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Old December 18th, 2012, 02:03 PM   #21
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Wow, that was a terrible piece. Cherry picking technicalities really is piss poor journalism and a sign of people whos argument is flawed. The argument about taking God out of schools is a valid one. Liberal assholes forgot when they banned God to replace him with mandatory ethics classes so our kids have something like a moral compass.
yup. throw out something controversial. they slip back into anonymity. the vocal few attempting to direct the masses and stir up decention.

life is the culmination in domino effect from our God given right to free will. we are who we've become due to our own choices. we get to where we're going due to our own choices.

I would advocate the belief in God but I'd never force my beliefs on anyone.


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Old December 18th, 2012, 04:17 PM   #22
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which warranted a very long and drawn out private message from a "friend" who basically told me that he can't wait for my judgement from god, yada yada yada, and that he didn't care what happened to me. And he de-friended me. ;)

Was my comment offensive? Was it more or less offensive than the message on the t-shirt?
Sounds like we would get along because he/she is apparently as worried about yoru future judgement as I am.

Was is a cause for defriending . . . well I mean did you also put that persons kid on the website so your friends could say terrible things about it?

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I totally hate this T-shirt. It's the exact same thing Huckabee said on his blog too. It's so far off, it's not even funny. It's simply a political statement rapped up in religious dribble.
I disagree with you completly. I think it is direct punishment just as aids is to the gay community, just as natural disasters are to the wicked. God didn't send the killer to kill these children but this is what happens in a Godless world.

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Old December 18th, 2012, 04:39 PM   #23
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I disagree with you completly. I think it is direct punishment just as aids is to the gay community, just as natural disasters are to the wicked. God didn't send the killer to kill these children but this is what happens in a Godless world.
Result of Sin (Godlessness) Yes. Direct Punishment? No. That's what i think. The way the shirt is worded it makes it sound like God allowed these kids to get killed because he was mad that he wasn't in our school.

This is a result of our broken world. I realize how hypocritical I may seem after posting the sermon I did a couple weeks ago. I just don't clump those two together. The shootings were an act of a person, who was broken. Sandy was an act of the weather.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 04:53 PM   #24
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Result of Sin (Godlessness) Yes. Direct Punishment? No. That's what i think. The way the shirt is worded it makes it sound like God allowed these kids to get killed because he was mad that he wasn't in our school.

This is a result of our broken world. I realize how hypocritical I may seem after posting the sermon I did a couple weeks ago. I just don't clump those two together. The shootings were an act of a person, who was broken. Sandy was an act of the weather.
He didn't stop it so he allowed it . . . Why did that happen? Becasue he is giving us the ability to judge for ourselves and has washed his hands.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 05:27 PM   #25
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Result of Sin (Godlessness) Yes. Direct Punishment? No. That's what i think. The way the shirt is worded it makes it sound like God allowed these kids to get killed because he was mad that he wasn't in our school.

This is a result of our broken world. I realize how hypocritical I may seem after posting the sermon I did a couple weeks ago. I just don't clump those two together. The shootings were an act of a person, who was broken. Sandy was an act of the weather.
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He didn't stop it so he allowed it . . . Why did that happen? Becasue he is giving us the ability to judge for ourselves and has washed his hands.
Our society is continually removing God from our lives. Not wanting His presence in our schools(prayer) and pushing Him from our courts and government(separation of church and state).
I believe we will see things only get worse, God giving us into our evil desires, the wickedness of a depraved society. God allows these things to happen, for what reasons? I do not have answers to that. But I know that His ways are not our ways and our thoughts are not His thoughts. We need as Christians to trust in HIs word that He will give us peace in knowing that God is still in control and on His throne.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 05:41 PM   #26
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Coming from the perspective of an evangelical christian here. May I suggest we need more God in our individual homes to deal with the ills of society. I dont need a teacher teaching my kids how to pray, worship or live biblical, thats my mine and my wifes job. I dont care to have my kids teacher or school officials promoting their brand of religion or lack of religion to my kids. Teach my kids a secular education. Leave the spirituality and religion to the homes and churches.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 06:16 PM   #27
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Coming from the perspective of an evangelical christian here. May I suggest we need more God in our individual homes to deal with the ills of society. I dont need a teacher teaching my kids how to pray, worship or live biblical, thats my mine and my wifes job. I dont care to have my kids teacher or school officials promoting their brand of religion or lack of religion to my kids. Teach my kids a secular education. Leave the spirituality and religion to the homes and churches.



Thank you. I can't believe more religious people don't feel this way.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 06:21 PM   #28
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its not because God isnt allowed in school from Gods perspective but rather the lessons learned from the bible. To say God allowed this to happen is demented, and incorrect.God gave us all free will, but the right to pay the consiquences too as in every situation in life. this is just the ultimate payment.
If a teacher has a student ask why do we have to love everybody. and the teacher being moral give a good answer, and gives good examples teaches a lesson. Its amazing how bullying has picked up so much n the last few years. Its been going on since I was a kid,but we handled it, not such softies that it ruined our lives! and we had to get back at them because revenge is mine says God so we dont have to be compelled to get back at anybody
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Old December 18th, 2012, 06:36 PM   #29
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So, this popped up:



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Old December 18th, 2012, 06:36 PM   #30
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He didn't stop it so he allowed it . . . Why did that happen? Becasue he is giving us the ability to judge for ourselves and has washed his hands.
Maybe he did stop more then 27 people from dying? We don't know. I'm all for agreeing that it's a result of us, as humans, turning away from God. I think that's all it is though, a human who was messed up by our world and acted on how hurt he was.

Would you consider a soldier dying to be God punishing our nation? How bout the child who died because of Cancer? We don't know God's plans but we do know that we can cling to him in hard times, and easy times, to make us stronger.

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Our society is continually removing God from our lives. Not wanting His presence in our schools(prayer) and pushing Him from our courts and government(separation of church and state).
I believe we will see things only get worse, God giving us into our evil desires, the wickedness of a depraved society. God allows these things to happen, for what reasons? I do not have answers to that. But I know that His ways are not our ways and our thoughts are not His thoughts. We need as Christians to trust in HIs word that He will give us peace in knowing that God is still in control and on His throne.
I know things will only get worse. Jesus said so. That's why I don't get up in arms about God being removed from Schools or the Government. They can't remove him from our lives though. We don't need the schools or government to share the word of God. We just need to live lifes pleasing and acceptable to God. To Glorify him. Anything other then that, should be a non-issue.

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Coming from the perspective of an evangelical christian here. May I suggest we need more God in our individual homes to deal with the ills of society. I dont need a teacher teaching my kids how to pray, worship or live biblical, thats my mine and my wifes job. I dont care to have my kids teacher or school officials promoting their brand of religion or lack of religion to my kids. Teach my kids a secular education. Leave the spirituality and religion to the homes and churches.
I'm ok with that as the teachers and employees are non-bias. From my experience in High school, That was not the case. Our School was a haven for Atheist teachers that would down play and mock Christianity at any point they could. That's my issue.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 06:37 PM   #31
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So, this popped up:

BBBBWWWWAAAAHHHHHHH That's awesome!
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Old December 18th, 2012, 06:39 PM   #32
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BBBBWWWWAAAAHHHHHHH That's awesome!
I thought you'd like that.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 06:42 PM   #33
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Let me add, we do not need "trickle down spirituality" legislated into our schools or government to change society. If the religious dont like the godlessness of our society, maybe we should reach out to those who are godless individually instead of forcing a god on the masses through law. Real social change starts in the homes not in the halls of government. Really trying not to preach here, but no where in scripture is true christianity promoted by government, yet the disciples of Christ were said to have "turned their world (society) upside down".
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Old December 18th, 2012, 06:52 PM   #34
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[/SIZE][/U][/B]

Thank you. I can't believe more religious people don't feel this way.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 06:54 PM   #35
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Maybe he did stop more then 27 people from dying? We don't know. I'm all for agreeing that it's a result of us, as humans, turning away from God. I think that's all it is though, a human who was messed up by our world and acted on how hurt he was.

Would you consider a soldier dying to be God punishing our nation? How bout the child who died because of Cancer? We don't know God's plans but we do know that we can cling to him in hard times, and easy times, to make us stronger.



I know things will only get worse. Jesus said so. That's why I don't get up in arms about God being removed from Schools or the Government. They can't remove him from our lives though. We don't need the schools or government to share the word of God. We just need to live lifes pleasing and acceptable to God. To Glorify him. Anything other then that, should be a non-issue.



I'm ok with that as the teachers and employees are non-bias. From my experience in High school, That was not the case. Our School was a haven for Atheist teachers that would down play and mock Christianity at any point they could. That's my issue.


I would agree I have seen the mockery and that needs to stop. We want to be tolerant, right? I've also seen some manipulation of students because of their religious views. A recent example: my 13 yr old daughter was trash talking an opposing team during a game in her gym class, her teacher called her out and said she was going too far with it. I have no problem with this so far. Then the teacher who we do not know, but knew of my daughters religious views began to ask her what "her god" would think of her actions. To me this was a clear cut attempt to manipulate her emotions. My wife made a call to her directly, cited separation of church and state and informed the teacher it was her duty to correct the problem but to leave God out of it. All said and done, teacher was very apologetic. Apparently she enjoys her employment with the school district.

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Old December 18th, 2012, 07:40 PM   #36
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Let me add, we do not need "trickle down spirituality" legislated into our schools or government to change society. If the religious dont like the godlessness of our society, maybe we should reach out to those who are godless individually instead of forcing a god on the masses through law. Real social change starts in the homes not in the halls of government. Really trying not to preach here, but no where in scripture is true christianity promoted by government, yet the disciples of Christ were said to have "turned their world (society) upside down".
I believe that is why our founding fathers left a state religion out of it. They saw the damage done by the Catholic church and the English government. They didn't want that.

Living our lives to glorify God will speak louder then any bill or act of government can. It goes both ways though.


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[/COLOR]
I would agree I have seen the mockery and that needs to stop. We want to be tolerant, right? I've also seen some manipulation of students because of their religious views. A recent example: my 13 yr old daughter was trash talking an opposing team during a game in her gym class, her teacher called her out and said she was going too far with it. I have no problem with this so far. Then the teacher who we do not know, but knew of my daughters religious views began to ask her what "her god" would think of her actions. To me this was a clear cut attempt to manipulate her emotions. My wife made a call to her directly, cited separation of church and state and informed the teacher it was her duty to correct the problem but to leave God out of it. All said and done, teacher was very apologetic. Apparently she enjoys her employment with the school district.
That's similar to what I've witnessed. We had a Cycle tour shirt that had "420 miles" on it, referring to the amount of miles we rode in that 6 day tour. One of the teachers specifically picked on my brother for it and would force him to cover it. It only took a short time for my dad to sit him down and tell him what was going on. My brother wasn't the only one he picked on for thier faith though. He wouldn't apologize either. I actually think he had something against our family. I drove in his Drivers ed car one time and drove perfect. We get into the parking lot and I don't stop as long as he thinks I should have and he makes a huge deal out of it.

Don't even get me started on College profs. Those guys are just arrogant.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 10:36 PM   #37
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I don't expect teachers to teach religion, I don't believe anyone has stated that. I do have a problem of taking a stance against prayer or having a bible in school.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 10:43 PM   #38
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I don't expect teachers to teach religion, I don't believe anyone has stated that. I do have a problem of taking a stance against prayer or having a bible in school.
Uh, you CAN pray, and you CAN bring a bible to a public school. As an individual, you have the freedom of religion.

What CANNOT be done, is for the school to endorse a religion. They could endorse ALL religions if necessary.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 10:49 PM   #39
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Uh, you CAN pray, and you CAN bring a bible to a public school. As an individual, you have the freedom of religion.

What CANNOT be done, is for the school to endorse a religion. They could endorse ALL religions if necessary.
You say that it shouldn't be a problem but it does if you have any sort of group activity. I'll see if I can find the article about a school district going ape shit over a few students blessing their food at lunch.

Football team praying before a game...

Cheerleaders in TX having a Bible verse on a banner... etc.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 11:18 PM   #40
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You say that it shouldn't be a problem but it does if you have any sort of group activity. I'll see if I can find the article about a school district going ape shit over a few students blessing their food at lunch.

Football team praying before a game...

Cheerleaders in TX having a Bible verse on a banner... etc.
Group activity at a school sponsored event admittedly is a gray area. It's not specifically banned, but it's not specifically allowed either. The issue is because it's a 'group' activity vs an 'individual' activity.

For the record, I think it's BS that the school harasses a group of like minded individuals for doing something they all agree upon. The KKK gets to have activities and it's protected free speech. (well, not so much anymore)

Every group will have extremists that want to push their agenda. I don't agree with the atheist groups that want to scrub every religious message from public view. A nativity scene on the city hall lawn is ok with me, as long as any other religious group is allowed to put their icons along side it.

But I am not going to assume other religions have been discouraged from a display if I don't see one.
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