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Old May 10th, 2010, 07:32 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by Soy_bomb View Post
I still don't see how this is taking any of my rights away. My ID is always on me anyway.
Because the Constitution grants you rights against unreasonable search and seizure --The US Supreme court has interpreted that to mean you cannot be stopped and detained without cause. IE--no one can just stop you because they fucking feel like it-Jesus guys people have died to grant you these rights!!!

And yes a civil infraction means NO JAIL TIME--what do you think that means--means you get a ticket not go to jail for doing it. WTF
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Old May 10th, 2010, 07:35 PM   #62
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Because the Constitution grants you rights against unreasonable search and seizure --The US Supreme court has interpreted that to mean you cannot be stopped and detained without cause. IE--no one can just stop you because they fucking feel like it-Jesus guys people have died to grant you these rights!!!

And yes a civil infraction means NO JAIL TIME--what do you think that means--means you get a ticket not go to jail for doing it. WTF
So how is it not breaking the law?

The LEO would have to stop You .

You would still have to show ID If You got one.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 07:42 PM   #63
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Well if you have nothing to hide then you wont mind if the Feds take your photo, fingerprints and a DNA sample.

And highlight that crap a hundred times--those are civil infractions!!!! Again you have no idea why I'm pointing that out to you. So did you find that law that says I have to carry ID??

The court ruling he quoted above the officers had probable cause to ask for it. It is not a requirement to carry ID.
They can look up Your pic now when You get pulled over from anywhere and I got fingerprinted in 4th or 5th grade with the rest of the kid's .

No dna yet though.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 07:43 PM   #64
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So how is it not breaking the law?

The LEO would have to stop You .

You would still have to show ID If You got one.
So its your position that if you got stopped tomorrow for jaywalking and didnt have your ID you would be carted off to jail until you could be identified?? Interesting--btw did you know there was a new tax to pay for this law--I'll PM you the address to send your hundred bucks--thank you for your support
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Old May 10th, 2010, 07:44 PM   #65
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Your missing the point. it is secondary to the stop, arrest or detention.
The law will be investigated after stop, arrest or detention for another crime.
Nobody will be stopped and asked to proved their status.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 07:47 PM   #66
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So its your position that if you got stopped tomorrow for jaywalking and didnt have your ID you would be carted off to jail until you could be identified?? Interesting--btw did you know there was a new tax to pay for this law--I'll PM you the address to send your hundred bucks--thank you for your support
I seen it happen to people and had It happen to Me .

You should try it and find out , with Your attitude about showing your ID I'm sure You'll get a little stay till they prove Who You are.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 07:59 PM   #67
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Sadly I'm not missing the point--I understand its secondary to whatever is being investigated--but if this law passes then if I get stopped during an investigation (and lets assume I've done nothing--I'm a totally innocent person---they are just trying to determine if i'm involved with whatever they are looking in to) and now I dont have my ID on me I go to jail until my status is determined. Before this great law I would just go home. I'm the only one that sees a problem with that??? There isnt one person here on this board that has lost or forgotten to take their wallet when they left the house--I'm the only one.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 08:08 PM   #68
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You do know NCIC/LIEN can verify you with just a last name and DoB? Including physical description (hgt, wght, hair, eyes).

And providing the stop is otherwise legal, the officer could confirm your identity through LIEN, whether your ID was in your possesion or not.
Name and birthdate. It happens more often than you think.

Officer " Subject Orville J. Fuzzball, DoB 07-07-62, last four of 9324"
Dispatch " your subject is clear and current, 5'2", 300lbs, Black and Blue"
Officer "copy, thats what I'm looking at, clear the call, warning issued"
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Old May 10th, 2010, 08:18 PM   #69
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You do know NCIC/LIEN can verify you with just a last name and DoB? Including physical description (hgt, wght, hair, eyes).

And providing the stop is otherwise legal, the officer could confirm your identity through LIEN, whether your ID was in your possesion or not.
Name and birthdate. It happens more often than you think.

Officer " Subject Orville J. Fuzzball, DoB 07-07-62, last four of 9324"
Dispatch " your subject is clear and current, 5'2", 300lbs, Black and Blue"
Officer "copy, thats what I'm looking at, clear the call, warning issued"

I've watched that happen in person down at Ottawa County Central Dispatch. I cannot see how this bill would violate any rights of law abiding citizens.

I'm starting to think Tomahawk is actually a Canadian living in the U.P. illegally.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 08:28 PM   #70
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Given all your guys position that the LEO can already ask you for ID any time they want---and add to that the feds can detain people with doubtful immigration status already---wtf is the point of your law???

I've posted quotes from the supreme court to back up my position--and have yet to see anyone post a law currently on the books requiring ID to be carried---if you guys want to give your rights away be my guest.

Give DNA samples--your prints---whatever is asked of you. Dont bitch when you find yourself without any liberties.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 08:31 PM   #71
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I'm starting to think Tomahawk is actually a Canadian living in the U.P. illegally.
He'll go back when Obamacare kicks in
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Old May 10th, 2010, 08:36 PM   #72
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Given all your guys position that the LEO can already ask you for ID any time they want---and add to that the feds can detain people with doubtful immigration status already---wtf is the point of your law???

I've posted quotes from the supreme court to back up my position--and have yet to see anyone post a law currently on the books requiring ID to be carried---if you guys want to give your rights away be my guest.

Give DNA samples--your prints---whatever is asked of you. Dont bitch when you find yourself without any liberties.
Lets see You used to live down state in the real world now Your hiding in the woods of the UP. You seem to worry alot about giving dna and fingerprints .

So are You a rapist or murderer?

Last edited by disorder xj; May 11th, 2010 at 12:48 AM.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 08:42 PM   #73
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Lets see You used to live down state in the real world now Your hinding in the woods of the UP. You seem to worry alot about giving dna and fingerprints .

So are You a rapist or murderer?
No I've got a job--see when you have a job you go where the work is. You dont move to the south with your sister to raise some younins.

So whats it like being the Dean of Wyotechs law school??
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Old May 10th, 2010, 08:50 PM   #74
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No I've got a job--see when you have a job you go where the work is. You dont move to the south with your sister to raise some younins.

So whats it like being the Dean of Wyotechs law school??
Better then the woods and the cold. I live like 10 mins from the ocean .

never need to wear more then a hoodie. Life is good.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 08:57 PM   #75
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I've watched that happen in person down at Ottawa County Central Dispatch. I cannot see how this bill would violate any rights of law abiding citizens.

I'm starting to think Tomahawk is actually a Canadian living in the U.P. illegally.
Yeah I'm the canadian--you guys are the ones promoting socialist and fascist ideas. Seriously whats the point of your law??? If LEO can already do all this stuff whats the point??
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Old May 10th, 2010, 09:04 PM   #76
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Sadly I'm not missing the point--I understand its secondary to whatever is being investigated--but if this law passes then if I get stopped during an investigation (and lets assume I've done nothing--I'm a totally innocent person---they are just trying to determine if i'm involved with whatever they are looking in to) and now I dont have my ID on me I go to jail until my status is determined. Before this great law I would just go home. I'm the only one that sees a problem with that??? There isnt one person here on this board that has lost or forgotten to take their wallet when they left the house--I'm the only one.
No, I agree with you.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 09:07 PM   #77
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That's My point is if You have nothing to hide ,Who cares if You have to carry ID.
The point is that I don't want to see not carrying ID become a crime.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 09:14 PM   #78
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Not even close. It would be immigrants, not everyone.

Also, how many people realize the fact that Arizona's and Michigan's [possible] imigration laws just enforce the federal immigration law that was put in place 70+ years ago by FDR?
Here's the problem with that. Suppose you happen to be of Hispanic decent. You were out for a walk and there was a house broken into down the street. You didn't bother to grab your wallet before leaving the house. The police happen to stop you. Your not an immigrant, but because you don't have your ID you can't prove it. Suddenly you find yourself in the back of the police car getting a free ride to the station.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 09:15 PM   #79
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I still don't see how this is taking any of my rights away. My ID is always on me anyway.
I consider the right to not have to carry ID to be a very significant right.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 09:19 PM   #80
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Here's the problem with that. Suppose you happen to be of Hispanic decent. You were out for a walk and there was a house broken into down the street. You didn't bother to grab your wallet before leaving the house. The police happen to stop you. Your not an immigrant, but because you don't have your ID you can't prove it. Suddenly you find yourself in the back of the police car getting a free ride to the station.
Under those circumstances I think You might be taking a ride now anyway if You look the part.
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