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Old March 18th, 2009, 02:55 PM   #61
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The company failed and they received 170 billion tax dollars to stay afloat. Enough said for me.



Then should the janitor give his compensation back too? After all he was an AIG employee.

By that standard all the UAW workers at GM should give up any compensation they received because GM failed and received bailout funds. I'm sure Mr. Wagner will be happy to hear that.

Your anger is understandable but you are placing blame in the wrong place. It wasn't the workers at AIG that caused this mess, it was our wonderful Gov't.

Don't expect them to own up to it though, it's much easier for them to demonize the AIG workers who were "greedy". That will sell on Main St. and at the same time deflects blame away from the real criminals here, our government leaders.

I expect AIG to keep the bonus money and the secretary of the Treasury or some other person in an appointed position to take the fall. That will shield all the people up for re-election in 2010.
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Old March 18th, 2009, 03:03 PM   #62
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Then should the janitor give his compensation back too? After all he was an AIG employee.

By that standard all the UAW workers at GM should give up any compensation they received because GM failed and received bailout funds. I'm sure Mr. Wagner will be happy to hear that.

Your anger is understandable but you are placing blame in the wrong place. It wasn't the workers at AIG that caused this mess, it was our wonderful Gov't.

Don't expect them to own up to it though, it's much easier for them to demonize the AIG workers who were "greedy". That will sell on Main St. and at the same time deflects blame away from the real criminals here, our government leaders.

I expect AIG to keep the bonus money and the secretary of the Treasury or some other person in an appointed position to take the fall. That will shield all the people up for re-election in 2010.
You say AIG should not have got the bail out money. I agree, but then they would not be getting their bonuses and would not even have a job. And our entire way of life would collapse or some shit right?


Then you say since the Government was dumb enough to get suckered into giving AIG the bail out money, so it is OK for the bonuses to be given? Sorry no way to wrongs don't make a right.

AIG's policies are flawed or the company would not have needed a bail out. Either AIG should have been let to die off, and be replaced by another company, or their policies should be required to change as part of the stipulation for getting a bail out.
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Old March 18th, 2009, 03:48 PM   #63
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I think what concerns me more than the bonuses is the government threating to tax the recipients 100% of the money...

If they do it to them they will do it to you......

Can you say socialism or comunism.....
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Old March 18th, 2009, 05:23 PM   #64
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What concerns me is that this administration is showing it's ultra-liberal roots, and with a compliant Congressional majority and unquestioning loyalty of the media they're flexing their muscles.

It knowingly and willfully inserted protections for AIG bonuses into TARP, then feigned "outrage" and claimed ignorance. Why? To protect their generous campaign donors and at the same time stoke the flames of populist class warfare, right out of the Marxist playbook. Anybody who acts surprised that Obama, ACORN alumni would pull this just hasn't been paying attention.

Add onto that the discussion of using the parliamentary parlour trick of "reconciliation" to pass more liberal crap like an expansion of socialized health care to the already earmark/payoff-bloated budget and Obama's desire to charge combat-injured vets for medical care. Garnish with a Atty General who (with Obama's support) is looking for ways to suspend 2nd Amendment rights for the SW corner of the country "to help Mexico out".

And he has only been in office about 60 days.
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Old March 18th, 2009, 05:31 PM   #65
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They get 170 Billion in bailout money and then the say they are going to be giving out 160 million in bonuses

I'm confused why these exe's are getting rewarded for bad management to the point that they have to be bailed out

Maybe i dont see the logic
These were retension bonus's. The company was downsizing and laying off personnel. The bunus's were offered to people to stay on with the company in
stead of finding other positions. The bonus is paid when the end of the contract is reached. I would not give the money back, I would sue the government for breach of contract.
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Old March 18th, 2009, 06:48 PM   #66
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You say AIG should not have got the bail out money. I agree, but then they would not be getting their bonuses and would not even have a job. And our entire way of life would collapse or some shit right?
I never said it would all collapse, that was the lie told to you by the gov't to cause panic and give them the ability to pass laws that would other wise be very unpopular. I don't buy it, and never did.

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Then you say since the Government was dumb enough to get suckered into giving AIG the bail out money, so it is OK for the bonuses to be given? Sorry no way to wrongs don't make a right.
Nope they weren't dumb at all, it was their(the gov'ts) plan all along. "never let a crisis go to waste", right? Yeah.

The bailout was wrong and the bailout included the bonus pay, it isn't two wrong's it's one big wrong.

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AIG's policies are flawed or the company would not have needed a bail out. Either AIG should have been let to die off, and be replaced by another company, or their policies should be required to change as part of the stipulation for getting a bail out.
AIG's problem was that the government forced them to do business in a way that led to their demise, it was the policy of the government that caused their collapse. It was not by accident. Seeing the bigger picture yet?

We agree that bonuses being removed should have been part of the required change, but it wasn't, and now it can't be, the law has already been written, the checks already mailed and cashed.

Last edited by 3-foot; March 18th, 2009 at 06:52 PM.
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Old March 18th, 2009, 06:50 PM   #67
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What concerns me is that this administration is showing it's ultra-liberal roots, and with a compliant Congressional majority and unquestioning loyalty of the media they're flexing their muscles.

It knowingly and willfully inserted protections for AIG bonuses into TARP, then feigned "outrage" and claimed ignorance. Why? To protect their generous campaign donors and at the same time stoke the flames of populist class warfare, right out of the Marxist playbook. Anybody who acts surprised that Obama, ACORN alumni would pull this just hasn't been paying attention.

Add onto that the discussion of using the parliamentary parlour trick of "reconciliation" to pass more liberal crap like an expansion of socialized health care to the already earmark/payoff-bloated budget and Obama's desire to charge combat-injured vets for medical care. Garnish with a Atty General who (with Obama's support) is looking for ways to suspend 2nd Amendment rights for the SW corner of the country "to help Mexico out".

And he has only been in office about 60 days.
What he said!

Thank you! I was starting to think I was the only one who can see this for what it really is, a scam.
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Old March 18th, 2009, 07:01 PM   #68
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Dodd (D) just stated on CNN that loopholes were written in the bill to allow the bonuses.


Good old dems!
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Old March 19th, 2009, 10:11 AM   #69
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Nope they weren't dumb at all, it was their(the gov'ts) plan all along. "never let a crisis go to waste", right? Yeah.

The bailout was wrong and the bailout included the bonus pay, it isn't two wrong's it's one big wrong.

A little to much conspiracy for me. In what you are saying. And our Government is dumb in many ways.

You are right it is not two wrongs, there are many many wrongs that have lead to where we are.

Because of FDIC insurance, financial institutions have our government over a barrel. If AIG was just let to fold, tax dollars would be hit very very hard anyway.

The blame game sucks, but one thing there is no doubt about is AIG is not innocent. They are just another corporation taking advantage of a broken system. And Mocha Jesus or anybody else is not just going to be able to storm in and fix it. And continuing down this road of corruption certainly is not any change. I am so surprised.
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Old March 21st, 2009, 03:51 AM   #70
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Old March 21st, 2009, 10:07 AM   #71
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Pay the bonuses, fire the guys that allowed them in the "Dodd Amendment".
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Old March 21st, 2009, 10:28 AM   #72
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Pay the bonuses, fire the guys that allowed them in the "Dodd Amendment".

Does that mean we fire Frank, Dodd, and Obama first.....Ilike that idea...We could follow up with Stabenaw, Levin, Kennedy, and Pelosi.....Saweeet
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Old March 21st, 2009, 11:50 AM   #73
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Does that mean we fire Frank, Dodd, and Obama first.....Ilike that idea...We could follow up with Stabenaw, Levin, Kennedy, and Pelosi.....Saweeet
Now were talking!!!
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Old March 21st, 2009, 12:01 PM   #74
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I am honest and work hard. I show up every day and give 100%. For my hard work I have been rewarded with a $2.00 pay cut, complete loss of benefits, and my work week reduced to about 20 hours (or less).

Believe it or not, I'm thankful I still have a job.
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Old March 21st, 2009, 12:51 PM   #75
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Imagine if we pulled the stuff the gov't did how long we would have our jobs?
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Old March 21st, 2009, 04:24 PM   #76
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Me me me, and I don't care if the company makes money as long as I get mine.

Gee, I wonder why so many company's are failing in this country today.
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The company failed and they received 170 billion tax dollars to stay afloat. Enough said for me.
Shaker how do you get paid for the work that you do?

Do you know how many investors are paid? Do you realize that a lot of these kind of people work on whats called "commission"?

You know what that is right?

My compensation is based on what I "sell" I get a percentage of each and every sale I am responsible for generating. I am not paid based on how much money the company does, or does not make. I also don't get paid if i don't sell anything, even if the company posts billion dollar profits each week.

Now I am not speaking about AIG specifically, but you act like I shouldn't get paid if the company is not making a profit. But they don't offer me any more money when the company is posting record profits either.

It's not a me me me attitude, it's called life. Not everything business can be compared to a two man towing company based in a small town. Yes, if you work for a small business and the company is losing money it's pretty simple, there are only so many ways to cut costs, be it operating or overhead.

That doesn't compare to a huge company that runs insurance, investing, lending, borrowing, etc. divisions that have tons of administrative costs, salary costs, risks in business (insurance and investment risks)etc.

A company like AIG may have a ton of people who were owed bonuses who worked on 100% commission.....

If Harold offered you $20 for every call you went on, and then offered you a $100 bonus for every day you did 10 calls or more, wouldn't you expect that $100 bonus? What if he offered you a $10 bonus for every car you towed and were able to sell the person on a car wash in your car wash department. would you turn it down if the car wash department posted a loss?
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Old March 21st, 2009, 05:33 PM   #77
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Shaker how do you get paid for the work that you do?

Do you know how many investors are paid? Do you realize that a lot of these kind of people work on whats called "commission"?

You know what that is right?

My compensation is based on what I "sell" I get a percentage of each and every sale I am responsible for generating. I am not paid based on how much money the company does, or does not make. I also don't get paid if i don't sell anything, even if the company posts billion dollar profits each week.

Now I am not speaking about AIG specifically, but you act like I shouldn't get paid if the company is not making a profit. But they don't offer me any more money when the company is posting record profits either.

It's not a me me me attitude, it's called life. Not everything business can be compared to a two man towing company based in a small town. Yes, if you work for a small business and the company is losing money it's pretty simple, there are only so many ways to cut costs, be it operating or overhead.

That doesn't compare to a huge company that runs insurance, investing, lending, borrowing, etc. divisions that have tons of administrative costs, salary costs, risks in business (insurance and investment risks)etc.

A company like AIG may have a ton of people who were owed bonuses who worked on 100% commission.....

If Harold offered you $20 for every call you went on, and then offered you a $100 bonus for every day you did 10 calls or more, wouldn't you expect that $100 bonus? What if he offered you a $10 bonus for every car you towed and were able to sell the person on a car wash in your car wash department. would you turn it down if the car wash department posted a loss?

That is all fine and dandy, except AIG should have had to close the doors leaving all those people in the unemployment line. Obviously AIG has to much dead weight or they would not have needed tax money bail outs. If their system was working fine give the bonuses. But their system is broke, AIG needs to trim fat somewhere, or they will just need another bail out.


And if I could not afford to pay bonuses I promise because I was stupid enough to run my company into the ground, Uncle Sam is not going to show up and cover it for me. I would be out of business, and my employees would be unemployed with out bonuses or a pay check. Why does AIG employees still get their bonuses even though the company they work for went broke? Double standard in business, and it is bullshit. AIG employees should be happy just to have a job at this point, and expecting bonuses from a failed company is insane.
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Old March 21st, 2009, 07:46 PM   #78
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That is all fine and dandy, except AIG should have had to close the doors leaving all those people in the unemployment line. Obviously AIG has to much dead weight or they would not have needed tax money bail outs. If their system was working fine give the bonuses. But their system is broke, AIG needs to trim fat somewhere, or they will just need another bail out.


And if I could not afford to pay bonuses I promise because I was stupid enough to run my company into the ground, Uncle Sam is not going to show up and cover it for me. I would be out of business, and my employees would be unemployed with out bonuses or a pay check. Why does AIG employees still get their bonuses even though the company they work for went broke? Double standard in business, and it is bullshit. AIG employees should be happy just to have a job at this point, and expecting bonuses from a failed company is insane.
you don't seem to have an understanding of the financial system and why AIG is in trouble. It's not because it cost them too much money to make a widget because they are using two people to do one job.
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Old March 21st, 2009, 08:40 PM   #79
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That is all fine and dandy, except AIG should have had to close the doors leaving all those people in the unemployment line. Obviously AIG has to much dead weight or they would not have needed tax money bail outs. If their system was working fine give the bonuses. But their system is broke, AIG needs to trim fat somewhere, or they will just need another bail out.
Obviously, there is a reason why you are a tow truck driver and not working in a financial institution. You obviously have no understanding of the facts involved in this bonus situation. Maybe you should run for Congress. You will fit right in.
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Old March 21st, 2009, 08:42 PM   #80
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you don't seem to have an understanding of the financial system and why AIG is in trouble. It's not because it cost them too much money to make a widget because they are using two people to do one job.
We all can't be geniuses. But please explain how AIG and it's employees did nothing wrong, and how it was a conspiracy from our government that made AIG fail. And how it is just fine that Obama's administration gave out millions of dollars to AIG Knowing that bonuses would be paid with that money. Including high up executives within the company.


I am not a brilliant man in the ways of our financial system, but you don't have to be to see some shady shit going down here. And I know that the dollar I am out working for is being devalued at an alarming rate because of it.
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