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Old June 25th, 2006, 07:41 PM   #61
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<---- my avatar explains this site well
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Old June 25th, 2006, 08:06 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by brewmenn
actually, we probably agree more than we disagree. I was mostly just making up arguments because I felt like arguing with someone on the internet, it's mostly just recreational arguing, and lately I've found the conservitives more interesting to argue against than the liberals.
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Old June 25th, 2006, 09:15 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miffy
I have a question for all you free speakers..
Would you say that anyone in this country can work and support themselves? Or it is only a chosen few that can make a living in this country and enjoy the freedoms? Can you get in your car and drive anyplace in the U.S.A? Or are you checked from town to town or state by state? I was surprised when we went to Mexico a few years back that when they change State lines or what ever there call down there , We seen guys with Ossies standing at what would be State lines here in the States?? and they were also at the Air Ports etc.

I guess my point is most don't relise how great we do have it compared to the rest of the world. As far as blaming any one Pres. they have to go through the goverment befor they can even wipe there bottoms so if your upset is it not WE the People that you should be upset with? because WE the people are the ones putting them in office and letting the Spoiled Politics of this country get away with what we disaprove of??
I consider myself to be a "free speaker" so I'll answer you.

I agree, we enjoy more freedom and prosperity than pretty much every other nation on earth. That is not in question. The question before us is how do we keep it that way. Is our use of our military to push our agendas around the world making us more free, or is it just making more of the world hate us, which in turn makes us more paraniod and willing to give up some of our own freedoms in the name of security? Is an economic policy that seems to be making the rich richer and the poor poorer the best thing for our long term prosperity, or should we be doing more to insure that there continues to be a "middle class" in this country? Is an energy policy that ignores that we're using limited resources at an ever increasing rate the best for our long term prosperity, or are we like a runaway train speeding down a dead end track, blissfully unaware of our predicament? Sooner or later we need to either pull the brake or find another track.

I don't know the answers, all I know now is the questions.
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Old June 25th, 2006, 10:02 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brewmenn
I consider myself to be a "free speaker" so I'll answer you.

I agree, we enjoy more freedom and prosperity than pretty much every other nation on earth. That is not in question. The question before us is how do we keep it that way. Is our use of our military to push our agendas around the world making us more free, or is it just making more of the world hate us, which in turn makes us more paraniod and willing to give up some of our own freedoms in the name of security? Is an economic policy that seems to be making the rich richer and the poor poorer the best thing for our long term prosperity, or should we be doing more to insure that there continues to be a "middle class" in this country? Is an energy policy that ignores that we're using limited resources at an ever increasing rate the best for our long term prosperity, or are we like a runaway train speeding down a dead end track, blissfully unaware of our predicament? Sooner or later we need to either pull the brake or find another track.

I don't know the answers, all I know now is the questions.
My thought on this is yes we are the so called top nation at this time, so were other countries in the past. when you are on top if it is in business or as a nation there is always some one or some other country trying to Knock you off. I think this is only human. How do you stay on top??? I Do not know the answer or I would run for office myself.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 06:02 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by brewmenn
actually, we probably agree more than we disagree. I was mostly just making up arguments because I felt like arguing with someone on the internet, it's mostly just recreational arguing, and lately I've found the conservitives more interesting to argue against than the liberals.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 10:04 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmujeeper
I'm still unsure who the attacker on 9/11 really was.
you make it seem as though only 9/11 related terror is an issue. The whole radical islam movement is an issue, most of the middle east is a hot bed, and add oil to the mix and its not as simple as you want. I understnad you hate bush and and subconsciously hate america .... but its not just an issue with 9/11. Ok let me pose this question we destroy all remnants of al quada and 9/11 are we 100% protected and safe from attackers with plans set in motion?

No there is divergent radical islam groups all over the world in asia, in england, in germany, in italy, in africa. How the heck can you be so simple minded as to think our government only has the responsibility to seek out those who attack us FIRST, and ignore any pre-emptive strike from folks who havent acted yet. Thats so narrow minded and so juvenile its quite sad really. So in yor mind if a even more radical islam group sprouts up in england or the phillipines or mayalsia should we not pursue them UNTILL there is a repeat of 9/11 .... and then we get CMU jeepers seal of approval.????

Also your a bleeding heart, all the dems love america to be trivialized by the UN.... and thats a big deal to you i am sure that we went into iraq with out UN approval. Well UN already passed a mandate in the early clinton adminsitration and draged there feet for darn near 10 years .... some one needed to act. The fact that iraq in your mind is not realted to 9/11 at the most basic level doesnt mean it isnt a central point in stragey in the mid east and the global economy. Saddam was an evil man, and controled 30% of the worlds oil .... this is all very very basic i dont understand why a "free thinker" like yourself cant see the strategy behind this as a stabalization of the region. Many wars have started for much much less than sadam did.

Lastly your precious UN is a joke ... koffi kid and koffi is a theif and the russians, the french and germans all were getting rich so your angle of "us imperalism" couldn't be more wrong. We should just stop funding the UN and it will crumble .... no other nation has any balls or any military worth anything that is willing to contribute. All the UN is a venue for 3rd world dictators to bitch at the great 8 and ask for concessions and pass hollow mandates they refuse to inforce.

I dont expect a response since you have responded to anything else of substance CMU jeepers.

Last edited by jamiesann; June 26th, 2006 at 10:07 AM.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 10:41 AM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamiesann
you make it seem as though only 9/11 related terror is an issue. The whole radical islam movement is an issue, most of the middle east is a hot bed, and add oil to the mix and its not as simple as you want. I understnad you hate bush and and subconsciously hate america .... but its not just an issue with 9/11. Ok let me pose this question we destroy all remnants of al quada and 9/11 are we 100% protected and safe from attackers with plans set in motion?
So I now hate America because I once again dissagree with my government. I guess I don't get to question the government when I, as a voter, don't think they are doing the right thing. Geez, I thought I read that I was allowed to do that in some old document that's in washington some where.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamiesann
No there is divergent radical islam groups all over the world in asia, in england, in germany, in italy, in africa. How the heck can you be so simple minded as to think our government only has the responsibility to seek out those who attack us FIRST, and ignore any pre-emptive strike from folks who havent acted yet. Thats so narrow minded and so juvenile its quite sad really. So in yor mind if a even more radical islam group sprouts up in england or the phillipines or mayalsia should we not pursue them UNTILL there is a repeat of 9/11 .... and then we get CMU jeepers seal of approval.????
No, we should not attack them. If asia, england, germany, italy, africa, etc. ask for our help then sure but once again we don't need Team American World Police. Have you seen the amount of money we spend in Iraq? Once again you think we should attack those who attack us which is fine and I had no problem with going to Afghanistan but stopping in Iraq to fix daddy's mistake is what I have issues with. So yes my seal of Approval to attack any country that attacks us in there.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jamiesann
Also your a bleeding heart, all the dems love america to be trivialized by the UN.... and thats a big deal to you i am sure that we went into iraq with out UN approval. Well UN already passed a mandate in the early clinton adminsitration and draged there feet for darn near 10 years .... some one needed to act. The fact that iraq in your mind is not realted to 9/11 at the most basic level doesnt mean it isnt a central point in stragey in the mid east and the global economy.
I could care less about the UN. I don't care if we ever get their approval and I wish we could boot them out of the US. They are a huge conspericy as to the New World Order if any.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jamiesann
Saddam was an evil man, and controled 30% of the worlds oil .... this is all very very basic i dont understand why a "free thinker" like yourself cant see the strategy behind this as a stabalization of the region. Many wars have started for much much less than sadam did.
Yes, I do agree that Saddam is a very evil man but he has not effected my way of life or yours for that matter so why don't we let his neighbors take care of him and if they need our help then so be it. That's right, he does control 30% of the worlds oil, so we are back to that are we? Go figure, a war over oil. Just what the rest of the world thinks and another reason the world hates the US.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamiesann
Lastly your precious UN is a joke ... koffi kid and koffi is a theif and the russians, the french and germans all were getting rich so your angle of "us imperalism" couldn't be more wrong. We should just stop funding the UN and it will crumble .... no other nation has any balls or any military worth anything that is willing to contribute. All the UN is a venue for 3rd world dictators to bitch at the great 8 and ask for concessions and pass hollow mandates they refuse to inforce.
Maybe we agree about something. I will repeat myself again so you don't have to scroll back up to read my previous statement on the un.

"I could care less about the UN. I don't care if we ever get their approval and I wish we could boot them out of the US. They are a huge conspericy as to the New World Order if any."



Quote:
Originally Posted by jamiesann
I dont expect a response since you have responded to anything else of substance CMU jeepers.

I like how you know me so well that you can even think for me. It is sad that you think I hate the US. What I do hate is Americans dying for a pointless war. Maybe you should run for office and help the US with their oil hungery impirialistic, World Police goals! Or you could just sign up and fight for what you believe in.

Edit: And another thing just because I didn't vote for bush doesn't mean I'm a through and through dem. I don't like most of there ideas as well. I sure don't like welfare and haveing to pay for crack babies and their crack head mothers but I don't think it's going away anytime soon. With that being said I did like Clinton's progressive welfare program. Do some research if you don't understand what I'm talking about but it was basically that you got less money for the more you earned but when you earned more money you were taxed less as well untill you pulled even at I belive it was around 18G/year. That number could be wrong. This does not solve all the problems but I do believe it was a step in the right direction.

Last edited by Chiefwoohaw; June 26th, 2006 at 11:02 AM.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 11:18 AM   #68
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Clinton had NO welfare reform policy.
It was a Republican plan that he passed, and bitched about it until it got public support then he took credit for it.

As for the rest of the topics, it's not worth the time spent typing.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 12:06 PM   #69
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Well, I'm glad that's settled.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 12:10 PM   #70
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Jackass.

IrishChef wins this thread.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 12:19 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by Stan
Clinton had NO welfare reform policy.
It was a Republican plan that he passed, and bitched about it until it got public support then he took credit for it.
If you want to talk about usless policy that is hurting the US then lets talk about Bush's "no children left behind" plan.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan
As for the rest of the topics, it's not worth the time spent typing.
I figured someone who might use illegal immigrants for workers would be to lazy to post a reply. Would it cost too much of your time to post? Why don't you hire somone and pay them under the table to post your thoughts.

Maybe you don't use illegal immigrants but if I had a running joke that I did I would sure try to stop that. Makes you look real good. Also, if you do use illegal immigrants are you aware that you are running from Uncle Sam and his taxes or his that your way of sticking it to the big government and their wellfare programs??

Don't get me wrong and think I hate you and all your conservitive ways. You seem to be an alright guy and from pictures you have a hott wife so you can't be too bad of a guy. We all have different views and I like to express mine just like everyone else on this site. Good luck trying to change me and I know I won't change many other views on here but I think this is the worst president in history and GW's approval rating suggest the same.

Last edited by Chiefwoohaw; June 26th, 2006 at 12:41 PM.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 12:56 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmujeeper
If you want to talk about usless policy that is hurting the US then lets talk about Bush's "no children left behind" plan.




I figured someone who might use illegal immigrants for workers would be to lazy to post a reply. Would it cost too much of your time to post? Why don't you hire somone and pay them under the table to post your thoughts.

Maybe you don't use illegal immigrants but if I had a running joke that I did I would sure try to stop that. Makes you look real good. Also, if you do use illegal immigrants are you aware that you are running from Uncle Sam and his taxes or his that your way of sticking it to the big government and their wellfare programs??

Don't get me wrong and think I hate you and all your conservitive ways. You seem to be an alright guy and from pictures you have a hott wife so you can't be too bad of a guy. We all have different views and I like to express mine just like everyone else on this site. Good luck trying to change me and I know I won't change many other views on here but I think this is the worst president in history and GW's approval rating suggest the same.


This is the best post you have ever made.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 04:26 PM   #73
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CMU - you seem like a bright guy. However, you have some aggression issues.

Not every conservative is a born-again, moral majority robot blindly following GW Bush. They are a diverse, free-thinking group of people who share some sommon traits.

In my experience, these conservatives:

1) Are self-supporting
2) Take pride in accomplishing something
3) Realize that "something for nothing" doesn't work for welfare or foreign policy.
4) Have deep feeling of patriotism for the U.S.
5) Think that less government is better (duh)
6) Beleive that, other than "the common defense" that the private sector can (and will) do virtually everything better than the federal government (as well as most state and much of local government).

I consider myslef a staunch concervative. That said, I violate the stereotype in many ways.

1) I'm not much for church, and don't want it anywhere near government. I however, do realize that the Constitution says the government shall not establish of promote a state religion - which says nothing about "under God" or the 10 Commandments being unallowable in government activity.

2) I'm for "tit for tat" trade restrictions - if your market's not open to us, ours ain't open to you. That goes for Japan, europe, China, or whoever.

3) Abortion - if you don't want one, don't have one - but it is legal and bombing clinics should buy you life in prison, if not a needle in the arm. That said, I VIGOROUSLY oppose lawmaking via the court system - a liberal trick to enact otherwise impossible to enact legislation.

Remember, both liberals and conservatives rarely fit the stereotype.

And remember the words of a wise man:

"A man who is not liberal when he is young has no heart. A man who does not grow more conservative as he ages and learns has no brain"
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Old June 26th, 2006, 06:53 PM   #74
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I love you Bruce.

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no thanks.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 07:04 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamiesann
.... this is all very very basic i dont understand why a "free thinker" like yourself cant see the strategy behind this as a stabalization of the region.
I agree with everything you said except that.

We're fooling ourselves if we think that we can ever establish a stable government in Iraq, and even if we could in would just become a target for all the Islamic whackos there.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 07:39 PM   #76
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We're fooling ourselves if we think that we can ever establish a stable government in Iraq, and even if we could in would just become a target for all the Islamic whackos there.
I'm afraid I agree with you there Bruce.

It's like giving a teenaged kid a new car. If they didn't have to want it hard enough and long enough to work for it themselves, they won't appreciate it. We can't make them want it enough to do it right.
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Old June 26th, 2006, 09:03 PM   #77
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no thanks.

Can't blame me for trying.
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