Go Back   Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > Politics, Government, or Religion Chat
GL4x4 Live! GL4x4 Casino

Politics, Government, or Religion Chat Bring your flamesuit!







Search
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old April 11th, 2013, 07:36 AM   #61
brewmenn
Grumpy old man.
 
brewmenn's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Inkster, MI
Posts: 10,377
iTrader: (9)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
Our society is based on innocent until proven guilty. A person taking a prescribed medication has not been proven to have done anything wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mschaffer66 View Post
In theory that's how our society should work...
And it's how this law is supposed to work. I see nothing in the laws that says they can take guns away from some just because they have been prescribed a certain medication.
brewmenn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 11th, 2013, 07:46 AM   #62
brewmenn
Grumpy old man.
 
brewmenn's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Inkster, MI
Posts: 10,377
iTrader: (9)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
you won't get away with doing this stuff
I think this is where you have it wrong. Most of the recent mass shooters didn't try to "get away with" their crime. They either committed suicide or waited to get arrested. Traditional threats of punishment does nothing to stop them.
brewmenn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 11th, 2013, 09:40 AM   #63
GreaseMonkey
Senior Member
 
GreaseMonkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-04-05
Location: Washington, MI
Posts: 17,947
iTrader: (22)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by brewmenn View Post
I think this is where you have it wrong. Most of the recent mass shooters didn't try to "get away with" their crime. They either committed suicide or waited to get arrested. Traditional threats of punishment does nothing to stop them.
A few rounds at 1000 fps will stop them though, hopefully before they kill more.

But....gun free zones prevent all of that.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerryann View Post
I am not a lesbian but if I was I would do her.
GreaseMonkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 11th, 2013, 09:43 AM   #64
whiterhino
I'm not old, honest...
 
whiterhino's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-07-06
Location: Davisburg MI
Posts: 20,690
iTrader: (21)
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Default

I meant it in a different way. It's not that they cared about dying, it's about that they wanted to commit a haneous crime before they died. If they knew they would be stopped right away, they wouldn't be going to those locations.
__________________
GLFWDA member since 1979.
Member Southern Michigan Rock Crawlers.
whiterhino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 11th, 2013, 12:07 PM   #65
cmetzg03
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
 
cmetzg03's Avatar
 
Join Date: 04-30-11
Location: White Lake/roscommon
Posts: 6,115
iTrader: (6)
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by brewmenn View Post
i think this is where you have it wrong. Most of the recent mass shooters didn't try to "get away with" their crime. They either committed suicide or waited to get arrested. Traditional threats of punishment does nothing to stop them.
Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByTapatalk1365700069.829362.jpg
Views:	219
Size:	97.9 KB
ID:	104326
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Goode View Post
Man, this site was so much better before cmetzg03 joined
cmetzg03 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 11th, 2013, 12:14 PM   #66
brewmenn
Grumpy old man.
 
brewmenn's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Inkster, MI
Posts: 10,377
iTrader: (9)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
I meant it in a different way. It's not that they cared about dying, it's about that they wanted to commit a haneous crime before they died. If they knew they would be stopped right away, they wouldn't be going to those locations.
I agree with that.
brewmenn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 11th, 2013, 01:21 PM   #67
mschaffer66
Senior Member
 
mschaffer66's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: West Bloomfield, MI
Posts: 9,181
iTrader: (17)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cmetzg03 View Post
The problem with that is that this country would have to come to the realization that this is no longer happy, sunshiny 1950's America anymore.
mschaffer66 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 11th, 2013, 03:00 PM   #68
GreaseMonkey
Senior Member
 
GreaseMonkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-04-05
Location: Washington, MI
Posts: 17,947
iTrader: (22)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mschaffer66 View Post
The problem with that is that this country would have to come to the realization that this is no longer happy, sunshiny 1950's America anymore.
You mean to tell me firefighters don't exist solely to get cats out of trees?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerryann View Post
I am not a lesbian but if I was I would do her.
GreaseMonkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 11th, 2013, 07:10 PM   #69
cmetzg03
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
 
cmetzg03's Avatar
 
Join Date: 04-30-11
Location: White Lake/roscommon
Posts: 6,115
iTrader: (6)
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mschaffer66 View Post
The problem with that is that this country would have to come to the realization that this is no longer happy, sunshiny 1950's America anymore.
Exactly.

My thought is that everyone should have a gun and this comes from personal experience. When I was in the marines and faced my first deployment to Afghanistan their were a bunch of guys in my platoon that didn't get along, more or less hated each other. Once we got into Afghanistan and everyone had live ammo suddenly there was a new found respect for one another, and everyone got along. I think there's a lot to be said about that.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Goode View Post
Man, this site was so much better before cmetzg03 joined
cmetzg03 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 11th, 2013, 08:54 PM   #70
BlooMule
pew pew
 
BlooMule's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-08-05
Location: a mile from the shithole
Posts: 24,372
iTrader: (12)
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Default

'An armed society is a polite society'
__________________
-rw-rw-rw
BlooMule is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 12th, 2013, 06:59 AM   #71
SS
Such Majestic. Wow.
 
SS's Avatar
 
Join Date: 12-12-05
Location: Bimini, Bahamas
Posts: 11,433
iTrader: (13)
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cmetzg03 View Post
Exactly.

My thought is that everyone should have a gun and this comes from personal experience. When I was in the marines and faced my first deployment to Afghanistan their were a bunch of guys in my platoon that didn't get along, more or less hated each other. Once we got into Afghanistan and everyone had live ammo suddenly there was a new found respect for one another, and everyone got along. I think there's a lot to be said about that.
There were a hell of a lot more factors involved in that shift than just live ammo being issued.
__________________
-Jeremy

AMERICA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SS is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 12th, 2013, 07:04 AM   #72
SS
Such Majestic. Wow.
 
SS's Avatar
 
Join Date: 12-12-05
Location: Bimini, Bahamas
Posts: 11,433
iTrader: (13)
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Default

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013...est=latestnews
__________________
-Jeremy

AMERICA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SS is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 12th, 2013, 11:44 AM   #73
mschaffer66
Senior Member
 
mschaffer66's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: West Bloomfield, MI
Posts: 9,181
iTrader: (17)
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GreaseMonkey View Post
You mean to tell me firefighters don't exist solely to get cats out of trees?
mschaffer66 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 12th, 2013, 06:58 PM   #74
cmetzg03
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
 
cmetzg03's Avatar
 
Join Date: 04-30-11
Location: White Lake/roscommon
Posts: 6,115
iTrader: (6)
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SS View Post
There were a hell of a lot more factors involved in that shift than just live ammo being issued.
Your right there were, that was just one of my points, coulda have went into better detail, but my grammar sucks and I don't like typing that much Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByTapatalk1365811096.987245.jpg
Views:	44
Size:	108.9 KB
ID:	104373
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Goode View Post
Man, this site was so much better before cmetzg03 joined
cmetzg03 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 13th, 2013, 09:58 AM   #75
grocerygetterxj
Senior Member
 
Join Date: 05-18-09
Location: hilsdale/mi
Posts: 445
iTrader: (9)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

POLICE USE ANTI-ANXIETY MEDS
I am sure if someone checked, that there are a lot of police officers in this state that are taking anti-anxiety meds. Certainly, there are many who suffer from PTSD. Before the NY State Police checks the medical records for the public, they should check their own people. If being on anti-anxiety meds makes people too dangerous to own a firearm, then they will have to disarm their own.



I was going to say the same thing... there goes 1/2 of your first responders

Last edited by grocerygetterxj; April 13th, 2013 at 10:00 AM. Reason: add quote
grocerygetterxj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 13th, 2013, 06:54 PM   #76
cmetzg03
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
 
cmetzg03's Avatar
 
Join Date: 04-30-11
Location: White Lake/roscommon
Posts: 6,115
iTrader: (6)
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Default

Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByTapatalk1365897283.436763.jpg
Views:	85
Size:	119.5 KB
ID:	104409
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Goode View Post
Man, this site was so much better before cmetzg03 joined
cmetzg03 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 13th, 2013, 07:11 PM   #77
BlooMule
pew pew
 
BlooMule's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-08-05
Location: a mile from the shithole
Posts: 24,372
iTrader: (12)
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Default

How long before they confiscate guns from people who only live with people on one of the listed meds?
__________________
-rw-rw-rw
BlooMule is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 13th, 2013, 08:09 PM   #78
brewmenn
Grumpy old man.
 
brewmenn's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Inkster, MI
Posts: 10,377
iTrader: (9)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cmetzg03 View Post
Here's the summery of the law. Please show me where it says that:

Quote:
NY SAFE FACT SHEET
GUN OWNERS - WHAT THE LAW MEANS TO YOU
Enacted Into Law on January 15, 2013
If you are currently a pistol owner with a valid pistol permit:
Permit:
Pistol Permits for all legal owners remain valid. In all counties with the
exceptions of NYC, Suffolk, Nassau and Westchester, your permit will continue
to have no expiration. NYC, Suffolk, Nassau and Westchester have variants of
the no expiration provisions – these will also continue.
Every 5 years you will need to verify the following information on your pistol
permit to the New York State Police: name, DOB, gender, race, residential
address, social security number, the firearms possessed, and if you want, your email address. The purpose of the recertification is to update information. This
recertification process will not be in place for one year. Once it is in place, you
will have up to four years to do your first recertification. If you still have not
recertified after four years, you will receive a notice to recertify. Once you have
completed the recertification, you must recertify every five years thereafter. If
you do not recertify, your permit will no longer be valid and you will need to
reapply.
You will now be able to keep your pistol permit information private.
Newspapers around the State have been releasing personal pistol permit
information. You will now be given the opportunity to shield your pistol permit
information from disclosure as a public record under Freedom Of Information
Law provisions if you have a reason to retain your privacy on this matter.
Reasons range from your employment as a police officer, status as a victim of
domestic violence, or many other reasons including the belief that you could be
the subject of unwarranted harassment upon disclosure. No FOIL requests are
being processed for 6 months while opt out forms are being created and permit
holders are given time to submit such to the county that holds your permit. If you
do not opt out at this point, you may do so at any time in the future.
Pistols:
Under current law all of your handguns are required to be listed on your
pistol permit. If you own a pistol that was a grandfathered assault weapon as a
result of the 1994 Federal Assault Weapon Ban, starting in 90 days from the new
law’s enactment, if it is not already listed on your pistol permit, you will need to
make sure it is listed within a year. You may only transfer it to another person
outside New York State or a Federal Firearms Licensed Dealer in or out of New
York State. You must update your permit within 72 hours if you do dispose of it.
If you own a semiautomatic pistol with the ability to accept a detachable
magazine, and it has any of the specific characteristics1
, starting in 90 days from
1
a folding or telescoping stock; a thumbhole stock; a second handgrip or a protruding grip that can be held by the
non-trigger hand; capacity to accept an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip; a
threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer; a shroud that
is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the
non-trigger hand without being burned; a manufactured weight of fifty ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded;
or a semiautomatic version of an automatic rifle, shotgun or firearm.2
enactment, if it is not already listed on your pistol permit, you will need to make
sure it is listed within a year, and you may only transfer it to another person
outside New York State or a Federal Firearms Licensed Dealer in or out of New
York State. You must update your permit within 72 hours if you do dispose of it.
You may no longer purchase a pistol, new or used, that falls within the assault
pistol definition above.
If you own any other type of pistol, there are no further requirements or
restrictions on the pistol itself. However, starting in 60 days from enactment, any
private sales of pistols will require a National Instant Criminal Background Check
System (NICS) by a firearms dealer to effectuate the transfer. There is an
exception to this for transfers to immediate family members – spouses and
children.
If you are currently a legal rifle owner:
Permit/registration:
There is no new permit or registration process for rifle owners that are not
defined as “assault weapons”.
Rifle:
If you own a rifle that was a grandfathered assault weapon as a result of the
1994 Federal Assault Weapon Ban, starting in 90 days from enactment, you
will need to register it with the New York State Police within a year, and you
may only transfer it to another person outside New York State or a Federal
Firearms Licensed Dealer in or out of New York State. You must update your
registration within 72 hours if you do dispose of it.
If you own a semiautomatic rifle with the ability to accept a detachable
magazine, and it has any of the specific characteristics2
, starting in 90 days from
enactment you will need to register it with the New York State Police within a
year, and you may only transfer it to another person outside New York State or a
Federal Firearms Licensed Dealer in or out of New York State. You must update
your registration within 72 hours if you do dispose of it. You may no longer
purchase a rifle, new or used, that falls within the assault rifle definition above.
If you own any other type of rifle, there are no further requirements or
restrictions on the rifle itself. However, starting in 60 days from enactment, any
private sales of rifles will require a NICS check by a firearms dealer to effectuate
the transfer. There is an exception to this for transfers to immediate family
members – spouses and children.
2
a folding or telescoping stock; a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon; a
thumbhole stock; a second handgrip or a protruding grip that can be held by the non-trigger hand; a bayonet mount;
a flash suppressor, muzzle break, muzzle compensator, or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash
suppressor, muzzle break, or muzzle compensator; or a grenade launcher.
.3
If you are currently a legal shotgun owner:
Permit/registration:
There is no new permit or registration process for shotgun owners that are not
defined as “assault weapons.”
Shotgun:
If you own a shotgun that was a grandfathered assault weapon as a result of
the 1994 Federal Assault Weapon Ban, starting in 90 days from enactment,
you will need to register it with the New York State Police within a year, and
you may only transfer it to another person outside New York State or a Federal
Firearms Licensed Dealer in or out of New York State. You must update your
registration within 72 hours if you do dispose of it.
If you own a semiautomatic shotgun and it has any of the specific
characteristics3
, starting in 90 days from enactment you will need to register it
with the New York State Police within a year, and you may only transfer it to
another person outside New York State or a Federal Firearms Licensed Dealer in
or out of New York State. You must update your registration within 72 hours if
you do dispose of it. You may no longer purchase a shotgun, new or used, that
falls within the assault shotgun definition above.
If you own any other type of shotgun, there are no further requirements or
restrictions on the shotgun itself. However, starting in 60 days from enactment,
any private sales of shotguns will require a NICS check by a firearms dealer to
effectuate the transfer. There is an exception to this for transfers to immediate
family members – spouses and children.
All gun owners:
Ammunition:
If you own a large capacity magazine greater than 10 round capacity that was
a grandfathered magazine as a result of the 1994 Federal Assault Weapon Ban,
within a year, you must do one of the following: dispose of it to another person
outside New York State, surrender it to law enforcement officials, or permanently
alter such to only accept 7 rounds.
If you own a 10 round magazine for your gun, you will be allowed to keep
such magazine but only be able to load it with 7 rounds unless you are at an
exempted location such as a shooting range or competition. In 90 days from
enactment you will no longer be able to purchase 10 round magazines, only 7 and
lower capacity magazines.
Starting in one year, to purchase ammunition, the seller will perform a check to
verify that you are not prohibited under the Federal Law disqualifiers (see last
page) from possessing a firearm, and will not sell you ammunition if you are
prohibited.
3
a folding or telescoping stock; a thumbhole stock; a second handgrip or a protruding grip that can be held by the
non-trigger hand; a fixed magazine capacity in excess of seven rounds; or an ability to accept a detachable
magazine.
.4
Safe Storage:
If you live with someone you know to be disqualified from owning a gun
because of a criminal conviction, a mental health issue, or because they have a
current order of protection out against them, then you are under an obligation that
before you leave your gun out of your immediate possession or control, you must
first securely lock the gun in a safe or other secure container, or render it
incapable of being fired by using a gun locking device.
Relics and Curios:
If you own a gun that falls within the definition of an assault weapon and/or a
corresponding high capacity magazine for such a weapon, which is 50 years
old or more, it is considered a relic and curio. The value as a collectable or
antique of such is understood, and although both must be registered with the New
York State Police within 1 year, they may continue to be bought and sold in and
out of the state so long as registration information is kept current.
Federal Disqualifiers
Certain persons are prohibited by Federal Law from possessing any gun anywhere in
the United States. Under Federal Law these individuals are also banned from possessing
firearms in New York State if they meet one of the following criteria:
who has been convicted in any court of, a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term
exceeding one year;
who is a fugitive from justice;
who is an unlawful user of or addicted to any controlled substance (as defined in
section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 802));
who has been adjudicated as a mental defective or who has been committed to a mental
institution;
who, being an alien
is illegally or unlawfully in the United States; or
except as provided in subsection (y)(2), has been admitted to the United States
under a nonimmigrant visa (as that term is defined in section 101(a)(26) of the
Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1101(a)(26)));
who has been discharged from the Armed Forces under dishonorable conditions;
who, having been a citizen of the United States, who has renounced his citizenship;
who is subject to a court order that -
was issued after a hearing of which such person received actual notice, and at
which such person had an opportunity to participate;
restrains such person from harassing, stalking, or threatening an intimate
partner of such person or child of such intimate partner or person, or engaging
in other conduct that would place an intimate partner in reasonable fear of
bodily injury to the partner or child; and
includes a finding that such person represents a credible threat to the physical
safety of such intimate partner or child; or by its terms explicitly prohibits the
use, attempted use, or threatened use of physical force against such intimate
partner or child that would reasonably be expected to cause bodily injury; or
who has been convicted in any court of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence.
brewmenn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 13th, 2013, 08:59 PM   #79
cmetzg03
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
 
cmetzg03's Avatar
 
Join Date: 04-30-11
Location: White Lake/roscommon
Posts: 6,115
iTrader: (6)
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by brewmenn View Post
Here's the summery of the law. Please show me where it says that:
Its called the mental health provision
Mhl 9.46 and being thrown around as of April as a provision to the safe act
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Goode View Post
Man, this site was so much better before cmetzg03 joined
cmetzg03 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 13th, 2013, 09:15 PM   #80
brewmenn
Grumpy old man.
 
brewmenn's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: Inkster, MI
Posts: 10,377
iTrader: (9)
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cmetzg03 View Post
Its called the mental health provision
Mhl 9.46 and being thrown around as of April as a provision to the safe act
Oh this: https://www.omh.ny.gov/omhweb/safe_act/faq.html

or this: https://www.omh.ny.gov/omhweb/safe_act/guidance.pdf

more: https://www.omh.ny.gov/omhweb/safe_act/user_guide.pdf

https://www.omh.ny.gov/omhweb/safe_a...l_guidance.pdf

Still not finding that list, or any requirement that anyone prescribed any of those medications should have their guns taken away.
brewmenn is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply
Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > Politics, Government, or Religion Chat
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:58 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd. Runs best on HiVelocity Hosting.
Copyright ©2005 - 2012 Cracker Enterprises - Powered by Linux
vB Ad Management by =RedTyger=
Page generated in 0.29731 seconds with 53 queries