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Old November 1st, 2013, 07:08 AM   #1
kickstand
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Default NYPD Cheif turned inmate - says prison system is borked...thoughts?

I watched a few minutes of this interview on the Today show this morning.

http://www.today.com/news/nypd-chief...ken-8C11509923

Get's jailed for tax evasion, comes out of his 3 year sentence and says system is broken and does not rehabilitate and penalties for many are too stiff.....
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Old November 1st, 2013, 08:26 AM   #2
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My thought is-

This is a surprise?
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Old November 1st, 2013, 08:35 AM   #3
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Prisons are for punishment, not rehabilitation, duh.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 08:51 AM   #4
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Prisons are for punishment, not rehabilitation, duh.
I only agree with this partially. If you have a useless, uneducated POS go to prison for a first time offense, which would mean only a few years and don't teach him how to live in society (because his parents didn't) you can expect him to return to prison soon. If they are going to be there, make them learn something.

How? I don't have a clue.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 09:15 AM   #5
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Prisons are for punishment, not rehabilitation, duh.
agree.....yet there are those who push for inmate "rights".
they should get 3 squares, be free from fear of other inmates, otherwise if you can't do the time don't do the crime.
i do feel for those for whom it takes decades and new technology to proof wrongful inprisonment. yet for the cronic criminal there should be no mercy. sometimes, a life sentence is a benefit to society just don't give them each a tv and armchair and access to legal counsel that we all pay for.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 09:30 AM   #6
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Prisons are for punishment, not rehabilitation, duh.
This I agree with.

I don't agree with what this guy had to say.

Where I see the problem is with the double jeopardy that convicted Felons face when they get out of prison and a background check causes them to be ineligible for gainful employment. They have served their punishment by spending their time in Jail, how do they become a contributing member of society once they are out of jail/prison if they can't find a job?
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Old November 1st, 2013, 09:36 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by kickstand View Post
This I agree with.

I don't agree with what this guy had to say.

Where I see the problem is with the double jeopardy that convicted Felons face when they get out of prison and a background check causes them to be ineligible for gainful employment. They have served their punishment by spending their time in Jail, how do they become a contributing member of society once they are out of jail/prison if they can't find a job?
That seems like a hard thing to deal with.

Who wants a convicted felon working for them? Would you want the convicted thief guy coming into your house to do work?

But on the other hand if they don't get some sort of gainful employment they will go straight back to crime even if they did learn a lesson. Self preservation is greater than all...
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Old November 1st, 2013, 10:02 AM   #8
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That seems like a hard thing to deal with.

Who wants a convicted felon working for them? Would you want the convicted thief guy coming into your house to do work?

But on the other hand if they don't get some sort of gainful employment they will go straight back to crime even if they did learn a lesson. Self preservation is greater than all...
Very hard.

I don't want a their working in my house, but if he can't prove he learned his lesson by getting ajob and working he'll be forced to go right back to stealing to put food on the table no?

This is how we breed career criminals.

On the other hand, I'd be more willing to work with a theif than a rapist. It's definitely a touchy subject.

Are they unchangeable, or can we help them change by changing our perception of them after they have served their time?
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Old November 2nd, 2013, 12:08 AM   #9
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For some reason my boss hires quite a few ex-cons and NO I'm not one of them. Most I think are from drug charges but we've had a myriad of people through the shop. The guys who've been up on drug charges seem to usually do good for a while but eventually slip back to getting high at some point. Occasionally they can catch it before they end up back in jail, sometimes they don't.
There are some who desperately want to get back to "life" and are willing to bust ass to get there and are appreciative to have a chance.
What is sad is the ones who relapse when they've got a family depending on them for support.
This is a small shop with around 25-30 on the payroll. I cannot begin to remember the number or even the names of all the people I've seen roll through. It's probably close to 200 in the 16 years I've been there. I can recall that two are now dead (been shot), one is in prison for murder and drugs, and another who I'm sure will come back to work soon is almost due out from DUI.
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Old November 2nd, 2013, 05:59 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
I only agree with this partially. If you have a useless, uneducated POS go to prison for a first time offense, which would mean only a few years and don't teach him how to live in society (because his parents didn't) you can expect him to return to prison soon. If they are going to be there, make them learn something.

How? I don't have a clue.
X2.

I just finished reading Orange is the New Black and it touches on this a lot. If you don't prepare the cons for life on the outside then you'll be seeing them back inside soon enough.
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Old November 2nd, 2013, 07:04 AM   #11
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X2.

I just finished reading Orange is the New Black and it touches on this a lot. If you don't prepare the cons for life on the outside then you'll be seeing them back inside soon enough.
So you base your knowledge if the penal system on a fictional tv show?
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Old November 2nd, 2013, 07:44 AM   #12
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So you base your knowledge if the penal system on a fictional tv show?
He read the book. Not watched the show. You said penal.
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Old November 2nd, 2013, 07:49 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by welderboyjk View Post
For some reason my boss hires quite a few ex-cons and NO I'm not one of them. Most I think are from drug charges but we've had a myriad of people through the shop. The guys who've been up on drug charges seem to usually do good for a while but eventually slip back to getting high at some point. Occasionally they can catch it before they end up back in jail, sometimes they don't.
There are some who desperately want to get back to "life" and are willing to bust ass to get there and are appreciative to have a chance.
What is sad is the ones who relapse when they've got a family depending on them for support.
This is a small shop with around 25-30 on the payroll. I cannot begin to remember the number or even the names of all the people I've seen roll through. It's probably close to 200 in the 16 years I've been there. I can recall that two are now dead (been shot), one is in prison for murder and drugs, and another who I'm sure will come back to work soon is almost due out from DUI.
Maybe your boss has a bit of an unsavory past, or has someone close to him that does, so he can relate to the problems these people face when they get out and wants to try to help.
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Old November 2nd, 2013, 12:09 PM   #14
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Education should be the only "right" they have. I say that because someone willing to learn should have a chance. The problem is prison in the US isn't all that bad in most cases. It should be punishment not vacation. Outside of bring inhumane I feel they get nothing but a cell.
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Old November 2nd, 2013, 01:09 PM   #15
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So you base your knowledge if the penal system on a fictional tv show?
Reading, it's FUNdamental.

It's actually a true story and she had data to back up some of the points. Plus it just seems like common sense If you educate someone who's worthless, maybe they will use those skills to be a normal contributing member of society instead of being released as a know-nothing who just goes back to a life of crime.
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Old November 2nd, 2013, 02:59 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by kickstand View Post
This I agree with.

I don't agree with what this guy had to say.

Where I see the problem is with the double jeopardy that convicted Felons face when they get out of prison and a background check causes them to be ineligible for gainful employment. They have served their punishment by spending their time in Jail, how do they become a contributing member of society once they are out of jail/prison if they can't find a job?
Yes that is a problem.

We may be thinking about the same person. Was contract where I'm at, quit, tried to come back later and go direct but couldn't because of a felony conviction.
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Old November 2nd, 2013, 03:58 PM   #17
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Yes that is a problem.

We may be thinking about the same person. Was contract where I'm at, quit, tried to come back later and go direct but couldn't because of a felony conviction.
Not knowing this situation just in general. I don't have any sympathy for felons, a felony isn't an accident.
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Old November 3rd, 2013, 03:54 AM   #18
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Not knowing this situation just in general. I don't have any sympathy for felons, a felony isn't an accident.
This is not always true. For example, if you are ticketed for shooting a federally protected bird (think duck hunting) you will have a felony on your record. Not all protected birds are rare, or endangered either.
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Old November 3rd, 2013, 08:51 AM   #19
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Perhaps your boss gets a tax credit or a portion of the ex-inmates pay paid for by the state. That program is ran a lot in this state. As for felonies just happening by accident, I can assure they do. Imagine going to the bar with a few guys to watch the football game today. You meet a few ladies while you're there. You leave to go home and have a buddy with you. A month later you wake up to realize you were in a coma, buddy dead as you hit someone head on. You were not drunk but don't remember leaving, labs suggest someone someone slipped you a Mickey at the bar, your BAL was under .08 and your debit reciept says the same with the anount of drinks purchased. You are now serving a 8-15 year sentence for killing your friend

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Old November 3rd, 2013, 12:28 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by mikesova View Post
Reading, it's FUNdamental.

It's actually a true story and she had data to back up some of the points. Plus it just seems like common sense If you educate someone who's worthless, maybe they will use those skills to be a normal contributing member of society instead of being released as a know-nothing who just goes back to a life of crime.
It's fiction, and I don't buy it
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