14 bolt gear setup pattern - Page 2 - Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest

Go Back   Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > 4x4 Talk > Axle Tech
GL4x4 Live! GL4x4 Casino

greatlakes4x4.com is the premier Great Lakes 4x4 Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Search
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old March 13th, 2013, 09:15 PM   #21
Toyfish
Senior Member
 
Toyfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: 02-05-10
Location: lapeer, MI
Posts: 2,020
iTrader: (29)
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Default

Looks like the pinion needs to be pulled away from the ring gear

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2
Toyfish is online now   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old March 14th, 2013, 03:09 AM   #22
moparhorse
Senior Member
 
moparhorse's Avatar
 
Join Date: 10-31-12
Location: Beaverton
Posts: 675
iTrader: (4)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Did you move the pinion away from the carrier? How much did you move it? Backlash is way to tight for a used gears. I would set it up at a minimum of .010 backlash being thats its a worn gear and im PRETTY sure it would have never been adjusted before in the housing it was originally in. The pinion still needs to move away from the carrier still though.

Dont get fed up with it yet. After getting the pattern right you still need to get the pinion and the carrier preload right. Did you swap the pinion from the used stuff or use the whole pinion and pinion carrier?. Its a learning process for sure
moparhorse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2013, 06:01 AM   #23
Doc
Senior Member
 
Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-09-11
Location: Burton, Mi
Posts: 298
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Moved it back .0015 from the original for that picture. Ill move it out a little more when i get the time
The pinon carrier is rebuilt, all new bearings with the pinion and ring gear and carrier were out of another housing.

I really appreciate the help, and yes definitely a learning process.
Doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2013, 06:02 AM   #24
Doc
Senior Member
 
Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-09-11
Location: Burton, Mi
Posts: 298
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

And yes away from carrier
Doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2013, 01:14 PM   #25
moparhorse
Senior Member
 
moparhorse's Avatar
 
Join Date: 10-31-12
Location: Beaverton
Posts: 675
iTrader: (4)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

.0015" or .015"?
moparhorse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2013, 01:45 PM   #26
Doc
Senior Member
 
Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-09-11
Location: Burton, Mi
Posts: 298
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

.015
Doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2013, 01:56 PM   #27
moparhorse
Senior Member
 
moparhorse's Avatar
 
Join Date: 10-31-12
Location: Beaverton
Posts: 675
iTrader: (4)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Ok that sounds better. Try another or .015 or.020 and put the backlash at .010-.012 then snap a pic of it. Should start to look better
moparhorse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2013, 02:12 PM   #28
Doc
Senior Member
 
Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-09-11
Location: Burton, Mi
Posts: 298
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Alright, i will asap.
Doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2013, 02:18 PM   #29
Ironman Offroad
Cool parts peddler
 
Ironman Offroad's Avatar
 
Join Date: 07-29-10
Location: Saginaw, Michigan
Posts: 1,511
iTrader: (11)
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Default

Make big adjustments.
That way you can see progress.
Ironman Offroad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15th, 2013, 05:49 PM   #30
Doc
Senior Member
 
Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-09-11
Location: Burton, Mi
Posts: 298
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

+.015 pinion .010 backlash


+.010 on top of that .008 backlash
Doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15th, 2013, 07:38 PM   #31
moparhorse
Senior Member
 
moparhorse's Avatar
 
Join Date: 10-31-12
Location: Beaverton
Posts: 675
iTrader: (4)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Wow, dont seem like its getting better. How much do you have the pinion shimmed out so far? Wonder if the other side looks better at all?
moparhorse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15th, 2013, 08:00 PM   #32
moparhorse
Senior Member
 
moparhorse's Avatar
 
Join Date: 10-31-12
Location: Beaverton
Posts: 675
iTrader: (4)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

I forgot to mention which side is what. The concave side in your last to pic's is called the "coast" side which is where the pinion contacts in reverse. When setting a used set up, the best place to start at is by looking at the reverse side which isent used nearly as much.

You first pic has a decent reverse side pattern to it. What shim size did you have behind the pinion carrier when you took the first pics in your post?
moparhorse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15th, 2013, 08:22 PM   #33
Doc
Senior Member
 
Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-09-11
Location: Burton, Mi
Posts: 298
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Leaving town for the weekend, i think i had about .018 pinion in the first picture
.

I have it shimmed out about. .050, which i'm assuming is way to far out. Not getting any results
Now.

Should i go back to .010 and and see where that leaves me? I don't think these gears will ever leave a good drive side pattern, i was trying to get a good one off the coast.
Doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15th, 2013, 08:29 PM   #34
moparhorse
Senior Member
 
moparhorse's Avatar
 
Join Date: 10-31-12
Location: Beaverton
Posts: 675
iTrader: (4)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Yes you have the idea for what your doing by going off the coast side. I would try .010-.015 behind the pinion and set the lash at .008-.010 and then take a pic.

Sometimes with different manufacture bearings/races/ring/pinions, you will need to put up to .120 behind the pinion to setup a NEW gear set. Hope ya have a good learing process with this.
moparhorse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 16th, 2013, 02:34 PM   #35
BigWheelBob
Wholesale 4X4 parts
 
BigWheelBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-13-11
Location: Muskegon, MI
Posts: 223
iTrader: (2)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Listen to me carefully! Put you original pinion shim in it, set the back lash to 10 thousands, put the cover on it, and run it. it will be fine. Trying to get a nice pattern on a used gear is a big headache.
BigWheelBob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 16th, 2013, 02:52 PM   #36
deerebowtie
Unchained
 
deerebowtie's Avatar
 
Join Date: 05-04-09
Location: SE Michigan
Posts: 1,742
iTrader: (23)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

has anyone ever re-lapped used gears in a housing? just curious
deerebowtie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2013, 07:56 PM   #37
Doc
Senior Member
 
Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-09-11
Location: Burton, Mi
Posts: 298
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

All patterns are at .010 backlash

.018 pinion







.010 pinion





.008 pinion







Doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2013, 07:57 PM   #38
Doc
Senior Member
 
Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-09-11
Location: Burton, Mi
Posts: 298
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigWheelBob View Post
Listen to me carefully! Put you original pinion shim in it, set the back lash to 10 thousands, put the cover on it, and run it. it will be fine. Trying to get a nice pattern on a used gear is a big headache.
Don't have the original shim, and I would rather get it the best as possible and not just half ass it.
Doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2013, 08:03 PM   #39
MiNi Beast
Senior Member
 
MiNi Beast's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-13-06
Location: Marquette, MI
Posts: 9,003
iTrader: (75)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc View Post
Don't have the original shim, and I would rather get it the best as possible and not just half ass it.
Then buy new gears and install kit and have a professional set them up.

I had simular issues with my 44, all you can do is take your time and do it right. Have you come up with any reference points yet to work from?
MiNi Beast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2013, 08:39 PM   #40
Doc
Senior Member
 
Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: 01-09-11
Location: Burton, Mi
Posts: 298
iTrader: (19)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Default

Then buy new gears and install kit and have a professional set them up.

Not looking for perfect but I'm looking for the best out of what i have. I don't want to throw it together, I want to learn to set up the gears, and looking for advice on that. using the old shim from this housing even if i did have it does not make sense, I have changed the carrier and the gears, It would be nice to work off off but I wouldn't just put the shim in and call it good. Next time I build an axle or re-gear these there is no doubt I'm going to buy new gears, this is too much of a pain in the ass, but I'm not giving up now. I won't have someone else set them up either.

I had simular issues with my 44, all you can do is take your time and do it right. Have you come up with any reference points yet to work from?

I don't know what you mean by a reference point. I can add shims from where I am. i have my smallest shim in the axle right now, its .008. I can work from the .018 shim by adding, but the pattern wear patterns I get don't make sense in reference to gear setup wear patterns I see online, most likely because they are used gears. I may have a shim in between .010 and .018 also, but the pattern between those does not show much of a difference.

The only thing I can thing of is just keep adding shims until I can shim it out any more in every combination, until I get a good pattern, and if i don't I can choose the best out of the pictures I take. Unless the last 3 look any decent, only thing i can do is add shim, or maybe buy a different shim kit.

Last edited by Doc; March 17th, 2013 at 08:42 PM.
Doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > 4x4 Talk > Axle Tech

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:23 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright 2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd. Runs best on HiVelocity Hosting.
Page generated in 0.22165 seconds with 81 queries