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Old June 30th, 2010, 10:33 AM   #1
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Talking Oil Spewing Panic Compared to Science Data

so since all this hoopla of the gulf "disaster" I have said that I would like to know what the numbers are on the natural seepage of oil under the sea. I have come under great fire for this query because I have said that nobody is running around with their hands in the air crying "disaster" or "ban the ocean floor" because of natural seepage. well I have finally found an article about it.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/...OE=click-refer



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Human-caused spills send more than 300 million gallons of oil into North American waters every decade, an amount roughly double the highest estimate of the BP spill, according to studies by some of the world's top scientists.
Worldwide, the numbers are even starker, according to Oil in the Sea III, a 2003 report from the National Academy of Sciences that several top scientists say remains the best estimate of oil's impact on oceans. The estimated 4 billion gallons leaking into oceans each decade from all sources is more than 25 times the highest estimates of what has spewed into the Gulf.

"Wherever I am, I always go down to the beach ó and I always find tar balls," says Merv Fingas, a Canadian researcher who co-authored the study. "That was probably completely untrue even 30 years ago."

Scientists cannot compare the damage from the routine discharges into oceans and estuaries with that of the Gulf spill because there has been so little study of the issue. The report called for additional study, but Fingas told Congress this month that little has been done to research and monitor spills.

"There is a very serious knowledge gap on discharges," Fingas said.

Another factor that has not been thoroughly studied: natural seepage of oil from under the sea. The study estimates that 493 million gallons a decade enters the waters off North America, mostly in the Gulf and off California. Worldwide, an estimated 1.8 billion gallons of oil seeps out per decade.

"The amount of natural seeps is just horrendous," says James Coleman, head of Louisiana State University's Coastal Studies Institute and chairman of the 2003 study. "Every time we go down in a submarine or do a side-scan sonar, we find more."

Although massive blowouts receive the most attention, the largest human-caused source of oil into the environment is the byproduct of millions of autos and other oil-powered devices.

Oil that drips from a car's crankcase or gasoline that spills at a gas station eventually washes down gutters and storm drains into rivers that drain into the sea, the report said. Other significant sources include recreational boating, commercial ships and tankers, and oil production.

Because the government and industry do not track these spills, the totals could be much higher, the study concluded. Scientists estimated that human spills in North America could be as high as 6.3 billion gallons a decade.

Alex Horne, University of California-Berkeley professor emeritus of ecological engineering, says he has frequently encountered the smell of dumped fuel or the rainbow sheen of oil while working on wetlands pollution.

"This is something that goes on year after year," Horne says. "And it's going to keep on going on. There is no end in sight to land-based spills."

Even small spills can harm the environment, according to the report and scientists. Oil products contain toxic compounds such as polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons that are known to cause cancer in humans and can kill marine wildlife.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 11:10 AM   #2
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WOW, thats amazing. A chart comparing oil leakage from 2 sources over a decade with another source over about 2 months.

By my math is shows that this one leaking well it spewing out 10 to 20 times as much oil as all other natural sources in north America combined.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 12:03 PM   #3
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WOW, thats amazing. A chart comparing oil leakage from 2 sources over a decade with another source over about 2 months.

By my math is shows that this one leaking well it spewing out 10 to 20 times as much oil as all other natural sources in north America combined.
even if it broke even with natural seepage and then was plugged, the natural seepage would continue to surpass it. but I get where you're coming from. there is nobody to blame for natural seepage and we cannot fine, ban, imprision or give it governmental control so who the fukc cares.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 12:07 PM   #4
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there is nobody to blame for natural seepage

Yes there is. Chipotle.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 12:10 PM   #5
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there is nobody to blame
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Yes there is. Chipotle.
Bush did it.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 12:46 PM   #6
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Bush did it.
now were getting somewhere. now if we can just start ignoring things that make the bp spill look not that bad we'd be all set.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 01:07 PM   #7
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now were getting somewhere. now if we can just start ignoring things that make the bp spill look not that bad we'd be all set.
You doing a pretty good job at ignoring that fact that by the figures you posted the Deep Horizon blowout is spewing 10-20 times as much out as the natural leakage for the entire continent. You are correct that there are natural oil seepages, and that they do not cause big problems. But you cannot expect to be able to add 10-20 times the seepage for the entire continent to one place and expect it to not be a problem. Keep trying, youíre just fooling yourself. The out of work shrimpers and fisherman arenít fooled. The owners and operators of empty resorts on oil soaked beaches are not fooled. The teams of volunteers working to clean shorelines and rescue oils soaked animals are not fooled.

At this point I donít care who is to blame. What I care about is that everything is being done that can be done to stop the leak and clean up the oil. We can debate blame later in the courts.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 01:16 PM   #8
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You doing a pretty good job at ignoring that fact that by the figures you posted the Deep Horizon blowout is spewing 10-20 times as much out as the natural leakage for the entire continent. You are correct that there are natural oil seepages, and that they do not cause big problems. But you cannot expect to be able to add 10-20 times the seepage for the entire continent to one place and expect it to not be a problem. Keep trying, youíre just fooling yourself. The out of work shrimpers and fisherman arenít fooled. The owners and operators of empty resorts on oil soaked beaches are not fooled. The teams of volunteers working to clean shorelines and rescue oils soaked animals are not fooled.

At this point I donít care who is to blame. What I care about is that everything is being done that can be done to stop the leak and clean up the oil. We can debate blame later in the courts.

I think you're not seeing what he is trying to say. He's just bringing to attention (with Scientific data) that oil in the water is not something new, nor is it a small amount.

That being said, The Natural Oil seepage we cannot control or be blamed for. That's how our planet works. Ones like the Gulf spill we should be able to control and it IS our responsibility to take care of. It was our fault, so we should take care of it. If we want to blame anybody about the natural oil spills blame the creating force (or destructive force) behind our planet.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 01:19 PM   #9
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You doing a pretty good job at ignoring that fact that by the figures you posted the Deep Horizon blowout is spewing 10-20 times as much out as the natural leakage for the entire continent. You are correct that there are natural oil seepages, and that they do not cause big problems. But you cannot expect to be able to add 10-20 times the seepage for the entire continent to one place and expect it to not be a problem. Keep trying, youíre just fooling yourself. The out of work shrimpers and fisherman arenít fooled. The owners and operators of empty resorts on oil soaked beaches are not fooled. The teams of volunteers working to clean shorelines and rescue oils soaked animals are not fooled.

At this point I donít care who is to blame. What I care about is that everything is being done that can be done to stop the leak and clean up the oil. We can debate blame later in the courts.

cry cry cry. someone please help me my business was based in and around oil rich offshore drilling. now there is an accident. I don't have a brain so I cannot even think of something like this happening, but now everyone must pay to cover my uncalculated risk. for the record I cannot eat shrimp so could care less.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 01:32 PM   #10
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i'm guessing there’s a big difference in how mother nature handles natural oil leakage over a large area of the ocean versus the amount of oil coming out of a concentrate area like what we're seeing now.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 02:08 PM   #11
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i'm guessing thereís a big difference in how mother nature handles natural oil leakage over a large area of the ocean versus the amount of oil coming out of a concentrate area like what we're seeing now.
well the seepage can only come from an area that has crude below it. depending on what type of pressure it is under and the natural circumstances how do we know they aren't gushing?
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Old June 30th, 2010, 02:11 PM   #12
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Down here in Alabama, where the beaches are affected by the spill, the radio DJ's are whining about the mom and pop businesses are about to go under because of the loss of tourism. Are you guys hearing that up in Michigan a lot too??
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Old June 30th, 2010, 02:13 PM   #13
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Down here in Alabama, where the beaches are affected by the spill, the radio DJ's are whining about the mom and pop businesses are about to go under because of the loss of tourism. Are you guys hearing that up in Michigan a lot too??
No, that's old news here, all the mam and pop businesses are already gone, the rest Obama is going to nationalize.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 02:18 PM   #14
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Down here in Alabama, where the beaches are affected by the spill, the radio DJ's are whining about the mom and pop businesses are about to go under because of the loss of tourism. Are you guys hearing that up in Michigan a lot too??
stankholm made sure to eliminate them first.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 02:20 PM   #15
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Brewmenn's right, not all seepage is the same or good.


Last edited by howell_jeep; June 30th, 2010 at 02:25 PM.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 02:23 PM   #16
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I think you're not seeing what he is trying to say. He's just bringing to attention (with Scientific data) that oil in the water is not something new, nor is it a small amount.
I understand completely what he is trying to say. He is trying to use ďscientific dataĒ and a misleading graph to diminish the scope of this oil spill, something heís been trying to do since the beginning. What I am trying to say is that I think heís wrong and trying to get people to look closer at this ďscientific dataĒ.

It states that the amount of natural seepage for the entire area of North American coastal waters is 493 million gallons a decade. This comes to about 135,000 gallons a day, which again is for the entire continent.

The Deep Horizon well has leaked 83-156 million gallons in the past 70 days, which is about 1,186,000 to 2,229,000 gallons a day, in one place.

So once again, you have 10 to 20 times the amount of seepage for the entire continent leaking in one place. The normal amount of natural seepage spread over a huge area can be absorbed by the environment. 10 to 20 times the natural amount in one place cannot be absorbed by the environment.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 02:33 PM   #17
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I understand completely what he is trying to say. He is trying to use “scientific data” and a misleading graph to diminish the scope of this oil spill, something he’s been trying to do since the beginning. What I am trying to say is that I think he’s wrong and trying to get people to look closer at this “scientific data”.

It states that the amount of natural seepage for the entire area of North American coastal waters is 493 million gallons a decade. This comes to about 135,000 gallons a day, which again is for the entire continent.

The Deep Horizon well has leaked 83-156 million gallons in the past 70 days, which is about 1,186,000 to 2,229,000 gallons a day, in one place.

So once again, you have 10 to 20 times the amount of seepage for the entire continent leaking in one place. The normal amount of natural seepage spread over a huge area can be absorbed by the environment. 10 to 20 times the natural amount in one place cannot be absorbed by the environment.

not really. if it were up to me (sigh of relief from the sissies) I would let it go, set the shit on fire and toss anyone who bitched about it into said fire.
only those afraid of doomsday try to prevent it.
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Old June 30th, 2010, 02:35 PM   #18
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not really. if it were up to me (sigh of relief from the sissies) I would let it go, set the shit on fire and toss anyone who bitched about it into said fire.
only those afraid of doomsday try to prevent it.
x2 Help mother nature help herself!
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Old June 30th, 2010, 02:44 PM   #19
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cry cry cry. someone please help me my business was based in and around oil rich offshore drilling. now there is an accident. I don't have a brain so I cannot even think of something like this happening, but now everyone must pay to cover my uncalculated risk. for the record I cannot eat shrimp so could care less.
So youíre OK with one businesses reckless behavior causing many other businesses to be severely impacted? If you owned a business along a busy road and a truck crashed into your building destroying it, it would be your fault for being on a busy road? If you owned a shipping business near the airport and a plane crashed into you building it would be your fault for being near the airport? If the building next door caught fire and burned your building down it would be your fault for being next door?
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Old June 30th, 2010, 02:47 PM   #20
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not really. if it were up to me (sigh of relief from the sissies) I would let it go, set the shit on fire and toss anyone who bitched about it into said fire.
only those afraid of doomsday try to prevent it.
Thanks for the clarification. I thought you were trying to make some meaningful point. I didnít realize you were just an idiot.
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