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Old October 22nd, 2013, 12:32 PM   #21
974x4Taco
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Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
I'm running 12" air shocks front and rear. I don't know that I have been limited very much and I don't need tons of up travel for high speed stuff. I'm set up for 4" up travel & 8" down travel. I bump it up to about 5" up travel for the dunes.
I disagree with the notion that up travel is only useful for high speed stuff. Up travel can help just as much while crawling....for example: say your lf tire is climbing a big rock....if you are running limited up travel (2-3" lets say) there is a good chance you end up on your bump stop...at that point if your tire climbs any more you are pushing against a fixed point and essentially lifting on that corner which will decrease stability and lighten the weight on the lr which will decrease traction. On the flip side, if you are running a good amount of up travel (lets say 6" or so) there is a good chance the lf corner now just absorbs that rock and you never get that lifting effect.

That's how i see it, i may be dead wrong

I for sure know this....i went from 3" up travel to 6" up travel and the difference in the stability of my rig and the way it performs at any speed is mind blowing
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Old October 22nd, 2013, 01:01 PM   #22
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I don't think I said that up travel is only good for high speed. For discussion, I have found that much more than 4-4.5" of up travel on my 12" shocks gives me a higher center of gravity and I am more tippy in general. Yes, once your up travel is maxed out, the entire frame/body has to start to roll but for me, it seems that with the stability of the rear axle and the droop of the opposite side front, I don't get as much body roll as if the whole thing is sitting higher. It also seems that for air shocks, the preferred exposed shock is about 30% of overall travel. So, the longer the shock, the more up travel you will get.
After wheeling with this setup with other rigs of varying suspensions up to 16" shocks, I don't think any other full bodied rig with longer shocks has gone more places. Maybe because we are not pushing ourselves to the extreme limit???

Note, comparing ratios of your 16" shocks to my 12" shocks, my preferred height is 4-4.5" or, 30-37.5%. 37.5% of 16" = 6". (same ratio) Now bump yours up to 8" and see how it feels.
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Old October 22nd, 2013, 01:20 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
I don't think I said that up travel is only good for high speed. For discussion, I have found that much more than 4-4.5" of up travel on my 12" shocks gives me a higher center of gravity and I am more tippy in general. Yes, once your up travel is maxed out, the entire frame/body has to start to roll but for me, it seems that with the stability of the rear axle and the droop of the opposite side front, I don't get as much body roll as if the whole thing is sitting higher. It also seems that for air shocks, the preferred exposed shock is about 30% of overall travel. So, the longer the shock, the more up travel you will get.
After wheeling with this setup with other rigs of varying suspensions up to 16" shocks, I don't think any other full bodied rig with longer shocks has gone more places. Maybe because we are not pushing ourselves to the extreme limit???

Note, comparing ratios of your 16" shocks to my 12" shocks, my preferred height is 4-4.5" or, 30-37.5%. 37.5% of 16" = 6". (same ratio) Now bump yours up to 8" and see how it feels.

I mis worded that....i didn't intend it to come off that you said it was only good for high speed.

I agree with what you said here....when i rebuilt my rig i shot for the same ride height as i previously had since it worked well for me....i also decided on 6/10 split based on reading i had done....i built around these two parameters the adjusted spring rates last till i got just like i wanted. Like i previously stated the only reason i have 16's is because i got a smoking deal.

As far as going to even more up travel....i would actually like to do that....i hsve more droop than i truly need imo and would like to instead use it as compression....however, with my current setup i would run into the same issue as you....i would have to lift the truck 2" in order to get 2" more up travel do to oil pan clearance which i don't feel would be a worthwhile tradeoff...i am hoping that once i get a engine swap done i can somehow move things around enough to keep my same height and gain the 2" i want.
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Old October 22nd, 2013, 01:40 PM   #24
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I went 14 front 16 rear on my buggy. Wishing now I was 16 front 18 rear.

I went with oris.

While yes they are expensive at initial purchase. Add up what they offer.

Ori is basically your air shock with a built in sway bar effect and your limit strap and bump stop. This means you do not need to package or purchase either sway bars, bumps, limit straps. Now add up coilovers,springs, bumps, limits......ori isn't that expensive.

But ori won't offer you any benefits if you want to go Baja style at speed over a good coil over setup.. But IMO only they trump air shocks and coilovers for trail riding hands down. And the fact I didn't have to purchase and package all those extra parts was worth it to me.
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Old October 22nd, 2013, 02:09 PM   #25
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My buddy has ori's on all 4 corners of his S10....they are sweet for sure and i agee about only have to buy/package 1 thing.

That being said, i not seen the stability out of them that everyone raves about....imo and his too his rig still needs a sway bar or 2. Undoubtedly some of that is because his rig is tallish and heavy but still imo they were are a little dissappointing in that aspect
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Old October 22nd, 2013, 02:17 PM   #26
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That's where the tuning comes in. And how they are set up. When I first set mine up it was the opposite. I had to much sway bar effect. I had almost no body roll.
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Old October 22nd, 2013, 03:28 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CheapThrillB2 View Post
I went 14 front 16 rear on my buggy. Wishing now I was 16 front 18 rear.

I went with oris.

While yes they are expensive at initial purchase. Add up what they offer.

Ori is basically your air shock with a built in sway bar effect and your limit strap and bump stop. This means you do not need to package or purchase either sway bars, bumps, limit straps. Now add up coilovers,springs, bumps, limits......ori isn't that expensive.

But ori won't offer you any benefits if you want to go Baja style at speed over a good coil over setup.. But IMO only they trump air shocks and coilovers for trail riding hands down. And the fact I didn't have to purchase and package all those extra parts was worth it to me.
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Originally Posted by CheapThrillB2 View Post
That's where the tuning comes in. And how they are set up. When I first set mine up it was the opposite. I had to much sway bar effect. I had almost no body roll.
I have to admit John, you had yours tuned absolutely supreme at the loonie run & definitely trumped any air shock there. I know for a FACT that my rig won't raise a tire in the air to look like a dog taking a piss.
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Old October 22nd, 2013, 03:30 PM   #28
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I have to admit John, you had yours tuned absolutely supreme at the loonie run & definitely trumped any air shock there. I know for a FACT that my rig won't raise a tire in the air to look like a dog taking a piss.
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Old October 22nd, 2013, 04:04 PM   #29
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Yep on Thursday it did work supreme....Friday not so much.


To explain to others, I blew an internal seal on the RR strut. Which allowed the oil and nitrogen from the upper chamber into the lower chamber effectively locking the strut about 4"s below my ride height. It drove as if I had a metal rod welded into position on that corner. Allowing maybe a .250" of suspension travel from that corner.



With that said I still kept up and didnt slow anybody down

IMO < FACT/reality
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Old October 22nd, 2013, 10:39 PM   #30
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bill watching you go through hump trail those ori's are amazing. tell you what sell me the 14's and get the 18's ;) lol. due to loving the racing and wanting to go high speed i think coilovers are the best option for me.
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