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Old April 1st, 2013, 08:47 PM   #41
Haggar
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Originally Posted by mean_greenEXJAY View Post
Even though it is from almost 10 years ago, the parish Chevy would still be wicked on the street, a truck like that would definitely still surprise most other cars on the street. When a 4wd truck can run 10s on stock tires why would you even want a rwd car.]
Thats almost right on what I am targeting for what this will be capable of.

I have an LS2 motor for my project. So, I've been researching up what the LS2 cars are running with standard builds. I want to put in a new cam, because I want a lumpy low LSA cam for sound, as well as lowering the torque rpm, since I plan 4.10s/4.56s, and the AWD.

So, Looking at TBSS guys, builds with a cam, exhaust, intake, header, tuning, are getting into mid 12s.

Looking at GTOs, they are running mid 11s with the same setup.

What I find is many many vehicles 'crunch' out to around 500HP, and line up pretty well with what the drag calculators predict.

If I put the same numbers now into my expected running weight of 3250lbs, when a 500hp (crank hp) should run about 10.9 @ 123, which is pretty much exactly what that truck in the video is doing. (Actually, my weight spreadsheet shows 2800lbs, but I will assume an extra couple hundred pounds, plus my fat butt..). Considering that I have seen carbed LS2s hit 480hp on stock cam, 500hp (if not 525) on a good cam is certainly possible.
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Old April 1st, 2013, 08:48 PM   #42
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The bar was for kicks in the picture.......... take the bar off the back, and what would you honestly think this could run if you saw it sitting next to you
What shifter do you have in there? manual or automatic valve body?
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 01:19 AM   #43
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My car should end out at about 2500 pounds with a pimp close ratio T-56 6 speed and 4.56 gears. It'll pull sub-3's in the 0-60. Ill get some more details shot around to you guys
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 04:06 AM   #44
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I'd say PM cerial, I bet he's got lots of good ideas.
I went with awd simply because I wanted the transfer case to be as strong as possible using only 2 moving gears, shafts, and bearings. To get 60% bias in the rear I am using the engines weight.

More and more companies are going to rear biased awd. Front biased awd is junk and more of a cheap car thing. I have had 4 tempo's (sleepers) one was a 86 with "awd". The thing would not hook up worth a damn until I tossed weight in the rear.

I am also building my cj-5 into a light weight, low budget, 2wd, summer only, cruiser. Being lightweight I am moving the engine into the drivers compartment for better weight distribution. I am using 2wd because of the lighter weight and increased reliability over a awd system. That and I can get it lower cheaper using 2wd.
The stock 69 cj5's rolling chassis will be for sale soon.


What build are you starting now honcho?

What are you building this thing to do?

Toss slicks under that jeepster and be done with it.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 04:12 AM   #45
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My car should end out at about 2500 pounds with a pimp close ratio T-56 6 speed and 4.56 gears. It'll pull sub-3's in the 0-60. Ill get some more details shot around to you guys
How much have you tossed into fixing the t-56 shifting and syncro issues?
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 06:52 AM   #46
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http://www.summitracing.com/expertad...ve-32-roadster

This thing is pretty impressive.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 07:16 AM   #47
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Do you still plan for this to be driven on the dune too?
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 07:52 AM   #48
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Do you still plan for this to be driven on the dune too?
likely not. I think it ends up making too many compromises.. I am finding this is the downfall of many Jeep projects, trying to make them do too many things, then they are not great at any one thing. If I make it setup for the dunes, then it needs to be taller and have ground clearance and wheel travel, and wider spacing for the tires. If I make it for the street, then I want it lower, and narrower.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 08:03 AM   #49
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Also, please PLEASE don't convert it to carbureted. You've got a cool, functional, innovative build in the works with some nice parts. Why take a great fuel injection system and downgrade to outdated technology? You've got the knowledge and resources to keep the EFI, so keep it.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 08:04 AM   #50
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My car should end out at about 2500 pounds with a pimp close ratio T-56 6 speed and 4.56 gears. It'll pull sub-3's in the 0-60. Ill get some more details shot around to you guys

I wish you the best with your weight goal, that will be difficult.

A 1968 Charger, base small block V8, was over 3300lbs listed curb weight, so you are looking at 800-1000lbs curb weight reduction with your project. Thats tough to do. You can lose some weight with an aluminum engine, but you are adding in the front diff, front driveshaft, and the T56/t-case combo weighs more than a TF727. Evben with zero interior, expect a single race seat, I can't see that car coming in that light.

I am trying to be realistic with mine.

I am starting with a 1969 CJ6, which has a curb weight of around 2400lbs. The LS2 is lighter than the original 4 cyl. I am still showing a gain of about 400lbs over the stock vehicle. (my main gains are in the transmission, axles, tires, frame, exhaust, full cage, and a 250lb 'misc' for things I have forgot). I will have no doors, no windows, no trunk, no carpet, no heater, no heavy roof like a car, and a fiberglass hood. Those numbers crunch to 2835lbs (which includes the 250lbs of misc items). I have a scale in the garage, so the main weights I have for engine, trans, etc, are pretty close. I will be weighing things again as I go.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 08:07 AM   #51
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Also, please PLEASE don't convert it to carbureted. You've got a cool, functional, innovative build in the works with some nice parts. Why take a great fuel injection system and downgrade to outdated technology? You've got the knowledge and resources to keep the EFI, so keep it.
Yeah, this is my plan. The carb setups *seem* very easy, and simple, buuuutt.... I don't know how to tune a carb for shit. I am thinking a pretty basic engine combo: long tubes, and not much exhaust after that, as functional of a cold-air intake as I can fit, electric fans, and a good size cam, and likely swap to some vette/GTO 33lb or some 42lb injectors, since the TBSS has 28#s...
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 08:17 AM   #52
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2500 will be work but I think is possible, my car is about 2800 with a cast block and 8.50 cage, all glass still in it, pw windows and the only thing fiberglass is the hood.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 09:19 AM   #53
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I read about a guy racing his Vette and wanted to save weight. Found that the power windows were lighter than the manuals. Go figure.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 10:48 AM   #54
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That shifter is a Hurst quarter stick. Manual RVB transmission.
I have a very hard time seeing how that Charger can get down to 2500lbs unless it's a tin can on a tube frame. It's going to have to lose 1,000lbs at least.
As far as light to light, with my D44 I was seeing sub 2's in 0-60 on the street. I never left hard because I didn't know how much the rearend would take.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 11:32 AM   #55
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If you set it up right I don,t see any reason why you can not hook up with that cj6 in 2wd.

Look at building a top out of 16 gauge. The Myers top I have is very light even with the glass in it. It felt about half the weight of the yj top I had on it.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 11:51 AM   #56
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My dad used to be on the crew for an off shore race boat. One day the boss wanted to remove 100# from the boat. In order to do that, you do not simply remove one thing that weighs 100#, you remove 100 things that weigh 1 pound. I have been going over every single piece that will be on that car in the end. If it can be lighter, I do not stop until it is

I know the mopar B body weighs a lot but you would not believe just how much of that weight is in just all the bolt on stuff. I have weighed my bare shell, it is only 635 pounds. I have a Moser 9 inch rear, will be using an aluminum 3rd member, 5.7 Hemi (505lb, weighed that too), trans is 100, transfer case is 45, front diff is 40 iirc, CV shafts are around 10, driveshaft about another 20. My steering rack is from Woodward, only 15# iirc. This will be manual steering and brakes with a Tilton triple master clutch and brake assy (5#). Rite now with the car as a shell with rear axle, engine/trans/transfer case and the front end, I should be no more than 1400-1500 pounds. That is with no interior, glass or body panels yet. I also am not running the stock grill or grill support. I have fiberglass fenders (5#) and a fiberglass hood altho I want to get a different bolt on one which I think is 15#. Then a fiberglass deck lid for another 5# vs the stock 40#'er. I really do hope I can do the 2500# race weight, only time will tell tho. My suspension and sway bar setup that I have built only weighs 20# a piece (front and rear) and I have eliminated the stock bolt in front K member (60#) for my own tubular one which weighs I think 25#

Like someone else said, do not do the carb conversion. EFI is decades ahead, literally. You can have an LS motor running for about $300 in wiring harness modification and ECU reflashing. You will have better economy and driveability complete with on board diagnostics

For the transfer case, just pick up a 247. As we all know, jeep guys hate them because of the viscous coupling and usually swap them out. You can pick one up, remove all of the shiftable components and save 20#. The coupling is actually pretty awesome for what we want.

As for the question about the t-56, I had a Viper t-56 before. Now tho I am using a c-5 Corvette t-56 but with the 32 spline SSR mainshaft and the Viper mid plate. The C-5 has the triple/double synchro assemblies so it should shift slick as owl snot up to and over 7,000rpm. For the shifter itself, I will be using a Keisler mid shifter. The stock C-5 tailshaft is still on there then I have a 3/4 plate and a 545rfe tailshaft to give me a trans mount and adapt to the NV 6 bolt transfer case pattern. Then another 3/4 plate to flip the 247

Here are a few shots of my junk. The front diff in there is from a cadillac STS but now I am using one from a trailblazer/envoy since they have a larger ring gear and some aftermarket support that provided me with a 4.56 ratio




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Old April 2nd, 2013, 12:03 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cerial View Post
If you set it up right I don,t see any reason why you can not hook up with that cj6 in 2wd.

Look at building a top out of 16 gauge. The Myers top I have is very light even with the glass in it. It felt about half the weight of the yj top I had on it.
I agree. One of my biggest complaints about AWD/4WD is the added cost of the components, and the drivetrain HP loss you're going to see with it.
This is nowhere near a correct figure, but if you say there's a 20% loss in a typical 2WD setup, what do you think that loss is thru a 4WD setup? 35%?
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 12:22 PM   #58
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Can you make it lighter by filling the pvc pipes with cement?
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 12:30 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by cerial View Post
If you set it up right I don,t see any reason why you can not hook up with that cj6 in 2wd.

Look at building a top out of 16 gauge. The Myers top I have is very light even with the glass in it. It felt about half the weight of the yj top I had on it.
Its a summer jeep, it will not have any top, except a bikini top. For track days, the windshield and tailgate will be removed, since the early ones have those nice slotted hinges to remove them without tools.
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Old April 2nd, 2013, 12:35 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by Haggar View Post
I would be building RWD is if it was a track car, for sure. You can certainly hook with RWD. But, could you launch well, on a street with some dirt or gravel on it, or hitting a big bump or pothole, or it rains and you are out on near-slicks.

Thinking for the street, AWD would be fun, and unique.

......
Hmm....

I have no issues hooking on the street with ~450 horse and drag radials (bias ply) in a RWD application. I usually 'launch' at about 3500 rpm and it sticks. However, thats about all I can do. The car is setup to go straight and get traction, once you throw a turn into the mix, its over. I'd probably go AWD if possible, power through turns, almost always hook up. You'd get the best of both worlds.
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