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Old August 11th, 2009, 07:52 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by brandonjb View Post
Umm isn't he using an all steel body, not the type that uses a hard top? So isnt point about the hard top... pointless? Anyway who gives a shit what would do better in a roll over? BOTH Jeeps and Trackers a like would do better in a roll over with a beefed up roll cage. Do you deny this? I don't care what he does, but just seeing those pics makes me want to upgrade my cage.
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Old August 11th, 2009, 08:33 PM   #42
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and how is that any different that the geo. your making fun of that guy but say its ok for the geo not to be protected
No, my point is that there are tons of hard topped 4x4's with lift kits and big tires running around and when one of them rolls, you never hear "you shoulda had a cage" but when Jim rolls the cage topic comes up over and over.

I'm not making fun of the guy. My guess are there are more deer/car accidents around Michigan than OHV accidents and based on these comments everyone who may ever encounter a deer should have a full roll cage.

Casey, you've seen your share of rollovers. Why is this one any different than any other rollover on a paved road?
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Old August 11th, 2009, 09:15 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Mike Hancho View Post
I would go with dana 60's before a cage anyday on this thing...I mean look how much you use it offroad, and what you do with it when you are offroad. The 60's make sense and the cage doesn't.
This post is so full of win.
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Old August 11th, 2009, 09:43 PM   #44
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The weird part here is why are you guys so aggressively anti cage? When spending thousands of dollars and many man hours modifying a street driven vehicle so that it is vastly different than it was originally designed, serious consideration should be given to its overall crashworthiness, both for the safety of the occupants and for the safety other vehicles that will have to share the road with it. Counting on the stock roof, which is marginal with a bone stock vehicle, to carry the extra loads and stresses due to the heavy running gear is a recipe for disaster. So why get so defensive when someone suggests a cage? It almost is like you're trying too hard...maybe to convince yourselves

Sure nothing can be built to account for every single possibility, so tradeoffs need to be made. Sounds like Jim considered the risks and made an informed choice, which is the best anyone can do. Make your choices and roll the dice. YMMV.
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Old August 12th, 2009, 06:25 AM   #45
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hahaha....Don't go there, I'm not anti cage at all. I have a full cage that is tied in to the frame at the A, B and C hoops. I also have a full hoop around my windshield that is tied in to the cage at the top and into the frame at the bottom. That's "my" choice and I did it because I have gotten into situations where I felt I might need it. And it's likely to happen again.

KB8YMF on the other hand uses his rig almost exclusively for trail riding, exploring and the occasional large obstacle to conquer. He's not into nasty high horsepower hill climbs, laying his rig up against a rock or tree, getting in bad off camber situations or hitting things at high speed. I've seen him back out of something more than once because he felt it wasn't worth it. He's already said that he wants some structural scrubber bars and a windshield hoop that would be more than adequate for anything that he would encounter off road. That's "his" choice and in itself would put him in the top 75% of any truck or jeep out there wheeling with either no support of any type. And for those that do, most aren't tied into the frame. A full cage in a jeep that isn't tied into the frame is giving it's driver a false sense of security.

The incident on the road where he rolled was a freak accident, sad to say the least but not likely to happen again. So, my point is, if people feel a cage is needed because of a deer on the road, everyone should be doing it.

Hope this clarifies.

Jim
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Old August 12th, 2009, 06:29 AM   #46
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im not arguing the on road part

but if you put 60's in a vehicle with 37-40 inch tires chances are your going to end up in a position where you should have had a cage at some point or another. its the nature of the beast. heck ive flipped my buggy on the service road at the badlands and thats perfectly flat.
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Old August 12th, 2009, 06:35 AM   #47
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Wasn't all of this discussed in the accident thread.... why don't we just let Jim have a build thread for one of the coolest rigs out there, and keep all the a bs out of it. It's his truck and his decission.

Glad to see it coming back together.
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Old August 12th, 2009, 07:32 AM   #48
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im not arguing the on road part

but if you put 60's in a vehicle with 37-40 inch tires chances are your going to end up in a position where you should have had a cage at some point or another. its the nature of the beast.
The simple answer is in WR's post. If The spot gets nasty then he isnt afraid of his manhood being tarnished if he pulls cable, gets out of it or just doesnt attempt it at all. 90% of people on 37's or 40's dont know when to call it quits and my dad has been there and that isnt what he likes to do anymore.

My dad doesnt take his truck out to beat on it or to drive it for the hell of it, he takes it out to go places and explore new trails. he would rather explore a dead end trail in canada for 8 hours than spend a day in a park.

If I thought for a second that he would get into a spot where he needed a cage I would put one in without his consent. It is going to get a scrub rail that will help if it gets leaned into something and in the event of a rollover again it will provide plenty of additional support so the cab area doesnt get compromised. An exo cage is 100% out of the question, they are fugly and add so much weight that they are just about counterproductive and make you much more top heavy. With an exo you have no way to triangulate anything so it's only a matter of time before it gets tweeked and you have to start over. An internal cage does nothing that the scrub rails wouldnt already cover. The downside with an internal cage is that even if you roll, the body is still fubar'd and it just stopped things from caving in.... same as the scrub rails will do.

If anyone wants do argue further go bring the other thread back and leave it in there. (or a moderator can snip this thread and add it onto that one)

If he ever gets the bug to beat on something he can take my buggy and drive by braille.
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Old August 12th, 2009, 07:43 AM   #49
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Wasn't all of this discussed in the accident thread.... why don't we just let Jim have a build thread for one of the coolest rigs out there, and keep all the a bs out of it. It's his truck and his decission.

Glad to see it coming back together.
yes I cant wait to see this thing with 60's under it!!! those are perfect for trail riding
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Old August 12th, 2009, 08:19 AM   #50
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If he ever gets the bug to beat on something he can take my buggy and drive by braille.


Nice thread
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Old August 12th, 2009, 08:26 AM   #51
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all I'm saying is you guys have to be fawking dumb ass to not put a full cage in it , EXO NO GAY AS ALL HELL . i have wheeled more then you and your dad . I have seen some fucked up people in my day, because they did not no better about a cage , but you 2 idiots no better ( perfect example of a engineer try think !!!!!!!!!) go a head you talk about how GM has engineered this thing to take a roll over , that's with 25'' tires stock suspension not 60'' 37'' tires and 3ft taller 1200 lbs heaver, this is not my build but the next time you roll, brake your neck or kill your self i will say i told you so , and if this happens i don't want to here so preaching shit about how i should have a cage
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Old August 12th, 2009, 08:59 AM   #52
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I thought that this was a build thread. Whether you put a cage in it or not I still think it's a bad ass rig. I'm a firm believer in building for a purpose, if you aren't going to put it in a position where your life may depend on it then by all means leave the extra weight off. It sounds like you have a plan, may as well stick to it.
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Old August 12th, 2009, 09:04 AM   #53
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Look forward to seeing you on the trail! Hurry up!!!
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Old August 12th, 2009, 09:06 AM   #54
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all I'm saying is you guys have to be fawking dumb ass to not put a full cage in it , EXO NO GAY AS ALL HELL . i have wheeled more then you and your dad . I have seen some fucked up people in my day, because they did not no better about a cage , but you 2 idiots no better ( perfect example of a engineer try think !!!!!!!!!) go a head you talk about how GM has engineered this thing to take a roll over , that's with 25'' tires stock suspension not 60'' 37'' tires and 3ft taller 1200 lbs heaver, this is not my build but the next time you roll, brake your neck or kill your self i will say i told you so , and if this happens i don't want to here so preaching shit about how i should have a cage
whats your problem guy? this thing needs more axle, not a cage. I wonder why people cant get this through their heads. I mean after all it's used for exploring dead end trails and nothing can go wrong out there. thats why he needs to go for bigger axles, you always have to poop on the party don't you
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Old August 12th, 2009, 09:17 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by Mike Hancho View Post
yes I cant wait to see this thing with 60's under it!!! those are perfect for trail riding
are you posting just so you can see your name in the thread? Dana 30's are perfect for useless shit talking web wheelers like yourself so at least we're on the same page

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all I'm saying is you guys have to be fawking dumb ass to not put a full cage in it , EXO NO GAY AS ALL HELL . i have wheeled more then you and your dad . I have seen some fucked up people in my day, because they did not no better about a cage , but you 2 idiots no better ( perfect example of a engineer try think !!!!!!!!!) go a head you talk about how GM has engineered this thing to take a roll over , that's with 25'' tires stock suspension not 60'' 37'' tires and 3ft taller 1200 lbs heaver, this is not my build but the next time you roll, brake your neck or kill your self i will say i told you so , and if this happens i don't want to here so preaching shit about how i should have a cage

No Bryan, we're not dumb for not putting a roll cage in something that doesnt need it. It seems like you are one of the only ones who cant understand the concept of driving within your means. You may have wheeled more than me and I could give a shit really but you really should get over yourself because that is a moot point. Based on everything you typed here my previous reply went in one ear and out the other so I'm not going to try to explain anything further to you when you don't listen.
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Old August 12th, 2009, 09:23 AM   #56
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are you posting just so you can see your name in the thread? Dana 30's are perfect for useless shit talking web wheelers like yourself so at least we're on the same page
.
you are an expert, and unlike you I have a rig, I do use it, and I'm a semi-pro rock crawler. I have wheeled more than you(in the real world not the intraweb as you have that area locked down), I'm better looking and have more friends. And I think this rig NEEDS more axles, so whats your problem? You can't even take a compliment
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Old August 12th, 2009, 09:42 AM   #57
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The pictures speak for themselves... - Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest

That is the thread for everyone who still feels the need to argue about roll cages, go there and waste your time typing.
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Old August 12th, 2009, 09:46 AM   #58
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are you posting just so you can see your name in the thread? Dana 30's are perfect for useless shit talking web wheelers like yourself so at least we're on the same page




No Bryan, we're not dumb for not putting a roll cage in something that doesnt need it. It seems like you are one of the only ones who cant understand the concept of driving within your means. You may have wheeled more than me and I could give a shit really but you really should get over yourself because that is a moot point. Based on everything you typed here my previous reply went in one ear and out the other so I'm not going to try to explain anything further to you when you don't listen.
you still don't get it Bryce just shut up for a minute and think about it , you might going a trail shit happens roof crush in your dad get killed you no longer see him or will he ever see his future grand children (my be not yours because you and Scottie love each other ) wouldn't that suck . pretty much the same thing when people using steel cable for winching and hearing about the cable going threw the back window and killing them fawking dumb ass is all i say
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Old August 12th, 2009, 09:55 AM   #59
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No Bryan, we're not dumb for not putting a roll cage in something that doesnt need it. It seems like you are one of the only ones who cant understand the concept of driving within your means.
This was driving with in your means. and it looked like he could have died. putting that much weight under a vehicle and not thinking you need a cage is crazy. exo is ugly as hell. i would do an internal cage for sure but if you roll over you will smash the body all to hell but at least you can stay alive to fix it. (keyword ALIVE)



Yeah a cage is not needed at ALL!! WTF
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Old August 12th, 2009, 09:56 AM   #60
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you still don't get it Bryce just shut up for a minute and think about it
were you ever diagnosed with a reading comprehension problem?

READ THIS AGAIN

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If The spot gets nasty then he isnt afraid of his manhood being tarnished if he pulls cable, gets out of it or just doesnt attempt it at all.

If I thought for a second that he would get into a spot where he needed a cage I would put one in without his consent. It is going to get a scrub rail that will help if it gets leaned into something and in the event of a rollover again it will provide plenty of additional support so the cab area doesnt get compromised.

With an exo you have no way to triangulate anything so it's only a matter of time before it gets tweeked and you have to start over. An internal cage does nothing that the scrub rails wouldnt already cover. The downside with an internal cage is that even if you roll, the body is still fubar'd and it just stopped things from caving in.... same as the scrub rails will do.
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