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Old November 16th, 2009, 01:17 AM   #1
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Default 454 too much for an alpha one

Ok so i sold my cobalt and am now looking for a little bigger boat (22-28ft) i went and looked at a 24ft baja the other night with a built 454 and only an alpha one.

would you stay away from this or should the alpha hold up fine?

he has the outdrive off the boat right now and said he is putting a drive shower on it... would that help a lot?

the setup he has is the impeller runs the drive shower, and he put a clamshell under the boat to cool the engine

so what are your opinions on this?
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Old November 16th, 2009, 04:30 AM   #2
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This sounds like it may be beyond the the skill level here at GL. I suggest you try this page...

http://www.bloodydecks.com/forums/boating-discussion/
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Old November 16th, 2009, 12:26 PM   #3
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It will hold up, but probably not long. Alpha One is good for 270hp, anything higher is a Bravo outdrive.
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Old November 16th, 2009, 12:38 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by 94transam25th View Post
Ok so i sold my cobalt and am now looking for a little bigger boat (22-28ft) i went and looked at a 24ft baja the other night with a built 454 and only an alpha one.

would you stay away from this or should the alpha hold up fine?

he has the outdrive off the boat right now and said he is putting a drive shower on it... would that help a lot?

the setup he has is the impeller runs the drive shower, and he put a clamshell under the boat to cool the engine

so what are your opinions on this?
You DO NOT want a BBC with an alpha, especially a built BBC. Drive showers are always a good choice on a performance boat, but it wont save the alpha from a BB. Pachangas had a problem in the mid 80's with this. By 88 or 89 Mercruiser introduced the bravo and I believe every BB since has been mated to one.

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It will hold up, but probably not long. Alpha One is good for 270hp, anything higher is a Bravo outdrive.
Its not the horsepower as much as it is the torque. I have seen newer (300hp) 350mags with an alpha drive with no issues.

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This sounds like it may be beyond the the skill level here at GL. I suggest you try this page...

http://www.bloodydecks.com/forums/boating-discussion/
Not at all.

Last edited by greygoose; November 16th, 2009 at 12:45 PM.
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Old November 16th, 2009, 12:42 PM   #5
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Its not the horsepower as much as it is the torque. I have seen newer (300hp) 350mags with an alpha drive with no issues.

You DO NOT want a BBC with an alpha. This was a huge problem in the 80's with the Sea Ray Pachanga. By 89 Mercruiser introduced the bravo and I believe every BB since has been mated to one.
I understand that. They don't rate the motors by torque, so I figured I would give a general idea .
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Old November 16th, 2009, 01:05 PM   #6
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I understand that. They don't rate the motors by torque, so I figured I would give a general idea .
True, I wish they would give both numbers though. It doesn't make sense to me why they don't.
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Old November 17th, 2009, 08:14 PM   #7
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True, I wish they would give both numbers though. It doesn't make sense to me why they don't.
because boat engines are designed to maintain maximum rpm on a constant basis where the horsepower is. usually 4500-6500. not 2500-3000 where all the torque is. unless it's a diesel and thats a whole different story.
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Old November 18th, 2009, 07:18 AM   #8
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because boat engines are designed to maintain maximum rpm on a constant basis where the horsepower is. usually 4500-6500. not 2500-3000 where all the torque is. unless it's a diesel and thats a whole different story.
Wat? Then why is the optimum cruising speed always at the motors peak torque? Between 3-4000rpm.
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Old November 18th, 2009, 07:20 AM   #9
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I don't know shit about boats.
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Old November 18th, 2009, 07:21 AM   #10
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You DO NOT want a BBC with an alpha, especially a built BBC. Drive showers are always a good choice on a performance boat, but it wont save the alpha from a BB. Pachangas had a problem in the mid 80's with this. By 88 or 89 Mercruiser introduced the bravo and I believe every BB since has been mated to one.



Its not the horsepower as much as it is the torque. I have seen newer (300hp) 350mags with an alpha drive with no issues.



Not at all.

Thank you for proving me wrong
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Old November 19th, 2009, 07:32 PM   #11
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yea i think i am going to pass on that baja, the previous owner told me he was already thinking about doing a bravo conversion so he must kno somethings up

im going to look at a mach one this weekend with a 454 hopefully that is paired with the bravo
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Old November 19th, 2009, 07:45 PM   #12
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Good call - I'd be leery of an Alpha behind a BB - the compensatory actions strongly suggest cooling and / or drive issues.
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Old November 20th, 2009, 10:17 AM   #13
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im not a big fan of alpha drives with high horsepower even in a small block. after haging a bravo boat, i will stick with those! good luck on your search!!......got a great checkmate with a 5.7 and a alpha(recently rebuilt) for sale!!
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Old November 20th, 2009, 10:32 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by 94transam25th View Post
yea i think i am going to pass on that baja, the previous owner told me he was already thinking about doing a bravo conversion so he must kno somethings up

im going to look at a mach one this weekend with a 454 hopefully that is paired with the bravo
Remember, if it isn't a late 80's model boat, it probably has a alpha drive behind it. Unless someone spent some coin and added the bravo.

Good luck, keep us posted on what you find!

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Thank you for proving me wrong
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Old November 28th, 2009, 12:37 PM   #15
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Remember, if it isn't a late 80's model boat, it probably has a alpha drive behind it. Unless someone spent some coin and added the bravo.

Good luck, keep us posted on what you find!



Or a TRS Drive
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Old November 28th, 2009, 12:41 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greygoose View Post
You DO NOT want a BBC with an alpha, especially a built BBC. Drive showers are always a good choice on a performance boat, but it wont save the alpha from a BB. Pachangas had a problem in the mid 80's with this. By 88 or 89 Mercruiser introduced the bravo and I believe every BB since has been mated to one.



Its not the horsepower as much as it is the torque. I have seen newer (300hp) 350mags with an alpha drive with no issues.


Many alpha's live just fine lives behind bigblocks. as an example look at htrdlncn on speedwake running his second or third big block in front of an alpha. He has a 502, now the drive did finally give up the ghost, but its been quite a while.

As much as I think tripple digits is an absolute idiot he was running over 600hp through an alpha and claimed no failures....Keep in mind the average 454 is 330 hp, an alpha should be fine if you dont do anything stupid with it. Much will depend on your hull, driving style, etc.

A 24ft baja is a pretty heavy boat in most cases, so make sure to be careful if you get air, and get on plane slowly rather than hammering it and you should be fine.

My neighbor ran 400+ horsepower through an alpha SS since the early 80's, he's never rebuilt the drive, but he says he has replaced the u joint maybe 4 times. He has a 125 shot of Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaws too...

A bravo is ideal, but not completely necessary if you know what your doing.

Keep in mind greygoose has a king cobra outdrive.
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Old November 29th, 2009, 10:31 PM   #17
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I don't know shit about boats.
lol
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Old November 30th, 2009, 06:26 AM   #18
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Keep in mind greygoose has a king cobra outdrive.
Correct, I have a cone clutch king cobra. Which I am told is as strong as a bravo 1.

I have also owned several mercury / mercruisers in my life as well.

Last edited by greygoose; November 30th, 2009 at 06:30 AM.
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Old November 30th, 2009, 05:53 PM   #19
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Correct, I have a cone clutch king cobra. Which I am told is as strong as a bravo 1.

I have also owned several mercury / mercruisers in my life as well.
I was just jabbing at you as everyone seems to really bag on the king cobra's, which are fine for a liberator
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Old December 2nd, 2009, 07:01 PM   #20
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Im running my boat currently with twin 540's dyno'd at 650 hp with TRS #5 drives. I have 2 stroker 572's being built right now with blowers and chilllers and they will run around 1100hp on the same drives and should handle it. Go with the best drives you can afford so you never have to find out if your engine has too much power for the drive.
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