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Old May 29th, 2007, 01:39 PM   #1
cwy426
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http://www.oceanaheraldjournal.com/n...story_id=25000

The above will link to a story in a local newspaper that some will get a kick out of - those that are familiar with Jack Warfield/Sandy Korners
(aka Jackass). My understanding is, he is the one that put up all the fuss about strap towing, etc., causing the enforcement of the towing laws in Silver Lake. He did this because of the rules the DNR have regarding operating a business on the dunes, which he did not want to comply with.

Now, I have no problem with "promoting reginal tourism", however, I have a feeling it has more to do with promoting Sandy Korners. What was he hoping to accomplish by forcing the towing laws - I have seen some posts on this site by people saying they will no longer go to Siler Lake. Of course he could care less - those towing their own stuff weren't putting anything in his pocket.

The hard copy of the paper had pictures - one showing one of his jeeps going through a muddy section of whatever two-track they were on. Made me think of some of the discussions on what is legal to drive through and what is not....Maybe the DNR needs to read the paper?
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Old May 29th, 2007, 06:40 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwy426 View Post
http://www.oceanaheraldjournal.com/n...story_id=25000

The above will link to a story in a local newspaper that some will get a kick out of - those that are familiar with Jack Warfield/Sandy Korners
(aka Jackass). My understanding is, he is the one that put up all the fuss about strap towing, etc., causing the enforcement of the towing laws in Silver Lake. He did this because of the rules the DNR have regarding operating a business on the dunes, which he did not want to comply with.
Could you elaborate please?

Quote:
Now, I have no problem with "promoting reginal tourism", however, I have a feeling it has more to do with promoting Sandy Korners. What was he hoping to accomplish by forcing the towing laws -
From the information I've been able to obtain, Jack was only advising the users of Silver Lake of the impending enforcement the DNR(Edit) County Sheriff was going to start doing this year.
If need be I'll call Pete L. up and get the real scoop. Pete's always been straight with us on enforcement issues.

Quote:
I have seen some posts on this site by people saying they will no longer go to Siler Lake. Of course he could care less - those towing their own stuff weren't putting anything in his pocket.

The hard copy of the paper had pictures - one showing one of his jeeps going through a muddy section of whatever two-track they were on. Made me think of some of the discussions on what is legal to drive through and what is not....Maybe the DNR needs to read the paper?
If I'm not mistaken, the article said the tour went through the National Forest. The USFS has different rules then the DNR does for travel which was discussed at length on this site. Just one more complexity for us to understand
Jim-kb8ymf

Last edited by kb8ymf; May 29th, 2007 at 08:05 PM.
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Old May 29th, 2007, 07:56 PM   #3
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I would let Trail Fanatic discuss this. He has talked with Pete and also Jack. This topic was discussed in detail some time back.

The DNR is not enforcing anything! It is the county sheriff.
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Old May 29th, 2007, 09:29 PM   #4
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I was on that trail ride (with others) representing GLFWDA.
Everything was done on Seasonal Roads - legally.
No erosive spinning, just creeping through deep puddles in the road.
No wetland plants anywhere to be seen.
The pictures in my local paper (The Muskegon Comical) weren't even of the right ride.
It showed red Jeeps, Jack has Silver ones now to celebrate his 25th year of business.

Jack probably does have a "new" interest in promoting and protecting trail riding, now that it's his business. I don't see anything wrong with that. Every business has to focus on it's bread and butter. If he's now involved with the trails, we should figure out ways to utilize each other to improve off-road opportunities.

On Towing:

I asked Jack what the story is.
It is, of course, nothing like the rumors.

His side of the story:
The local police were setting up 'stings' for illegal towing.
Unfortunately, where they kept setting up, they would end up with the vehicles pulled over in Jack's parking lot.
There wasn't any rhyme or reason to the enforcement days. It seemed to be random.

After another day of watching enthusiasts get tickets for something they didn't even know was illegal, INCLUDING a family on vacation, he'd had enough of it turning off new enthusiasts to the hobby.

He started to complain about the sporadic enforcement of a law no one seemed to know about.
This has resulted in the generation of the Notice by the State Police (below), AND a 'warning' period that would be granted to get the word out.

The Police were starting enforcement on their own, Jack just complained that it was unfair because of the 'randomness' of the enforcement effort and the obscurity of the law.

HIS efforts stopped the random stings and brought uniformity to the enforcement.

No more surprises are a good thing in my book.


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Old May 30th, 2007, 06:42 AM   #5
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I apologize - I know nothing first hand. All I know is that there are/were many business owners upset with Mr. Warfield regarding his alleged complaints of illegal vehicle towing - some of it done by other business owners with rentals.

Could you elaborate please?
http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7...3784--,00.html

The DNR is not enforcing anything! It is the county sheriff.
I did not say they were.

Trail Fanatic:
Neither do I see anything wrong with promoting his business. And promoting offroading is a good thing, also. However, I am going to hold off on accepting the "His side of the story" as the truth. There were some really PO'ed people around here when this stuff was going on, but once again, I cannot say all said by them is gospel, either.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 07:40 AM   #6
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. . . and I can't say Jack's version is accurate either, just that it's his version.

Every story has more than one side.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 09:24 AM   #7
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All I keep seeing is "towing a vehicle TO the dunes"

my question has yet to be answered.........if you legally drive to the dunes, and have no voucher and get in line behind someone with a voucher...can they pull you in, last year someone with a voucher could pull you in AFTER YOUR WERE ALREADY IN LINE.......is this still allowed?

I dont care about being pulled to the dunes, I can drive there, but if I cant make it to get a voucher on a big weekend, can I be pulled in?

The way it reads, it only applies to towing someone down the road from a campground or some other location a ways away.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 10:37 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gotsand? View Post
All I keep seeing is "towing a vehicle TO the dunes"

my question has yet to be answered.........if you legally drive to the dunes, and have no voucher and get in line behind someone with a voucher...can they pull you in, last year someone with a voucher could pull you in AFTER YOUR WERE ALREADY IN LINE.......is this still allowed?

I dont care about being pulled to the dunes, I can drive there, but if I cant make it to get a voucher on a big weekend, can I be pulled in?

The way it reads, it only applies to towing someone down the road from a campground or some other location a ways away.
Yes, if it is properly equipped with a tow bar, and lights.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 12:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gotsand? View Post
All I keep seeing is "towing a vehicle TO the dunes"

my question has yet to be answered.........if you legally drive to the dunes, and have no voucher and get in line behind someone with a voucher...can they pull you in, last year someone with a voucher could pull you in AFTER YOUR WERE ALREADY IN LINE.......is this still allowed?

I dont care about being pulled to the dunes, I can drive there, but if I cant make it to get a voucher on a big weekend, can I be pulled in?

The way it reads, it only applies to towing someone down the road from a campground or some other location a ways away.
Your question really does not have anything to do with the towing laws directly. The voucher system is for dune entry, either parking lot or dune ready. The towing law has nothing to do with the voucher system, and if your on a public road getting towed (which waiting in line takes place on a public road) then refer to CC's comment above.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 12:44 PM   #10
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I perfectly understand the towing laws...and I am not arguing with them. but waiting in line on the side of the road hardly constitutes being pulled down the road like you would see the people pulling quads from the state park campground.

I am talking about being a street legal machine, driving there, getting in line, waiting and then merely feet before the first check point hooking up a tow strap so that only 1 voucher is needed for 2 seperate vehicles. this was allowed last year, and I am just wondering if we can do it this year.

guess I will just have to go out there and talk to the dnr or sherrifs office directly......
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Old May 30th, 2007, 01:11 PM   #11
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I am talking about being a street legal machine, driving there, getting in line, waiting and then merely feet before the first check point hooking up a tow strap so that only 1 voucher is needed for 2 seperate vehicles. this was allowed last year, and I am just wondering if we can do it this year.
.
Yes, if it is properly equipped with a tow bar, and lights.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 01:14 PM   #12
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I don't see what the big deal is. There are way more than enough dune ready vouchers. Why do you need to piggyback off of anyone else's if you are already street legal?
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Old May 30th, 2007, 01:38 PM   #13
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I don't see what the big deal is. There are way more than enough dune ready vouchers. Why do you need to piggyback off of anyone else's if you are already street legal?
because it is sooooooooooooooo much work to ask for two vouchers instead of one.

:tonka:
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Old May 30th, 2007, 01:49 PM   #14
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ahhhh........... stupid me.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 02:06 PM   #15
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no, if you cant make it out there at noon on a friday before a big weekend and they are all handed out......and yes it has happened numerous times.

then you have to wait until 7pm when it is open time in order to get on.

I am not being an ass, I was merely asking a little more of a specific question than what the "law" stated.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 02:12 PM   #16
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..........understand also, that if you break while on the dunes, and you need to be towed back to your camp site.......you are screwed as well.

(I don't know how important this is anyway, I saw several quads and trucks being towed in by straps this past weekend, right in front of the Sheriff, with no intervention.

There is a lot more to the story of Sandy Korners, and others...................a lot that is not out yet, but will be.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 02:27 PM   #17
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FORD FLARESIDE;568703
There is a lot more to the story of Sandy Korners, and others...................a lot that is not out yet, but will be.
Sounds like you know a lot more than your telling.............so please tell.
Or do we have to beg?????
Al these inuendo's and 2nd, 3rd, and 4th hand stories have been going around for months.
jim-kb8ymf

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Old May 30th, 2007, 03:39 PM   #18
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I visit the dunes at least 5 times per year. NEVER have I had a problem getting a dune ready voucher. I have not always been able to get the 9-11 voucher but I am always in by 11:30.

They hand out 250 dune ready vouchers every 2 hours. That's a vehicle into the dunes every 30 seconds. Never is the line backed up that bad other than holiday weekends.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 04:45 PM   #19
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I've went to get dune vouchers twice, and both times I just asked for 4 of them, and I was promptly handed four of them, all nice and stamped.
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Old May 30th, 2007, 07:01 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by kb8ymf View Post
Sounds like you know a lot more than your telling.............so please tell.
Or do we have to beg?????
Al these inuendo's and 2nd, 3rd, and 4th hand stories have been going around for months.
jim-kb8ymf
I do..........and I promise to tell in due time, all I ask is that you keep your ears open, and Respect the Dunes this year.
Lets just say Big Brother is watching what we do out there.
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