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Old December 18th, 2005, 12:33 AM   #21
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thanks scooter
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Old January 17th, 2006, 12:31 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScOoTeR
You have more chance getting a F.E. gain from the PowerAid sticker.
Glad it works for you.
How can so many claims be made to the difference in HP and FE by all the people who have used this product? From what you are saying it has absolutely zero effect on anything, Just very curious, I do a TON of research about a lot of upgrades and have read, yes, good and bad, but the good has been in the plenty.
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Old January 17th, 2006, 01:04 PM   #23
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My opinion is that the "swirl" effect it claims it creates increases pumping losses because of the extra charge motion it creates. IMHO, the price for the poweraid spacer isn't justified for the end result. Also, there can be a significant psychological contribution to your overall results, i.e. if you spend $100 on a little spacer, you will notice an improvement whether there is one or not.

I think there is a real gain to be noticed from a TB spacer, just not one that necks down into spirals, and you definitely shouldn't have to pay a premium for something that can be made so cheap. I imagine JCR offroad could make a (straight bore) spacer for a lot less $$$ and better benefit.

What do Poweraid spacers cost these days?
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Old January 17th, 2006, 01:11 PM   #24
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I was just givin one that is why I am so curious:tonka:

From Essentials? I think it was 70 bucks

I am going to put it on and give it a shot, it has the swirls and I read all the tech articles but something still isnt clicking with me and I do not see the gains either.
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Old January 24th, 2006, 12:16 PM   #25
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OK so after installing the TB Spacer I noticed zero difference in performance but there is a difference in gas mileage for sure. Once I put a new exhaust on I can hear a different kind of sound coming from the throttle body, which I believe ths is there claim to a "highperformance" sound but it sounds like the motor is going to explode thats all.

I think once I add an intake it will make more of a difference.

My two sense or cense, whatever
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Old January 24th, 2006, 09:59 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMFmike
OK so after installing the TB Spacer I noticed zero difference in performance but there is a difference in gas mileage for sure. Once I put a new exhaust on I can hear a different kind of sound coming from the throttle body, which I believe ths is there claim to a "highperformance" sound but it sounds like the motor is going to explode thats all.

I think once I add an intake it will make more of a difference.

My two sense or cense, whatever
Are you sure the new exhaust isn't the reason for fuel economy increase? I gained FE when I put a flowmaster 40 on my XJ.

Anywhoo,
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Old January 24th, 2006, 11:45 PM   #27
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Techmaster Scooter...I have a strange request for you.

We are building a drag car that will be running on alcohol. We have a few problems with this setup. We have a need to run dual fuel system(gas/alchy). The reason is...warm ups on gasoline, race on alcohol, than switch back to gasoline to evap all the alcohol blowby out of the crankcase.

The jets are roughly double the size of gasoline jets in the carb so pumping in gas will not work. My thoughts are getting a nitrous plate to put under the carb to inject fuel into the intake, bypassing the carb. This will make the carb work as if it where a throttle body. The car will have dual electric pumps one for each fuel system.

My strange question is do you have any guess as to which nitrous jet to use to make this beast idle. Also what psi for the gas system.

It will be a 493 cubic inch big block mopar 12.5 ish to 1 compression ratio with a dominator carb.

If you have no clue on what to use I understand.
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Old January 25th, 2006, 05:22 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monster4.0
Techmaster Scooter...I have a strange request for you.

The jets are roughly double the size of gasoline jets in the carb so pumping in gas will not work. My thoughts are getting a nitrous plate to put under the carb to inject fuel into the intake, bypassing the carb. This will make the carb work as if it where a throttle body. The car will have dual electric pumps one for each fuel system.

My strange question is do you have any guess as to which nitrous jet to use to make this beast idle. Also what psi for the gas system.

It will be a 493 cubic inch big block mopar 12.5 ish to 1 compression ratio with a dominator carb.

If you have no clue on what to use I understand.
Okay,
If I understand you correctly, you just want the ability to run/idle on gasoline - not to drive around, correct?

It might be possible, but I honestly have no idea for jet sizes for you to try first...
There must be flow charts for gasoline vs. pressure for each jet size (I'm guessing, never using nitrous before) so you could ballpark the size to get you close but I think that will be the least of your problems. Say you set up your nozzles for you to be able to idle your cold engine - since the fuel is being pumped in open-loop (turn the system on, the fuel flows 100% on until you switch it off). Now, if you touch the throttle, you'll get gobs more air with no additional fuel and run super-lean. I don't know if that would burn a piston at such a low load or not.

Lemme think on this some more...
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Old January 25th, 2006, 11:17 PM   #29
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If you touch the gas you will get a shot of alcohol until the float bowl can't provide fuel anymore.

I'm thinking cold starts will be a little tricky. Flip the gas pump switch on and off fast, hit the starter button, at first sign of the engine firing kick on the gas pump again.

We could fire it on alcohol and switch it over to gas while at idle. The main point of the system is the motor starts easier on gasoline, and it is real hard to get the up to racing temps on alcohol.

Do you know what is the absolute minimum fuel flow to keep an engine running? Say in a tbi type system. That would be close to what we will end up with.
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Old January 26th, 2006, 05:23 PM   #30
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I would say an easier solution is to run LPG instead of Gas.
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Old January 27th, 2006, 08:11 AM   #31
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I like that idea Shawn.

I wonder how small of a tank I could get refilled.
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Old January 27th, 2006, 09:23 AM   #32
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I am sure it wasnt the Exhaust skoot cause I went threw two tanks without it and I did see a gain. More with the exhaust but I did see something change with the airaid.
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Old February 12th, 2006, 09:52 PM   #33
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http://pesn.com/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/

Heard of this one? Adding acetone to your gasoline for better economy? I've personally gained 3 mpg highway, driving habits unchanged. Most people say I'm crazy, but I swear by it til I die.
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Old July 12th, 2006, 10:54 PM   #34
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Any chance of getting a specific part # on that Flowmaster 40 you've got? I'm willing to accept bad MPG to drive my Jeep, but at nearly $3/gal it's gettin out of hand. Any increase in MPG would be good. Well, that, and I want that sound :)
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Old July 12th, 2006, 11:42 PM   #35
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A guy spotted my truck at 7-11 the other day. He waited for me to come out, and started talking fuel mileage. ( I get 9 with my carbed 392 and 4.88's) He says his relative put some sort of gizmo on his truck and got a 5 mpg improvement. I told him I put four of them on my truck, and now I have to stop every few miles and drain off the extra fuel from my tank, to keep it from overflowing. You shoulda seen his face.
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Old July 13th, 2006, 01:42 AM   #36
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My class did a series of dyno tests on fuel mileage. The class before mine did it using acetone. My class did it using "fuel pills".

Basically they amounted to nothing.
I'd have to hunt for a while to find the results, but they make sense.

As for people that see an increase, a small amount could be because your injectors are cleaner now, having run a solvent through your tank. Thereby creating a better spray pattern wasting less fuel.
Another contribution is that usually there is a subconscious change in the way you drive. You put a fuel saver in the car, and subconsciously you take it a little easier taking off, maybe cruise a little slower, etc. You don't even realize it because it's such a small difference.

You'd almost have to do placebo testing like they do with medicine to get an accurate test.

or

Use a dyno that can load the engine to a specified cycle all the time. That's how we did our testing.

Anyway, good luck,

Phill
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Old July 13th, 2006, 08:51 AM   #37
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In my opinion/experience, usually when someone upgrades something and sees a large change, it probably meant they had a deficiency before, and the new part corrected that deficiency.

There isn't a magic gizmo out there right now.
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Old July 13th, 2006, 10:18 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guitardrumr
Any chance of getting a specific part # on that Flowmaster 40 you've got? I'm willing to accept bad MPG to drive my Jeep, but at nearly $3/gal it's gettin out of hand. Any increase in MPG would be good. Well, that, and I want that sound :)
It was "off the shelf" at a Midas shop...they were the only ones I could find that would weld it on - but they did a real shitty job.

Don't know the p/n, but I strongly suggest keeping your catalytic converter in the system; it doesn't cost anything, and I think the flowmaster would probably sound fairly obnoxious inside the truck without it.
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Old July 13th, 2006, 11:16 AM   #39
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I know there is someone in michigan who sells flowmasters, including the 40 series, on ebay for about $10 cheaper than I could find elsewhere.

Just look for the setup you wait, offsets, pipe size, etc.

I run a 2.25" in/out Flowmaster 40 on my Toyota 22RE, with just header-straight pipe-muffler-turndown, not bad at all.

Of course, I ran the same setup with dual flowmasters on the CJ-5 with a 304, and it was loud as hell. But those pipes exited under the rockers sidways. The toyota shoots out the back of the truck.

If you ran addtional piping after the muffler like you normally would on a XJ, it would also quiet it down a bit.

Would be nice on an XJ, since its in a vulnerable spot, and flowmasters are tough as hell. I dropped my CJ on them on rocks several times, and they barely dented.
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Old July 15th, 2006, 10:19 AM   #40
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I'm pretty much lookin for whatever will fit stock. I've heard many good things about the 40 series, so I was wondering if ya'll had a part number for a specific model. I have no plan to ditch the catalytic converter, just want that nice sound.
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