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Old March 26th, 2006, 10:52 AM   #1
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Default Full size trucks, can anyone break into the market that the big three have?

Monkey's brand loyalty post got me thinking. The big three have a good hold on the medium duty (3/4, 1 ton) truck market. THere have been some tires for a forgein company to enter it, but do you think that they have a good chance? They seem to be doing okay on the 1/2 ton market, but a 1/2 ton is just an overgrown station wagon.

What are your thoughts?
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Old March 26th, 2006, 10:57 AM   #2
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Old March 26th, 2006, 10:59 AM   #3
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Toyota and Nissan both are aiming squarely at the 3/4 ton market.

Toyota is releasing new Tundras, which will feature an optional Diesel, in about a year.

Nissan's Titan is a real nice truck, just has a crappy rear axle(dana 44)... they also, though, are looking at the bigger market.


I predict in 5-6 years, both will be doing quite well...
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Old March 26th, 2006, 11:00 AM   #4
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maybe for yuppies who just want the biggest truck or something but for someone who uses it for towing and work i doubt it.


I have never seen a nissan titan or toyota tundra at a job site but always see 1/2ton trucks from dodge, GM, and ford. if they cant break into this section of the 1/2ton market I doubt they will break into the 3/4ton and 1ton market at least for people who use the trucks for working not to be king of the road. Alot of people who buy 3/4ton and 1 ton trucks just stick with the same brand of truck for a long ass time or life so it would be hard for someone to buy a truck that is not time tested where the other three are sort of. Just my 2 cents
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Old March 26th, 2006, 11:13 AM   #5
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In general, if you think that Toyota ISN'T going to gain a lot of market share, then you might be a good candidate for management at GM or Ford..


They always built decent cars.... about 6-7 years ago, the Japanese decided to attack the Minivan market, which they now have obliterated the GM and Ford minivans, both losing HUGE (like 200,000 a year each, representing about 60% of their sales) market share.

I can say from working with Toyota a lot recently, they have very high ambitions with the full size / HD truck market.

Honda isn't going into that, though from what I've seen. Mistubishi is dead-man-walking. Isuzu as well.

Nissan has done well, the 5.6 liter is a brute of an engine, again, if they had a Dana 60 out back, they'd be set. Still, its a very well received truck for just a few years in the full size market.
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Old March 26th, 2006, 11:15 AM   #6
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anyone who says it will never happen is a fool. It's that complacent attitude thats gotten the "big 3" into the trouble they're in.
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Old March 26th, 2006, 11:35 AM   #7
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When they go for it they'll do well.

They already have a huge market of baby boomers who think anything Toyota, Honda, or Nissan makes is golden. The press agrees (Honda Ridgeline "truck" of the year???).

That Nissan Titan is a pretty nice package, with a lot of thought invested in it (factory sprayed-on bedliner, available rear e-locker, cargo tie-down system). I think the styling is, well, UGLY - even worse than the S-10 replacement (Canyon?) but that's subjective. I noticed they place the power window / lock / mirror controls on a flat surface that forms the side window ledge (can you say water damage?) but that's the only miscue I've seen. The Toyota keeps coming off as a midsize, but they're gonna get that right soon I expect.

I see cities are buying Toyotas (Tacomas?) as municipal vehicles (i.e. San Francisco) which the Big 3 should interpret as a serious challenge on their turf.

I fully expect to see the mainstream vehicle market in the U.S. ceded to asian imports within 10 years. The serial missteps by the big 3, combined with outdated labor agreements and (more importantly) a culture that favors imported vehicles (prevalent everywhere but SE MI) spells the end. Young people don't see any of the Big 3's products as a real option. The brand names will still exist, but as specialty / niche products (i.e. Jeep).

The mainstream media response to the GM exec's criticism of Consumer Reports the other week is pretty telling. I saw three reports (Fox News, Geraldo Rivera, and MSNBC) where the situation was reported with a "look at what they're doing now" tone. Geraldo (an assbag, but one with media reach) scolded the big 3 for poorly designed, poorly built products (referring to the Chev Equinox as "dreadful" and Pontiac G6 as "laughable".
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Old March 26th, 2006, 11:35 AM   #8
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im sure it will happen but, i believe it will happen very slowly.
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Old March 26th, 2006, 11:54 AM   #9
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3/4 and 1 ton are light duty trucks, not Med. duty. That would be a Chevy 4500, 5500, 6500 or a Ford F-450 or f-550 or an E series.
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Old March 26th, 2006, 11:58 AM   #10
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when toyota brings the HINO diesel over we will all be screwed
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Old March 26th, 2006, 12:19 PM   #11
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When the Japanese began sending cars over here in the late 60's and 70's the only thing they had were econoboxes. Now they sell luxury cars, minivans, SUVs, and light duty trucks, in addition to econoboxes. If you think the Japanese will not take a chunk out of the domestic medium duty truck market you are a fool with no sense of recent automotive history.

Whether or not the Japanese gaining a foothold in the medium duty truck market is a good thing or not is another post for another day.
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Old March 26th, 2006, 01:25 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brewmenn
anyone who says it will never happen is a fool. It's that complacent attitude thats gotten the "big 3" into the trouble they're in.

Boy I agree with this!!!!!! Just watch and see.
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Old March 26th, 2006, 02:12 PM   #13
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the real question is not if but when. Also look at the strides Hyundai has made since the mid 90s. They went from crap to contender in a few years. I dont know if they have plans yet, but it makes sense to not ignore the truck market.

Same with the soon to be here Chinese cars (i think cherry is comming next year for less than 10,000) how long untill we have 1 tons from china. My bet is less than 10 years.

In my nd its a forgone conclusion that Toyota will be amajor contender in all segments they compete in.

Lastly about the not seeing nissans and toyotas at work site etc? I havent traveled to new construction sites outside of michigan but i dont think you will have a problem finding toyotas and nissans at contruction sites in much of the country.

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Old March 26th, 2006, 02:14 PM   #14
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Domestic manufacturers are screwed. They can definately compete in quality, but from the business aspect, they can't. Imports are killing us when they can pay workers almost next to nothing compared to the Big Three. Those new Chinese Chery cars are going to go for around $4K new.
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Old March 26th, 2006, 03:24 PM   #15
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Toyota has had the #1 selling compact truck here in america for how many years? like 17-18....I think they can take the full size HD market also with the right styling and motor.
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Old March 26th, 2006, 03:51 PM   #16
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it will happen very soon, and all the close minded people in the midwest will be the last to see it. Having no lived on both coasts for sevreal years I can say imports are where it is at. There is already a very silent but growing buzz about yota bringing over its Hino I-6's in the next year or three. I work on these blocks now in the marine industry and know how bullet proff they are, if anyone has ever heard of Yanmar engines they are basically yota engines marenized. I rarely have issues with them and they turn out 500hp+ , they are lighter then cats and no were near the headaches... Give nissan a year or three as well and they will have a very nice 3/4 ton i am sure
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Old March 26th, 2006, 05:46 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brewmenn
anyone who says it will never happen is a fool. It's that complacent attitude thats gotten the "big 3" into the trouble they're in.
AMEN
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Old March 26th, 2006, 06:18 PM   #18
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this is slightly off topic, but the reason the foriegn automakers can afford to make cars so much cheaper (of the many reasons) is they dont have the retirees to support, dont hardly pay their workers squat, and are smaller more efficient companies and dont have the quality of life that we enjoy here. Not to mention that, as much as I hate to say it, there are a lot of lazy non-productive shmucks working for the big 3 and their supplyers. In my [possibly warped] mind its always easier to play follow the leader and mimic the innovators for years before finally beating them at their own game- whether in the automotive market or anything in life. The us automakers have always been the innovators when it comes to styling and safety. This is even apparent within the big 3. Take dodge for example. To me, they have always been the most innovative and creative and cutting edge, but at the same time that requires the most testing and research. The end result is that since they also are the quickest from drawing board to market, a lot of their good ideas dont work out so well since they are less researched and ultimately have the lowest build quality. GM sued (or was going to sue) Cherry for one of the little cars it was going to make because it was so close to a car gm is currently making. This was a while ago, so I dont remember if gm actually sued, or what car it was. I was given an 87 honda accord a while back and it had a freakin carburetor on it! Most us cars started getting fuel injection in about 84. Personally I dont care HOW good a honda is or any other foreign car , Ill never buy one. My money is on the US automakers until the bitter end, and if they go under, Ill keep buying and fixing the old US cars.
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Old March 26th, 2006, 06:43 PM   #19
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spoken like a true dieing last of the breed right there.. chrysler hasnt had to many failures as far as build quiality and lack of research. Actully they are able to take a design ont he show circuit get postive feedback and make the car in 36 months or less were as GM will show you it get good reveiws and build it showing up to the market 4-5 years later missing the target totally. I would take chrysler quality over GMs every day of the week as well
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