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Old March 24th, 2009, 07:37 AM   #121
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Not for embryonic stem cell research. to say differently is to be misinformed. That is what this debate is about, stem cell research.

You have already concieded that life begins at conception, for argument sake at least, so it is the same. Just because the life is at a different stage in development dosen't change the fact you are killing it... An unborn person looks different than a 20 year old, as does a person 3 days after conception, same person....
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Old March 24th, 2009, 07:54 AM   #122
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I wasnt trying to be a dick in anyway possible but it was my first daughter and to have that happen was life changing to realize how short life really can be..... Stuff like this is just emotionaly sensitive to me, when i burried my daughter it was the hardest thing to do but that only time i got to really thinkin about life..... But if i ruined your guys's post in anyway im sorry dont mind me its just a sensitive subject.....
I apologize for any emotional charge I caused you. I deleted the picture.
I only have to say that abortion is a discount of a human life and I have huge issues when people act like it's no big thing....I find the egg picture joking about killing children more offensive than an actual picture of an abortion that shows what a bunch of barbarians with no value for life we have become....Present company excluded
I'm not sure what your position is on abortion, but I think it's safe to say that you would have a strong position with somebody if they told you you didn't loose a daughter because she really wasn't a person , or had not rights to live...
My wife say's I'm not allowed to talk about abortion because I don't have any control over my emotions on the subject...Maybe she is right, or maybe it's just that big of a deal....
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Old March 24th, 2009, 08:42 AM   #123
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I kind of feel like I started this, but I didn't mean to start an abortion thread, i meant to post another funny picture
It was a funny picture, but when toes posted his image with blatant disregard to the facts I had to say something. SO with that I will summarize.

The cells used for research are the same cells used for IVF. (test tube babies). Instead of implanting them into the uterus They are used for research. NO fetuses are cut apart for any of their cells, as some are saying. Also, Embryonic stem cells are totipotent, which means they can differentiate into ANY cell in the body. Whereas post embryonic cells (adult stem cells) are only able to differentiate into SOME cells in the body. This is why researchers believe that with embryonic stem cells we can grow and repair the cells in our body which cannot repair themselves on their own. You cannot take a skin cell from an adult and make a nerve cell. But you may be able to take an embryonic cell, before it has made up its mind on what it wants to be and make a nerve cell.

Regardless of you agreement or disagreement on this issue, these are the facts.
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Old March 24th, 2009, 09:56 AM   #124
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which brings me to my original question why would only non-embryonic stem cells help this man?

Because that is the only type of stem cell that has helped any human being, ever.
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Old March 24th, 2009, 09:59 AM   #125
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Because that is the only type of stem cell that has helped any human being, ever.
And if Dave has anything to do with it, it will always be that way.
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Old March 24th, 2009, 10:40 AM   #126
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Because that is the only type of stem cell that has helped any human being, ever.
Why do you think that is? Legal issues and lack of funding perhaps??
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Old March 24th, 2009, 10:52 AM   #127
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Why do you think that is? Legal issues and lack of funding perhaps??
Not really, it has been funded, and all the hollywood big dogs can put their money where their mouth is. Funding won't be an issue.

neckts

I answered your question, and you bunny-trailed it.
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Old March 24th, 2009, 11:10 AM   #128
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Not really, it has been funded, and all the hollywood big dogs can put their money where their mouth is. Funding won't be an issue.

neckts

I answered your question, and you bunny-trailed it.
By your logic we should end all research, because it has not helped any human yet. I see your point but I think you are wrongfully denying the potential. There is a potential in this research.
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Old March 24th, 2009, 11:13 AM   #129
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It was a funny picture, but when toes posted his image with blatant disregard to the facts I had to say something. SO with that I will summarize.

The cells used for research are the same cells used for IVF. (test tube babies). Instead of implanting them into the uterus They are used for research. NO fetuses are cut apart for any of their cells, as some are saying. Also, Embryonic stem cells are totipotent, which means they can differentiate into ANY cell in the body. Whereas post embryonic cells (adult stem cells) are only able to differentiate into SOME cells in the body. This is why researchers believe that with embryonic stem cells we can grow and repair the cells in our body which cannot repair themselves on their own. You cannot take a skin cell from an adult and make a nerve cell. But you may be able to take an embryonic cell, before it has made up its mind on what it wants to be and make a nerve cell.

Regardless of you agreement or disagreement on this issue, these are the facts.
I'm glad you finally agree with me...

Heres my post which you claim is a disregard to the facts...

Hey don't worry an embyo or fetus is not alive...

Its not human...

What chunk you want for your reserch or cure...

Just look, it's a big gob of cells....


What are you studying...

My post also says what chunk you want for your research. Is it your opinion that an aborted fetus is not used for research, talk about getting the facts wrong...
When you get back to school do some reaserch on the Tuskegee syphilis experiments, and the connection to a fetus used for research, and the 1974 National Research Act, and the provisions used for research of a human fetus or parts of, before or after an abortion.

I'll give you a 50 page list of research using a human fetus or a part ripped from it....
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Old March 24th, 2009, 11:16 AM   #130
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By your logic we should end all research, because it has not helped any human yet. I see your point but I think you are wrongfully denying the potential. There is a potential in this research.
I am not denying potential, but I am being realistic, and I am being ACCURATE regarding the lame cartoon.
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Old March 24th, 2009, 11:21 AM   #131
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By your logic we should end all research, because it has not helped any human yet. I see your point but I think you are wrongfully denying the potential. There is a potential in this research.

Theres a potenial for a cure for something, potential being a speculation. I think some of this was covered in WW 2 in the Nazi concentration camps, mine ferher vee have za potential to fiiiind sszomzing, Veee know is OK because zaa jew iz not human and doz not dezerv to liff...
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Old March 24th, 2009, 11:32 AM   #132
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Originally Posted by jeepinRRT View Post
It was a funny picture, but when toes posted his image with blatant disregard to the facts I had to say something. SO with that I will summarize.

The cells used for research are the same cells used for IVF. (test tube babies). Instead of implanting them into the uterus They are used for research. NO fetuses are cut apart for any of their cells, as some are saying. Also, Embryonic stem cells are totipotent, which means they can differentiate into ANY cell in the body. Whereas post embryonic cells (adult stem cells) are only able to differentiate into SOME cells in the body. This is why researchers believe that with embryonic stem cells we can grow and repair the cells in our body which cannot repair themselves on their own. You cannot take a skin cell from an adult and make a nerve cell. But you may be able to take an embryonic cell, before it has made up its mind on what it wants to be and make a nerve cell.




Regardless of you agreement or disagreement on this issue, these are the facts.

I may have got caught up in everything, so would you please direct me to any articles which verify that people have moral, religious, or idealogical issues with stem cell research that dosen't involve destroying an embryo, fetus, or 3 year old...I think you understand what I'm looking for, then I can get a good laugh out of the cartoon....
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Old March 24th, 2009, 07:42 PM   #133
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I may have got caught up in everything, so would you please direct me to any articles which verify that people have moral, religious, or idealogical issues with stem cell research that dosen't involve destroying an embryo, fetus, or 3 year old...I think you understand what I'm looking for, then I can get a good laugh out of the cartoon....
no one is destroying a fetus, or a three year old for stem cell research. This cartoon is clearly foreshadowing the possibilities of the future with embryonic stem cell research. The ethics of non-embryonic stem cells have nothing to do with this cartoon.
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Old March 24th, 2009, 08:29 PM   #134
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no one is destroying a fetus, or a three year old for stem cell research. This cartoon is clearly foreshadowing the possibilities of the future with embryonic stem cell research. The ethics of non-embryonic stem cells have nothing to do with this cartoon.

Maybe I wasn't caught up in the moment. So what your saying is the cartoon and the reference to moral, religious, or idealogical issues would center around embryonic stem cell reserch. So we can go back to when life begins, how do we justify killing a human ect.

Oh yeah what about my blatant disregard to the facts, and aborted fetuses being used for research....You still saying that dosen't happen....

Here is what I said with the picture of the aborted fetus

What chunk you want for your reserch or cure...

And you called it a blatant disregard to the facts...
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Old March 24th, 2009, 08:34 PM   #135
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To: toes, jeepin, dave, and anyone else that hijacked my simple religious humor
thread and transformed it into an never ending abortion thread, I'd like to say .
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Old March 24th, 2009, 08:35 PM   #136
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Maybe I wasn't caught up in the moment. So what your saying is the cartoon and the reference to moral, religious, or idealogical issues would center around embryonic stem cell reserch. So we can go back to when life begins, how do we justify killing a human ect.

Oh yeah what about my blatant disregard to the facts, and aborted fetuses being used for research....You still saying that dosen't happen....

Here is what I said with the picture of the aborted fetus

What chunk you want for your reserch or cure...

And you called it a blatant disregard to the facts...
we are talking about EMBRYONIC stem cell research. NO FETUSES are being used for this. In regards to other forms of research i dont know but they could be, but this is not the topic at hand.

The cartoon is about the possible future, and, a real situation that could play out IF something is found. How do you not see this?
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Old March 24th, 2009, 08:37 PM   #137
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To: toes, jeepin, dave, and anyone else that hijacked my simple religious humor
thread and transformed it into an never ending abortion thread, I'd like to say .
I get no appreciation for defending your thread

But seriously, no intent to hijack but I should have seen it coming...... oh wait I think I did......
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Old March 24th, 2009, 08:44 PM   #138
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I get no appreciation for defending your thread

But seriously, no intent to hijack but I should have seen it coming...... oh wait I think I did......
I do not believe there was anything to defend...as stated before this threads purpose was to incite a bit of religious humor on those members who chose to view it. Maybe I should have posted it in the motivational thread.
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Old March 24th, 2009, 08:46 PM   #139
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I just wonder all of you that are so down on this, If your child, wife or mother, father etc. life could be saved by this would you feel different? Would this be the choice of the mother to give up her egg to save a life?

And if you say its Gods choice, did god give us the chance to do this?
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Old March 24th, 2009, 08:54 PM   #140
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I do not believe there was anything to defend...as stated before this threads purpose was to incite a bit of religious humor on those members who chose to view it. Maybe I should have posted it in the motivational thread.
FWIW I found the humor. i wasnt going to say anything until Hombre implied that embryonic stem cells were taken from a fetus.

I dont like propaganda pretending to be fact.
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