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Old June 8th, 2009, 06:10 PM   #421
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Please let me know how the Grand Canyon could be carved out so quickly, I'm very interested to know.

As far as population, I see no connection between it and the age of the Earth. Especially at times where modern medicine could not save people from massive pandemics.
Well, If you recognize the evidence of a Flood (and it is out there) then the carving of the grand canyon is Very easy to explain. Scientists may say it takes this long or that long because they observe what they can test. That is, the erosion rate at the current time/whenever they started recording it. It can be explained by the Flood story of Noah though. It is a run off river. If you had a World wide FLASH flood then you would naturally think that the Grand canyon could have been eroded very quickly due to the massive amount of water that would have been transporting.

Population, Intill civilizations started coming together, there wasn't Pandemics. YOu can't have a Pandemic when the few amounts of Inhabitants live miles away from each other. It's when cities started to grow and the amount of people on our planet started to get to a point is when the Pandemics were possible. Just a though.

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It matters how many samples they take. Sometimes the radio dates can be false, but 95% of the time they are correct. If you look at the data sets for the radio dating methods it's pretty clear that they run very true to what scientists and geographers have estimated the age of the Grand Canyon. It has been figured by water erosion rates and the time it takes to dissipate the minerals from the canyon walls into the sea.

Here's one thing to think about.....Why would someone WANT the Earth to be 6,000 years old? To make their religion seem more true to what they believe. Now why would someone WANT to believe that the Earth is 4.5 billion years old? I couldn't care less. If all of the scientific facts pointed to Earth being 6,000 years old I would have no problem with that, but it doesn't. There is no motive behind the Old Earth theory except observations. There is a massive motive behind the young earth theory and very influential people have been caught red-handed trying to make it APPEAR young.

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/icr-science.html
It's very true that most of the reasons behind people wanting the world to be 4-6000 years old is because of its connection with religion. The sad thing is the Reluctance of some scienctists to admit the proof of a younger earth.
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Old June 9th, 2009, 09:04 AM   #422
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Well, If you recognize the evidence of a Flood (and it is out there) then the carving of the grand canyon is Very easy to explain. Scientists may say it takes this long or that long because they observe what they can test. That is, the erosion rate at the current time/whenever they started recording it. It can be explained by the Flood story of Noah though. It is a run off river. If you had a World wide FLASH flood then you would naturally think that the Grand canyon could have been eroded very quickly due to the massive amount of water that would have been transporting.

Find me something that explains how a george 277 miles long, 8 miles wide, and 1 mile deep was carved out in 10,000 years or less.

Population, Intill civilizations started coming together, there wasn't Pandemics. YOu can't have a Pandemic when the few amounts of Inhabitants live miles away from each other. It's when cities started to grow and the amount of people on our planet started to get to a point is when the Pandemics were possible. Just a though.

Still, the average life expectancy 2,000 years ago was about 30 and there is record of illness that would destroy entire cities. Also, look at the population of the U.S. it's not linear or exponential from discovery until now.



It's very true that most of the reasons behind people wanting the world to be 4-6000 years old is because of its connection with religion. The sad thing is the Reluctance of some scienctists to admit the proof of a younger earth.
I'm saying that if there was proof of a younger earth, then scientists would have no problem with believing it. Proof of an older earth IS argued though because it contradicts some people's beliefs.
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Old June 9th, 2009, 10:05 AM   #423
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I'm saying that if there was proof of a younger earth, then scientists would have no problem with believing it. Proof of an older earth IS argued though because it contradicts some people's beliefs.
There is proof of a young earth and many scientists do believe. The bias media does not and will not interview them nor take thier quotes to publish. Thier are plenty of creation world view scientists that were at one time evolutionary scientist that saw darwin's theroy as flawed and more do see that sceince backs up a intelegent design.

One sceintist I heard him explain the population of the earth as an old earth and he did say that the earth could not hold all th e people on this planet if it were say 50,000 years old. He did explain that with the current population, of a young earth approx. 6000 years old we should be where we are now.
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Old June 9th, 2009, 10:22 AM   #424
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Originally Posted by L4CX
Well, If you recognize the evidence of a Flood (and it is out there) then the carving of the grand canyon is Very easy to explain. Scientists may say it takes this long or that long because they observe what they can test. That is, the erosion rate at the current time/whenever they started recording it. It can be explained by the Flood story of Noah though. It is a run off river. If you had a World wide FLASH flood then you would naturally think that the Grand canyon could have been eroded very quickly due to the massive amount of water that would have been transporting.

Find me something that explains how a george 277 miles long, 8 miles wide, and 1 mile deep was carved out in 10,000 years or less.

The Saginaw Valley, and the failure in a limestone layer that created it and several of the rivers that flow across our state could be used as an example of how it could have happen, but if you choose not to believe it it's pointless.....

The creation of the features of the Grand Canyon and the time it took are all speculation. It's easy to find scientists that will support this, but again if you don't believe them it's pointless......

Also you mentioned Radio tests, but you failed to mention that part of the test requires speculation, and random guesses as to conditions at the begining of the item being tested.....

Science has already shown at least an 11 million year error in its determination of determing age. What makes them right this time???????

You have offered no concrete or undenieable evidence in your arguement.

Just your opinion.......who cares what you think




Population, Intill civilizations started coming together, there wasn't Pandemics. YOu can't have a Pandemic when the few amounts of Inhabitants live miles away from each other. It's when cities started to grow and the amount of people on our planet started to get to a point is when the Pandemics were possible. Just a though.

Still, the average life expectancy 2,000 years ago was about 30 and there is record of illness that would destroy entire cities. Also, look at the population of the U.S. it's not linear or exponential from discovery until now.

Can we discount this record as stories, myths, plays, as you do with the Bible...



It's very true that most of the reasons behind people wanting the world to be 4-6000 years old is because of its connection with religion. The sad thing is the Reluctance of some scienctists to admit the proof of a younger earth.

I'm saying that if there was proof of a younger earth, then scientists would have no problem with believing it. Proof of an older earth IS argued though because it contradicts some people's beliefs.

What you should be saying is the proof of a younger earth, or the inconsistant, or lack of proof of an older earth is manipulated and used for an agenda by scientists because it contradicts their beliefs, and or disproves there conclusions.....
Scientist have a speculative range in the billions of years on the age of the earth, it all depends on which scientist you talk with , or believe.....

Kind of a blind faith thing....
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Old June 9th, 2009, 12:00 PM   #425
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The NEW age of the Grand Canyon; Scientists know one way to date minerals, radio dating. They essentially pick spots to take samples and see how old they are. The canyon is quite massive so it's not a surprise that there are many places that were not sampled yet. It would be like if the Bible said that the biggest salmon to ever live was 818 lbs but people say that's not possible and Bible Thumpers say that obviously we are all wrong because the world record weight keeps changing.

Radio dating; Certian elements will form together and slowly trade neutrons at a specific rate that always remains constant. read this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiodating and post something that gives proof of failure in radiometric dating.

Population; Thank you for backing me up on the fact that nobody knows the history of Earth's population.

I've posted LOTS of links to theories that support what I believe. Show me something besides and old book that supports what you believe.
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Old June 9th, 2009, 01:58 PM   #426
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There is proof of a young earth and many scientists do believe. The bias media does not and will not interview them nor take thier quotes to publish. Thier are plenty of creation world view scientists that were at one time evolutionary scientist that saw darwin's theroy as flawed and more do see that sceince backs up a intelegent design.

One sceintist I heard him explain the population of the earth as an old earth and he did say that the earth could not hold all th e people on this planet if it were say 50,000 years old. He did explain that with the current population, of a young earth approx. 6000 years old we should be where we are now.
So population always has to increase at a constant rate? What about the population of lions? Why haven't they taken over the world? Did you ever think that the human population was always kept in check by mother nature.....people got eaten by predators just like everything else did. Not until humans evolved into a superior species capable of using inteligence to climb to the top of the food chain was the population able to grow.
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Old June 9th, 2009, 02:06 PM   #427
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How come this tribe isn't very large even though it's been around for hundreds of years?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24895872/
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Old June 9th, 2009, 02:48 PM   #428
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The NEW age of the Grand Canyon; Scientists know one way to date minerals, radio dating. They essentially pick spots to take samples and see how old they are. The canyon is quite massive so it's not a surprise that there are many places that were not sampled yet. It would be like if the Bible said that the biggest salmon to ever live was 818 lbs but people say that's not possible and Bible Thumpers say that obviously we are all wrong because the world record weight keeps changing.

Radio dating; Certian elements will form together and slowly trade neutrons at a specific rate that always remains constant. read this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiodating and post something that gives proof of failure in radiometric dating.

Population; Thank you for backing me up on the fact that nobody knows the history of Earth's population.

I've posted LOTS of links to theories that support what I believe. Show me something besides and old book that supports what you believe.
My therory is your wrong......
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Old June 9th, 2009, 04:33 PM   #429
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How come this tribe isn't very large even though it's been around for hundreds of years?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24895872/
Genetic defects, inbreading etc.

Did you look into the site that I gave you irc.org creationworldview.org creationists.org. These are scientist that look at the science behind creation and show flaws in the evolution debate.

I am reading a book called The Case for a Creator by Lee Strobel

You ask who is Lee Strobel, he is a journalist for the Chicago Tribune, he was where you are now in your disbelief of a Creator and everything points toward evolution and then he saw the light, so to speak.

Check it out with an open mind, the websites and the author Lee Strobel
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Old June 9th, 2009, 04:37 PM   #430
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The NEW age of the Grand Canyon; Scientists know one way to date minerals, radio dating. They essentially pick spots to take samples and see how old they are. The canyon is quite massive so it's not a surprise that there are many places that were not sampled yet. It would be like if the Bible said that the biggest salmon to ever live was 818 lbs but people say that's not possible and Bible Thumpers say that obviously we are all wrong because the world record weight keeps changing.

Radio dating; Certian elements will form together and slowly trade neutrons at a specific rate that always remains constant. read this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiodating and post something that gives proof of failure in radiometric dating.

Population; Thank you for backing me up on the fact that nobody knows the history of Earth's population.

I've posted LOTS of links to theories that support what I believe. Show me something besides and old book that supports what you believe.

The web sites I told you about supports what I believe and it is not all from the old book you talk about. Science can prove the existance of Intellegent Design
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Old June 9th, 2009, 07:09 PM   #431
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My therory is your wrong......
Also provable in many different situations.

Radio Dating goes on the idea that the rate of Decay stays the same through out the Millions of years our universe right? What happens if it does change? Is there any proof to indicate that it stays constant?
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Old June 9th, 2009, 07:49 PM   #432
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Also provable in many different situations.

Radio Dating goes on the idea that the rate of Decay stays the same through out the Millions of years our universe right? What happens if it does change? Is there any proof to indicate that it stays constant?

Also I heard on the Radio that clint357 is wrong so it must be a fact supported by Radio Testing......lol
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Old June 9th, 2009, 08:36 PM   #433
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Also I heard on the Radio that clint357 is wrong so it must be a fact supported by Radio Testing......lol
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Old June 9th, 2009, 10:02 PM   #434
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So population always has to increase at a constant rate? What about the population of lions? Why haven't they taken over the world? Did you ever think that the human population was always kept in check by mother nature.....people got eaten by predators just like everything else did. Not until humans evolved into a superior species capable of using inteligence to climb to the top of the food chain was the population able to grow.
For starters humans did not evolve, they have always been at the top of the food chain and man has always keep the animals in check even into extinction. When I find the formula that shows human growth rate I will share it with you.

How do you figure that humans evolved? I think more of myself than have come from a common ancestor(slime to monkey) come on look at the writting on the wall. To think that us as humans have no meaning, no purpose, no beginnning and no end, nothing. What a waste. I believe we have a purpose and were put here for a reason.
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Old June 9th, 2009, 11:55 PM   #435
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For starters humans did not evolve, they have always been at the top of the food chain and man has always keep the animals in check even into extinction. When I find the formula that shows human growth rate I will share it with you.

How do you figure that humans evolved? I think more of myself than have come from a common ancestor(slime to monkey) come on look at the writting on the wall. To think that us as humans have no meaning, no purpose, no beginnning and no end, nothing. What a waste. I believe we have a purpose and were put here for a reason.
and this arrogance is why religion still exists.
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Old June 10th, 2009, 08:48 AM   #436
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and this arrogance is why religion still exists.
It still exist because we all need Christ without him we would be lost and destined for eturnity without Him.
We need to look at ourselves as more than dirt but not more than we ought to and still be humble.
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Old June 10th, 2009, 11:01 AM   #437
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It still exist because we all need Christ without him we would be lost and destined for eturnity without Him.
We need to look at ourselves as more than dirt but not more than we ought to and still be humble.
You are not humble. You are far to arrogant to admit that we may not have some grand purpose, or that we are mortal. Afterlife is a fun thought and I can see why it is comforting, but there is absolutely no good reason to believe that it exists.

EDIT: my 666'th post was in a religion thread. /laugh

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Old June 10th, 2009, 12:02 PM   #438
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You are not humble. You are far to arrogant to admit that we may not have some grand purpose, or that we are mortal. Afterlife is a fun thought and I can see why it is comforting, but there is absolutely no good reason to believe that it exists.

EDIT: my 666'th post was in a religion thread. /laugh

Arrogant and close minded, read your own posts..............
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Old June 10th, 2009, 12:28 PM   #439
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You are not humble. You are far to arrogant to admit that we may not have some grand purpose, or that we are mortal. Afterlife is a fun thought and I can see why it is comforting, but there is absolutely no good reason to believe that it exists.

EDIT: my 666'th post was in a religion thread. /laugh
Have you heard of the blind leading the blind? and besides I would not expect you to understand as you do not believe in Jesus Christ. The Lord is the only One that can allow you to see what is of Him. As it says... let him who has eyes to see let him see, ears to hear let him hear. So I do not blame you for your own ignorance you just don't know any better.

But if you ask He can help you with that...he has not because he asks not.
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Old June 10th, 2009, 01:04 PM   #440
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Arrogant and close minded, read your own posts..............
please, show me some good evidence that an afterlife exists. I have said nothing that would make me arrogant and close minded. I have simply stated that we have zero evidence to support the existence of an afterlife. Believing something without evidence is idiotic.
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