts: 15,667
iTrader: (1)
10 years after MI CCW law "No big deal"

http://www.freep.com/article/2011073...text|FRONTPAGE

Awesome. Good to see it in a positive light...

Quote:
"My position was, and still is, is that the people we have a problem with with guns aren't the people who are willing to follow the law and go through the hoops and training," Bouchard said.
Awesome. Ya'll vote for him again!

Last edited by FlatFender; July 31st, 2011 at 02:28 PM.
FlatFender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 02:34 PM   #2
bbrancheau
BLB CONCRETE
 
bbrancheau's Avatar
 
Join Date: 06-30-09
Location: Petersburg Michigan
Posts: 525
iTrader: (3)
bbrancheau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 02:57 PM   #3
Hombre
I carry a shank
 
Hombre's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-15-06
Location: Michigan
Posts: 4,423
iTrader: (0)
This is not accurate. Only 2% of CPL holders have been SANCTIONED for gun violations. I personally have been present on two separate murders where CPL holders have murdered people with firearms.

There is NO CRITERIA for keeping statistics on how many CPL holders commit murders on both the state and federal levels. And those are the fucking facts.

P.S. I don't really give a fukc . im drinking whiskey and shooting gophers so fukc off. What I said is true though.
__________________
reptile610 says:"Owning a CJ is for manly men, they allows you to do manly stuff like auto mechanics and welding and drinking beer. Manly men own CJs. Manly men do not drive hummers, they receive them."

,[____l,
_ -o==o-_
) ()_) ()_)
Hombre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 03:06 PM   #4
FlatFender
Tap Tap Splat
 
FlatFender's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Raleigh NC
Posts: 15,667
iTrader: (1)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hombre View Post
This is not accurate. Only 2% of CPL holders have been SANCTIONED for gun violations. I personally have been present on two separate murders where CPL holders have murdered people with firearms.

There is NO CRITERIA for keeping statistics on how many CPL holders commit murders on both the state and federal levels. And those are the fucking facts.

P.S. I don't really give a fukc . im drinking whiskey and shooting gophers so fukc off. What I said is true though.
Does the state not keep statistics on how many permits have been revoked? Here in NC, I can pull it up right on the SBI website.
http://www.ncdoj.gov/CHPStats.aspx
FlatFender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 03:08 PM   #5
Hombre
I carry a shank
 
Hombre's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-15-06
Location: Michigan
Posts: 4,423
iTrader: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlatFender View Post
Does the state not keep statistics on how many permits have been revoked? Here in NC, I can pull it up right on the SBI website.
http://www.ncdoj.gov/CHPStats.aspx
When you have a permit and you murder somebody the ccw issue doesn't matter. you get a two year felony firearm charge in addition to the murder. The permit will just die a natural death and not be renewed while the guys in prison. It's all fucked up.
__________________
reptile610 says:"Owning a CJ is for manly men, they allows you to do manly stuff like auto mechanics and welding and drinking beer. Manly men own CJs. Manly men do not drive hummers, they receive them."

,[____l,
_ -o==o-_
) ()_) ()_)
Hombre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 03:09 PM   #6
steveo
In the band!
 
Join Date: 03-30-07
Location: montana/wyoming
Posts: 20,293
iTrader: (6)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hombre View Post
This is not accurate. Only 2% of CPL holders have been SANCTIONED for gun violations. I personally have been present on two separate murders where CPL holders have murdered people with firearms.
please explain further.
steveo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 03:11 PM   #7
Hombre
I carry a shank
 
Hombre's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-15-06
Location: Michigan
Posts: 4,423
iTrader: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by steveo View Post
please explain further.
County gun boards only usually meet monthly. They aren't always on top of things. Guy murders somebody and goes to prison. Good enough....oops! We forgot to pull his CPL.

Statistics lie!
__________________
reptile610 says:"Owning a CJ is for manly men, they allows you to do manly stuff like auto mechanics and welding and drinking beer. Manly men own CJs. Manly men do not drive hummers, they receive them."

,[____l,
_ -o==o-_
) ()_) ()_)
Hombre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 03:12 PM   #8
steveo
In the band!
 
Join Date: 03-30-07
Location: montana/wyoming
Posts: 20,293
iTrader: (6)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hombre View Post
County gun boards only usually meet monthly. They aren't always on top of things. Guy murders somebody and goes to prison. Good enough....oops! We forgot to pull his CPL.

Statistics lie!
I meant the murders you witnessed. please give more details.
steveo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 03:13 PM   #9
Hombre
I carry a shank
 
Hombre's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-15-06
Location: Michigan
Posts: 4,423
iTrader: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by steveo View Post
I meant the murders you witnessed. please give more details.
I'm not that drunk, biotch!
__________________
reptile610 says:"Owning a CJ is for manly men, they allows you to do manly stuff like auto mechanics and welding and drinking beer. Manly men own CJs. Manly men do not drive hummers, they receive them."

,[____l,
_ -o==o-_
) ()_) ()_)
Hombre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 03:14 PM   #10
steveo
In the band!
 
Join Date: 03-30-07
Location: montana/wyoming
Posts: 20,293
iTrader: (6)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hombre View Post
I'm not that drunk, biotch!
were they crimes of passion, unjustified killings, etc?
steveo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 03:24 PM   #11
Hombre
I carry a shank
 
Hombre's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-15-06
Location: Michigan
Posts: 4,423
iTrader: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by steveo View Post
were they crimes of passion, unjustified killings, etc?
They were people that fucking shot somebody and may not have if they had not had such easy access to a handgun and that is the honest truth. They were murders, not justified by any stretch.

I'm not anti gun and you know it but that is the absolute truth. I look at it as survival of the fittest.
__________________
reptile610 says:"Owning a CJ is for manly men, they allows you to do manly stuff like auto mechanics and welding and drinking beer. Manly men own CJs. Manly men do not drive hummers, they receive them."

,[____l,
_ -o==o-_
) ()_) ()_)
Hombre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 03:27 PM   #12
steveo
In the band!
 
Join Date: 03-30-07
Location: montana/wyoming
Posts: 20,293
iTrader: (6)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hombre View Post
They were people that fucking shot somebody and may not have if they had not had such easy access to a handgun and that is the honest truth. They were murders, not justified by any stretch.

I'm not anti gun and you know it but that is the absolute truth. I look at it as survival of the fittest.
Here is the kicker, what you consider justified, what i consider justified and what a grand jury consider justified may differ a lot. For example. Someone cuts me in line at the grocery store. I shoot them 37 times. IMO, that's justified.
steveo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 03:33 PM   #13
Hombre
I carry a shank
 
Hombre's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-15-06
Location: Michigan
Posts: 4,423
iTrader: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by steveo View Post
Here is the kicker, what you consider justified, what i consider justified and what a grand jury consider justified may differ a lot. For example. Someone cuts me in line at the grocery store. I shoot them 37 times. IMO, that's justified.
Makes sense to me. Carry on.
__________________
reptile610 says:"Owning a CJ is for manly men, they allows you to do manly stuff like auto mechanics and welding and drinking beer. Manly men own CJs. Manly men do not drive hummers, they receive them."

,[____l,
_ -o==o-_
) ()_) ()_)
Hombre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 07:55 PM   #14
homerdogeo8
booger eatin' moron
 
homerdogeo8's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-06-08
Location: St Johns
Posts: 2,329
iTrader: (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hombre View Post
They were people that fucking shot somebody and may not have if they had not had such easy access to a handgun and that is the honest truth. They were murders, not justified by any stretch.

I'm not anti gun and you know it but that is the absolute truth. I look at it as survival of the fittest.
You wouldn't happen to be related to that cop in Ohio that likes to threaten people with death if they hold a CPL would you?
homerdogeo8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2011, 11:46 PM   #15
jeepguy74
Senior Member
 
jeepguy74's Avatar
 
Join Date: 08-14-06
Location: wellston (west of cadillac)
Posts: 2,861
iTrader: (22)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hombre View Post
County gun boards only usually meet monthly. They aren't always on top of things. Guy murders somebody and goes to prison. Good enough....oops! We forgot to pull his CPL.

Statistics lie!
this is only partly true...
you go to jail for a felony when you get out you are not even alowed to have a firearm in your house let alone own or carry one...

true they meet maybe 2 times a month but at least once...however there is other things considered threw the pprocess also

Last edited by jeepguy74; July 31st, 2011 at 11:56 PM.
jeepguy74 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2011, 01:42 PM   #16
slongfellowii
Newbie
 
Join Date: 12-16-07
Location: Grand Rapids Michigan
Posts: 26
iTrader: (1)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hombre View Post
They were people that fucking shot somebody and may not have if they had not had such easy access to a handgun and that is the honest truth. They were murders, not justified by any stretch.

I'm not anti gun and you know it but that is the absolute truth. I look at it as survival of the fittest.
They would have had the same access to purphase if they didn't have a cpl. I believe FFL still have to run the same check if you have a cpl or purchase permit.
slongfellowii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2011, 01:47 PM   #17
RyeBread
Catch the wave
 
RyeBread's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-08-05
Location: Fenton
Posts: 7,936
iTrader: (2)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hombre View Post
They were people that fucking shot somebody and may not have if they had not had such easy access to a handgun and that is the honest truth. They were murders, not justified by any stretch.

I'm not anti gun and you know it but that is the absolute truth. I look at it as survival of the fittest.
they would have just stabbed them repeatedly with a spork instead, and the victim would probably still be just as dead.

I think we should have spork registration laws...
RyeBread is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2011, 02:00 PM   #18
jeepinRRT
Senior Member
 
jeepinRRT's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-13-08
Location: Grand Rapids,MI
Posts: 3,621
iTrader: (9)
Quote:
Originally Posted by RyeBread View Post
they would have just stabbed them repeatedly with a spork instead, and the victim would probably still be just as dead.

I think we should have spork registration laws...
No kidding, I mean just imagine if prisoners were able to kill each other while locked up. Glad they don't have guns in prison...... oh....... wait......
jeepinRRT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2011, 02:53 PM   #19
Haggar
Covered in mud...
 
Haggar's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-06-05
Location: Oxford, MI
Posts: 17,381
iTrader: (52)
The funny thing is both sides of the issue kind of point at it and spin it into a win.

People having CPLs haven't seemed to appreciably increase crime/violence. (i.e. worryworts were wrong)

on the other hand

People having CPLs haven't seemed to appreciably decrease crime/violence. (i.e. your big tough gun doesn't change anything)


In the end, its likely that a small number of crimes will be averted due to someone carrying.

And

In the end, its likely that a small number of crimes will be committed (or worsened) due to someone carrying.


End result: Who cares.
Haggar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2011, 03:16 PM   #20
FlatFender
Tap Tap Splat
 
FlatFender's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Raleigh NC
Posts: 15,667
iTrader: (1)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haggar View Post
The funny thing is both sides of the issue kind of point at it and spin it into a win.

People having CPLs haven't seemed to appreciably increase crime/violence. (i.e. worryworts were wrong)

on the other hand

People having CPLs haven't seemed to appreciably decrease crime/violence. (i.e. your big tough gun doesn't change anything)


In the end, its likely that a small number of crimes will be averted due to someone carrying.

And

In the end, its likely that a small number of crimes will be committed (or worsened) due to someone carrying.


End result: Letting people exercise their freedoms doesn't hurt anything.
There are certainly people who are alive today, in Michigan, because they were able to legally defend their own life with a firearm. I dont know anyone who carries a gun to deter crime, I carry a gun to defend MY life. I dont carry to be a hero, or to pretend to be a police officer. If there is a crime being committed, and I'm not directly involved, my ass will be moving in the opposite direction, whether I'm armed or not.

Last edited by FlatFender; August 1st, 2011 at 03:20 PM.
FlatFender is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > The Pub
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:29 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright 2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2005 - 2012 Cracker Enterprises - Powered by Linux
vB Ad Management by =RedTyger=
Page generated in 0.22132 seconds with 50 queries