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Old February 8th, 2011, 07:02 PM   #61
Tranny Tom
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There is a lot of good exhaust tech in this thread:
http://www.greatlakes4x4.com/showthread.php?t=162568

































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Old February 8th, 2011, 08:41 PM   #62
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Looking great Jesus!
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Old February 9th, 2011, 11:30 AM   #63
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What are you using for gaskets? I can't find it now, but don't the exhaust ports have different sized openings from the LS1 and the 5.3/6.0?
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Old February 9th, 2011, 12:16 PM   #64
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No, they are all round ports. For these, you just use high temp RTV, no gaskets....
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Old February 11th, 2011, 08:40 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haggar View Post
No, they are all round ports. For these, you just use high temp RTV, no gaskets....
Use an OEM MLS gasket..... If it's really not flat then stack 2 of them or deck the mating face and cut it in just the right spot to allow it to move.... If you are curious as to where just ask.

RTV for an exhaust manifold? Seriously? Come on...... OEM MLS is the only thing that lasts for any amount of time.
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Old February 12th, 2011, 10:45 AM   #66
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Just going on Sandersons instructions:

The Patented Leak-Free Design that Sanderson Headers offer you is the only leak-free flange design on the market ... Do Not Attempt To Use Flange Gaskets! The raised flange on the Sanderson Headers will buckle the gasket during tightening and actually cause a leak!

Attached Images
File Type: gif no_gaskets_vert.gif (43.5 KB, 535 views)
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Old February 12th, 2011, 11:17 AM   #67
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Post a picture of the "raised flange"..... The exhaust manifold flange needs to slip on the head face or the bolts break. Since those have a "rasied" area that has a higher pressure locally, when it does move its going to wear into the exhaust face on the head.

That is a shitty design for an aluminum head.
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Old February 12th, 2011, 12:27 PM   #68
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Packing for Mexico at the moment, will look at them when I get back. I am not too worried about it, there's likely thousands of others using Sandersons on AL headed Gen IIIs over the last 13 years.
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Old February 12th, 2011, 04:43 PM   #69
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So, suppose it will work worth a shit.... This stuff is only good to 700f...

http://www.permatex.com/products/Aut...sket_Maker.htm

And then you still have the raised area digging into the heads and moving all over the place.

Exhaust manifold sealing isnt rocket science but it does not get the respect it deserves in the aftermarket.

Kooks $1200 stainless headers, somes with junk 8.8 bolts and graphite coated gaskets. After about 3k miles the car sounded like it had a collapsed lifter.... Gasket blew out and was chattering. Put an OEM MLS in it and never had another issue.

At least I now know to stay away from sanderson headers! Let us know how it works out.
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Old February 12th, 2011, 07:32 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95geo View Post
and moving all over the place.
This part I have to agree with. I am using a set of OEM metal gaskets and about every 1000 miles they start to make noise. I loosen the header bolts, wiggle the headers a little and tighten them back up. Then they seal up again for another 1000 miles. I will be looking into these MLS gaskets to see what it's all about...

Edit: Well, 5 minutes of research and I think I am already using the MLS gaskets. Although they are the best ones I have used so far, they are still less than ideal for me. I suppose it could be the the $225 Hooker headers causing my grief. All I know is that I am not thrilled with my results/experience.

Last edited by John D; February 12th, 2011 at 07:41 PM.
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Old February 12th, 2011, 08:51 PM   #71
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Maybe tomorrow if I don't get shot (in Guadalajara), I'll start a thread on pirate about it to see peoples experiences.

They are not the worlds nicest headers, but they are what fit the chassis and mounts. I'm fine with whatever is best.

Basically, it looks like they maybe weld up material onto the flange around each primary and then surface plane it down to be flat? I have done zero research on it yet.
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Old February 13th, 2011, 07:47 AM   #72
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Yeah, all these exhaust problems are a bitch. Oh, wait a minute, I'm haven't had any problems. I'm still using the junk STOCK OEM manifolds and gaskets.

I simply hate headers and think they are a waste of money on a stock engine. Why does everyone think they need headers?
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Old February 13th, 2011, 07:58 AM   #73
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Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
Yeah, all these exhaust problems are a bitch. Oh, wait a minute, I'm haven't had any problems. I'm still using the junk STOCK OEM manifolds and gaskets.

I simply hate headers and think they are a waste of money on a stock engine. Why does everyone think they need headers?
you have a YJ. If you had a CJ or a TJ, you'd have fitment issues with the narrower frame. I already checked, neither manifold fit.
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Old February 13th, 2011, 07:59 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95geo View Post
Post a picture of the "raised flange"..... The exhaust manifold flange needs to slip on the head face or the bolts break. Since those have a "rasied" area that has a higher pressure locally, when it does move its going to wear into the exhaust face on the head.

That is a shitty design for an aluminum head.
Not to hijack, but is that why all these 00+ gm trucks bust the heads off the rear most bolt on the manifolds? Never really put any thought into why, but damn do I love making the $ from repairing them. Every gm truck I work on that is the first thing I look at, easy to fix and I usually get book time on the manifold plus .5 to remove said bolt. Every now and then I get lucky and one needs a convertor with the repair.
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Old February 13th, 2011, 08:11 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haggar View Post
you have a YJ. If you had a CJ or a TJ, you'd have fitment issues with the narrower frame. I already checked, neither manifold fit.
Add XJ to that list...
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Old February 13th, 2011, 08:40 AM   #76
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bah, you guys just aren't creative enough.
How much narrower is the CJ frame? I'll have to look at how close my exhaust is to my frame.
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Old February 13th, 2011, 08:48 AM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
bah, you guys just aren't creative enough.
How much narrower is the CJ frame? I'll have to look at how close my exhaust is to my frame.
haggar is god, well god's son, if he says it has to be a certain way it just has to be.

Must mean you are wrong jim.
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Old February 13th, 2011, 09:25 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
bah, you guys just aren't creative enough.
How much narrower is the CJ frame? I'll have to look at how close my exhaust is to my frame.
about 3". So can you fit a 2x4 between the manifolds and the frame on your Jeep on each side?

There are other manifolds but I haven't seen any that work in a CJ. The corvette ones are like block huggers but they dump out right into the mounts.

Right now, I'm trying to be quick and get it together. If they have issues, I'll switch.
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Old February 13th, 2011, 10:59 AM   #79
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Well, I just went out and crawled under the jeep. YOU GUYS ARE SCREWED.
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Old February 13th, 2011, 01:16 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John D View Post
This part I have to agree with. I am using a set of OEM metal gaskets and about every 1000 miles they start to make noise. I loosen the header bolts, wiggle the headers a little and tighten them back up.
What bolts are you using and what torque do you install them to? How flat, or not flat, are the mating faces on those?

Quote:
Originally Posted by CheapThrillB2 View Post
Not to hijack, but is that why all these 00+ gm trucks bust the heads off the rear most bolt on the manifolds? Never really put any thought into why, but damn do I love making the $ from repairing them. Every gm truck I work on that is the first thing I look at, easy to fix and I usually get book time on the manifold plus .5 to remove said bolt. Every now and then I get lucky and one needs a convertor with the repair.
It's funny you mention this. The early early gen 3's had a 10.9 bolt and a "higher" torque callout. During the cost cutting to refine these engines, the decision was made to go to a 9.8 bolt and a lower torque. Well, the lower torque allowed the manifolds to move too much and in turn, if they havent broken the bolt yet, they will at some point in the future. I think just about every one of these engines from 02 to 08 or 09 were all let through production with these known issues. I saw a string of emails dating back to 02 or so about this issue and the responses to the concerns. It's almost scary how known issues get ignored until the right people see or experience it and then it's immediately fixed. The correct bolts are the 10.9 with the "locking compound patch" on the threads. They need to be installed to I think 18-22 ft-lbs and the old torque was 12-15 if my half way fuzzy memory is right. I put them at 20ft-lbs even, initial torque is 10-11.... they get tightened from the inside out alternating sides, like this- 5.3.1.2.4.6 Make sure the oem gasket is installed properly also.

Quote:
Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
bah, you guys just aren't creative enough.
How much narrower is the CJ frame? I'll have to look at how close my exhaust is to my frame.
I've said it before, I'll say it again.... Benny87 put a 5.3L in his TJ with the stock manifolds. It was tight but he made it work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haggar View Post
There are other manifolds but I haven't seen any that work in a CJ. The corvette ones are like block huggers but they dump out right into the mounts.
I have a couple different manifolds that you are welcome to test fit. I was trying to use them on my buggy but it didnt work out very easily. Looking back, I would do almost anything to not have to have custom exhaust headers. I have a pile of money into them and about 4 weeks of time.

pm me your email if you want a pic of them....
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