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Old March 23rd, 2009, 08:56 PM   #1
lososjoyride00
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Default rocks and valleys suggestions....

we are trying to do the best job we can at making a park for the people. we want to make it as much fun for everyone, while challenging at the same time. we would like to hear your opinions, suggestions of what you want, what you thought was fun, or what you didn like. lets hear what you guys want. we will try our best to get something for everyone. hope to see everyone very soon. May 16th is the opening weekend, and we will be having trail rides before then.
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Old March 23rd, 2009, 09:07 PM   #2
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You had some good suggestions here;
http://www.greatlakes4x4.com/showthr...nions+on+rocks

To save you looking, I'll a couple of my comments.

It sounds pretty darn good. I'm anxious to see the tight and twisty area that you mentioned. I'd like to see you have a trail in the tight area & plop a couple rocks in here and there just to make it more interesting. Not really make it a rock crawl but make it different than just driving through the woods with tight turns. Keep it that way and make a bypass around ithe spots where people struggle.

Knarly rock crawls are great. You guys have started that really well and your plans will make it even better.

In addition, a rocky trail ride is cool. Let me throw this out; we wheel a lot in Canada. Part of the fun in Canada is running a trail that gives a variety of challenges all in one trail but you are able to keep moving. It's fun to have to wind around a tight tree, maybe get off camber a little & then have to work you way over/around a rock or log and sometimes both. Don't make it continuous rocks but make it so it has a variety and will make it more challenging than just driving through the woods.

A lot of the trails in Canada have mud with rocks in them. If you wanted to take a muddy area and dump some miscellaneous rocks and an occasional log to cross, it changes it from being a high speed, horsepower mud run to something that requires technical driving and a bit of horesepower to boot. I look at that muddy section you took us on last week where robo got up against the tree. That's a perfect spot to dump a couple rocks in at the base of the hill.

Here's a perfect example. This is Tab's wife Kristi driving. It's a slight incline, full of mud, a few rocks and she has a tree to maneuver around. Take special note of the miscellaneous rocks behind her.



Here's another of me in a different spot. Off camber, slippery and a few rocks. Note, these are not "gate keeper" challenges but when you have a 1/4 mile long trail filled with this where you can keep moving, it's a good time.

[/
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Old March 23rd, 2009, 09:41 PM   #3
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thanx for the info, ron and a few of us are working all week tryin to make new trails, and fix up a few existing trails for this next weekend. the owner is real set on not having realy tight trails, for hes insistant ppl dont want to scratch their rigs. may be a good suggestion this weekend, that we want tight, technical trails. keep the comments coming guys.
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Old March 23rd, 2009, 09:49 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lososjoyride00 View Post
thanx for the info, ron and a few of us are working all week tryin to make new trails, and fix up a few existing trails for this next weekend. the owner is real set on not having realy tight trails, for hes insistant ppl dont want to scratch their rigs. may be a good suggestion this weekend, that we want tight, technical trails. keep the comments coming guys.
HE'S WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Unfortunately I can't be there this weekend. My jeep's getting a couple mods & won't be ready. You need to get the owner to understand that there are people in this sport that want extremely tight trails. How can I help? Pics of typical stuff? Actually I don't know how many people have pics of tight stuff. Usually we're just driving it.

Here's Clarkstoncracker;



Here's another Canadian shot;



If you want to offer a wide variety of terrain to your customers, you need BOTH. Just like some want mud, others want hills and others want rocks.

Last edited by whiterhino; March 23rd, 2009 at 10:05 PM.
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Old March 23rd, 2009, 10:39 PM   #5
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Things look great in there, nice variety of trails. Jeff took me out on a few really tight ones, off camber, mud, rocks. I think you're building a good range of areas to play. I got a couple of pics...

Some new snow hides a lot, but this was a nice rough hill climb.


Good mud section here before a tight little hill with a log & door-buster of a tree beside you, I had to get the winch out to get over the log, nice challenge. ( I think my locker's out...)


Nice gravel pit area with lots of little off-camber routes.


Cool rock garden you guys got going here...


Can't wait to see what some of this looks like when it's summer!
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Old March 24th, 2009, 07:14 AM   #6
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all I can say is that most people dont have a clue as to what a capable vehicle and driver can put a vehicle through... make the obsticals harder than it "looks" like it can be and people will do it. dont make rocks stacked up so there is a "line" throught it... make the most challenge out of the items given for the changes...

and you guys might consider some gunnite and a "man made" area for the crazier people out there... if you did that you would have the best area in the state at that point...

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=772605

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=770891
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Old March 24th, 2009, 07:46 AM   #7
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The gunnite is a great idea.
It would be interesting to see how durable the product is in a freeze/thaw enviroment.
It may be cost prohibitve to repair every spring.
I would like to see area's that challenge drivers skills as much as the rigs capabilities.
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Old March 24th, 2009, 07:51 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miHummer View Post
Things look great in there, nice variety of trails. Jeff took me out on a few really tight ones, off camber, mud, rocks. I think you're building a good range of areas to play. I got a couple of pics...
If I understand the original poster's questions, he's not looking for pics of what is already there but rather opinions on what to do for improvements.

Eric, did I read you wrong?
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Old March 24th, 2009, 10:13 AM   #9
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yes, but pics are ok. we just want to hear what you guys want, so we can give the owners some suggestions. hes kinda new to this offroad park idea. ron and i have a pretty good idea what we want, but its just getting jeff to build some gnarly, crazy stuff thats gonna be difficult. hes still under the asumption that ppl absolutely dont want to scratch or dent their rigs. we have alot of trails and stuff that arent that hard, but we want to build something like TT has, thats gonna be fun for something on 44s
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Old March 24th, 2009, 11:16 AM   #10
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Anything that points you at the sky is also good!


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Old March 24th, 2009, 12:08 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
HE'S WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Unfortunately I can't be there this weekend. My jeep's getting a couple mods & won't be ready. You need to get the owner to understand that there are people in this sport that want extremely tight trails. How can I help? Pics of typical stuff? Actually I don't know how many people have pics of tight stuff. Usually we're just driving it.

If you want to offer a wide variety of terrain to your customers, you need BOTH. Just like some want mud, others want hills and others want rocks.
x2

Even those of us with less capable and/or DD (or prettier!) rigs than Jim or some of the folks in the pictures he posted like tight twisty stuff with a variety of challenges. I sometimes choose to go around stuff that may put me on my side or drag the entire side down a rock ledge, but build a challenge and then let folks figure out if they can or want to run that particular section. If folks are looking for a scratch-free dent-free outing there is plenty of state 2-tracks in the area.
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Old March 24th, 2009, 03:11 PM   #12
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I have not been to the park yet but I am at my grandparents about 20 minutes from the park a lot in the summer, so I would like to come out some time.

But, from the pictures, it looks like there isn't much that would not eat my 2" lifted ZJ on 29" a/t's. Is there stuff there that I could play on without destroying my Jeep, or is this for bigger rigs?
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Old March 24th, 2009, 08:17 PM   #13
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there are alot of trails and runs your jeep will do just fine on. bring it and see.
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Old April 1st, 2009, 06:37 PM   #14
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more ideas....
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Old April 3rd, 2009, 06:51 PM   #15
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I have plenty of scratches and dents from the park. and Loso's rig body shows even more. Not trying to dent anything but if your not careful it will happen. As for drivers challenges , That is a big focus on building. Somethings look tough, but with a good spotter and Balls you can do it. Big boy things to come as we build. Majority of the wheelers will be mid size rigs and I have them covered for trials. Stockers are taken care of as well. The big stuff is on the way. But I feel a bunch of well built multi- challenging trails will be best use of the land with multiple side trial obstacles of different skill levels will best fill your day at the park. I'm listening and taking notes and will do my best to give you the pucker factor your asking for.


Thanks for pics and the description to show a little of what is being asked for. They show we are dong what is asked. Sorry we dont have any rock faces in Lower Mi. but will try to make something just as fun
THANKS RP

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Old April 3rd, 2009, 07:16 PM   #16
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I want obstacles (not mud) that when you drive by you would think theirs no way in hell a truck (of any caliber) could drive over that......
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Old April 7th, 2009, 12:08 PM   #17
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come on ppl, we want your info. i know theres alot of ppl out there to put in their ideas.... if you say, it, we will build it. within reason that is.
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Old April 12th, 2009, 11:42 PM   #18
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Shotcrete. SHOTCRETE. SHOTCRETE!

There's my suggestion (same idea as the gunnite 95geo is talking about) Then some time with an excavator can make some truly gnarly lines :cool:
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Old April 12th, 2009, 11:46 PM   #19
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And X100000000 the tight tight trails suggestion. That'll make people pucker trying to nav through to avoid major damage (for the pretty jeeps) and will give the crazy folk a hell of a lot more fun than wide open bullshit.
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Old April 12th, 2009, 11:56 PM   #20
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Also (and this is guessing since I haven't seen the park yet), put in butthole clenching off camber sections instead of just ALL straight hill climbs. The heightened possibility of roll will make them for more satisfying. Add in some rocks which threaten to keel you over to the down hill side


Basically, make stuff that people think they can't do, or shouldn't do. Maybe they'll chicken out a few different trips to the park before finally trying. All the better. Make challenges that some people wont even try... Example: Hill climb where near the top the trail actually pivots around a tree, not only requiring a 3 point turn or front dig, but also lays the top/cage directly on or very near the tree before heading back downhill. Just get creative with the terrain available. Not everyone should be able to do everything. That's what keeps people coming back to a certain wheeling location, especially as they continue to build their rig to meet new challenges.
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