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Old December 4th, 2013, 06:15 PM   #21
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fence the problem in and ship it off to canada, or just fence it in and leave it.
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Old December 4th, 2013, 06:45 PM   #22
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This is only a problem that is on a much larger scale and it is our nation as a whole. A city 18 billion in debt and a nation 17 trillion in debt. This is only something we are going to see more of.
What happens when we go bankrupt as a country?
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Old December 4th, 2013, 06:54 PM   #23
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This is only a problem that is on a much larger scale and it is our nation as a whole. A city 18 billion in debt and a nation 17 trillion in debt. This is only something we are going to see more of.
What happens when we go bankrupt as a country?
Revolution hopefully.
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Old December 5th, 2013, 10:28 AM   #24
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Unfortunately the average Joe's pension will probably be cut, but that is not the core issue that contributed to this disaster. It was the crooks who were in city office jobs collecting crazy pensions for little work that should be penalized.
I wonder how many of those losing their pensions have helped vote in these crooks decade after decade after decade...

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Although I feel bad for those who worked hard for their pensions, I feel they are partially to blame. Demanding huge union contracts for years and years that are unsustainable is part of the problem.

Years ago when our company was struggling, all the employees took a 10% pay cut. This year our profits were off and I took a huge hit on my year end bonus. But for a union worker, when that happens, they scream "foul" and strike to get more. Look at all the large companies that have filed bankruptcy for this same reason. Why would a large city be any different.

Sometimes, what goes around.... comes around.
As much as I hate the union and the mentality it spawns you can't fault the union or its workers for everything. There have been people pretty high up the management ladder getting hefty pay outs even when times were not good at most of those unionized companies.

Times were ridiculously good for a long time and the companies could piss away money on salary, bonuses, new equipment, etc... and give no cares. Then the well dried up and they want to cut Mr. Union's pay, but Mr. Union still sees Joe CEO getting his multi-million dollar bonuses. I can understand why Mr. Union would get a little upset. I think its human nature to always want more, and also be jealous and resentful of those getting more than you.

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I just heard Kevin Orr (sp?) on the radio. He said the debt is $18 billion and they only have $1 billion. He was explaining that hey, we can cut a third of it out and we still only have 1/12 th of what we owe. He said there had never been any money set aside for the $5.7 billion they owe for health obligations. He said I have no idea why, but there was never money saved for anything.

Bottom line they are broke and there is no sugar coating it.
Given the nature of the people in this country and the neglect you see driving around in Detroit this honestly doesn't surprise me. I think it should, but it doesn't. Our country has a debt level it will never pay back, social programs are funded with money from tax payers that haven't even been born yet, and most Americans are barely living pay check to pay check with no savings and endless debt.

ugh
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Old December 5th, 2013, 11:05 AM   #25
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As much as I hate the union and the mentality it spawns you can't fault the union or its workers for everything. There have been people pretty high up the management ladder getting hefty pay outs even when times were not good at most of those unionized companies.

Times were ridiculously good for a long time and the companies could piss away money on salary, bonuses, new equipment, etc... and give no cares. Then the well dried up and they want to cut Mr. Union's pay, but Mr. Union still sees Joe CEO getting his multi-million dollar bonuses. I can understand why Mr. Union would get a little upset. I think its human nature to always want more, and also be jealous and resentful of those getting more than you.

(
True, the corruption is top to bottom. I just feel that the top is getting all the blame and the "poor workers" get the sympathy. Then look at how long ago Dave Bing was trying to change things and got nothing but resistance.
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Old December 5th, 2013, 11:24 AM   #26
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Then look at how long ago Dave Bing was trying to change things and got nothing but resistance.
Because they do not want to change, they do not want to work for it, they do not want it unless they can get it through their entitlement ways. Fence it in, send it off.

There is no hope for those type of people. None.
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Old December 5th, 2013, 11:48 AM   #27
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is it too late to burn it all down and start over?
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Old December 5th, 2013, 12:18 PM   #28
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No no no, we've covered this before...a fence won't hold the water in while we flood it. It's gotta be a wall!
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Old December 5th, 2013, 03:41 PM   #29
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Because they do not want to change, they do not want to work for it, they do not want it unless they can get it through their entitlement ways. Fence it in, send it off.

There is no hope for those type of people. None.
Americans?
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Old December 5th, 2013, 08:17 PM   #30
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Fast food workers want $15 an hour....that's more than a police or firefights makes starting out.
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Old December 5th, 2013, 08:28 PM   #31
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Fast food workers want $15 an hour....that's more than a police or firefights makes starting out.
Funniest cap I've ever heard. Get a job, sparkling wiggles!
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Old December 5th, 2013, 08:34 PM   #32
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Americans?
Detroitians
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Old December 5th, 2013, 09:25 PM   #33
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Prepare for the fall.
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Old December 6th, 2013, 08:47 AM   #34
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It's already winter.
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Old December 6th, 2013, 08:58 AM   #35
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Fast food workers want $15 an hour....that's more than a police or firefights makes starting out.
when the minimum wage goes up, wonder how many fast-food franchises will close the lobby and staff only the drive-thru
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Old December 6th, 2013, 09:00 AM   #36
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the prez would say; "if i had a city it would look like detroit"
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Old December 6th, 2013, 09:05 AM   #37
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Revolution hopefully.
hard to imagine this idea keeps popping up in my lifetime!!
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Old December 6th, 2013, 09:11 AM   #38
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So the bankruptcy was allowed to go through (as of now). It seems that billions in pensions can now be on the chopping block. <==don't worry. Prez will step in and guarantee the pension payments [using our $$] For arguments sake, let's say after the dust settles pensions payments are cut in half. How many more people will be trying to find work? <==folks are going to wait until the minimum wage goes up to $15.00. nothing works like aimming high!!
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Old December 7th, 2013, 06:04 AM   #39
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Let's raise minimum wage to $15/hr, then listen to them wail because they still can't afford to live because prices were raised to cover the increase.
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Old December 7th, 2013, 08:08 AM   #40
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Where was the outrage when Obie wiped out salaried GM pensions and negated bond contractual terms - specifically to pay off the UAW - with the stroke of an executive order pen?
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