Go Back   Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > Politics, Government, or Religion Chat
GL4x4 Live! GL4x4 Casino

Politics, Government, or Religion Chat Bring your flamesuit!







Search
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old May 15th, 2012, 09:02 AM   #81
osteologation
Everyday I'm Shufflin'
 
osteologation's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-31-08
Location: Caro, MI
Posts: 1,709
iTrader: (7)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScOoTeR View Post
God and his son, Jesus have historical documents that tell accounts of them both - of course, open to interpretation and one's particular level of faith. This is more evidence (not debating the validity) than most other "make-believe" people.

Folks who don't have faith and do not follow in Christ's path really have the right to say God doesn't exist in the same vein as saying believers don't have the right to say God DOES exist.

Basing your decision of something that doesn't exist on a lack of evidence is short sighted: Just because something cannot be explained to you in a way you understand does not mean it is not real.
Thank you, that was the point I was making. I'm a skeptic. I really believe that there will be things that we may never be able to prove or understand. Some people go to, what I believe, desperate measures to prove the unprovable. There are more important things in life than to worry about things you have no control over.
osteologation is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 11:27 AM   #82
Yota Bill
Senior Member
 
Join Date: 08-24-08
Location: Morrice, Mi
Posts: 3,229
iTrader: (11)
Back to the original topic, I can't see any reason to stop them from having a legal "union", regardless of what its called, that gives them the same legal benefits. Any church that doesn't want to allow it in their church has every right to do that, but that shouldn't effect the citizens who don't follow that church.
I happen to know 2 women who have a civil union, and one is on the others medical insurance, which is allowed by law, her employer, and the insurance provider. However, at tax time, Uncle Sam hits her for 30% on that money, which is a tax only gays pay. I can definitely see why they get pissed about this subject.
Yota Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 11:35 AM   #83
AJ Hall
Lick em N Stick em
 
AJ Hall's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-04-09
Location: White Lake, Michigan
Posts: 1,801
iTrader: (3)
Nope!
Don't agree with it and never will. I wont bash someone for being gay or getting married to someone of the same sex unless they have to flaunt the fact that there gay and make sure we know they are gay by the way they act and dress. If they act like normal people.. then whatever... but a woman that tries to look/act more like a guy or a guy that tries to look/act more like a girl is absolutely fucking gross.
AJ Hall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 11:47 AM   #84
Yota Bill
Senior Member
 
Join Date: 08-24-08
Location: Morrice, Mi
Posts: 3,229
iTrader: (11)
Contradict yourself much?
Yota Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 12:22 PM   #85
DuffMan
Your Message Here
 
DuffMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: The Ile of Grosse
Posts: 5,831
iTrader: (11)
Yes, as long as they're consenting adults.

None of my business, and it doesn't threaten/cheapen/dilute my marriage any more than the 50-60% failure rate of current marriages.

With the following modifications/understandings:

1) Elimination of "partner" benefits for unmarried couples of any gender or combination thereof. Since you can get married, no more benefits for those who choose not to do so.

2) No legal harrassment, persecution, condemnation, etc... of any church who elects to not support this. If it's legal, but against the church rules, then so be it - find another one (I'm sure a host of them will spring up or adapt). Why would you want to belong to a club that doesn't want you as a member anyway?
__________________
This is the Pub. Leave common sense at the door.
DuffMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 02:28 PM   #86
aber61
Senior Member
 
aber61's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-22-08
Location: Commerce Twp. Michigan
Posts: 5,978
iTrader: (3)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajmorell View Post
Schools don't teach much, if anything now about heterosexual lifestyles, what makes you think they're going to start pushing homosexual lifestyles? Being accepting of homosexuals is one thing, promoting it is another completely.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott2.0 View Post
I'm not really interested in any recommendations you have. Your credibility went straight down the shitter based on your idiotic post above implying that schools will begin pushing gay propaganda. Schools don't teach about how great it is to have a mom and a dad so why the hell would they flip a switch and begin teaching about how great it is to have two dads? Do you really think that would ever happen?
This is just one example to show you homosexuality IS being promoted in schools to elementary kids.

Google is your friend, try it.

aber61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 02:40 PM   #87
aber61
Senior Member
 
aber61's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-22-08
Location: Commerce Twp. Michigan
Posts: 5,978
iTrader: (3)
This is not only in California but in Michigan.

aber61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 02:47 PM   #88
kickstand
sHaMoNe!
 
kickstand's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-20-06
Location: fenton
Posts: 30,106
iTrader: (46)
I didn't watch Aber's video's but if the schools are legitimately promoting a homosexual lifestyle I do have a problem with that.

If they are promoting awareness and acceptance I am "ok" with that, but not in favor.
kickstand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 03:07 PM   #89
aber61
Senior Member
 
aber61's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-22-08
Location: Commerce Twp. Michigan
Posts: 5,978
iTrader: (3)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kickstand View Post
I didn't watch Aber's video's but if the schools are legitimately promoting a homosexual lifestyle I do have a problem with that.

If they are promoting awareness and acceptance I am "ok" with that, but not in favor.
I put these up only to inform the replies that they stated it is not happening but it is. They do promote awareness and that we should accept this being taught in our schools... but should 5 and 6 year old children be taught this at a young and innocent age?
I would think not. Love the sinner, hate the sin. Which means I do not have to accept thier behavior as normal. Just my thinking.
aber61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 03:07 PM   #90
whiterhino
I'm not old, honest...
 
whiterhino's Avatar
 
Join Date: 03-07-06
Location: Davisburg MI
Posts: 19,950
iTrader: (21)
Both videos show parents complaning about pro gay agendas. Neither one shows the actual promotion by the schools. So, what I gather from them both is yes, there is some form of promotion, but I am not able to determine how bad it is, or by whom.

There is no way I want my kids being taught that gay is OK, but these videos are poor arguements.
__________________
GLFWDA member since 1979.
Member Southern Michigan Rock Crawlers.
whiterhino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 03:14 PM   #91
kerryann
German cars are hot
 
kerryann's Avatar
 
Join Date: 11-05-05
Location: West Bloomfield
Posts: 11,417
iTrader: (3)
I also agree you cant determine what is being taught from those videos. What if the videos talk about bullying, which is a hot topic? Who knows?
Watching a video about being gay will not turn your kid gay, just like taking sex ed in JR high didn't make me run out and have sex.
kerryann is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 03:54 PM   #92
Scott2.0
Senior Member
 
Join Date: 03-26-12
Location: Berkley
Posts: 197
iTrader: (2)
If a kid is gay, he's gay regardless of whether or not he sees two gay cartoon characters. Likewise, watching a video isn't going to turn our straight kids into fairies. Do you honestly think that kids will become gay by reading these books or watching these videos?
Scott2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 04:00 PM   #93
aber61
Senior Member
 
aber61's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-22-08
Location: Commerce Twp. Michigan
Posts: 5,978
iTrader: (3)
This is actually an agenda by the gay community to recrut our children to show them that alternative lifestyles are ok, so its not just about watching a video it is showing kids its a lifestyle to choose from. Kids don't need to know about gay pride.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,52098,00.html
aber61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 04:17 PM   #94
Scott2.0
Senior Member
 
Join Date: 03-26-12
Location: Berkley
Posts: 197
iTrader: (2)
Quote:
Originally Posted by aber61 View Post
This is actually an agenda by the gay community to recrut our children to show them that alternative lifestyles are ok, so its not just about watching a video it is showing kids its a lifestyle to choose from. Kids don't need to know about gay pride.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,52098,00.html
Recruit our kids?! Wow, man, talk about paranoia. I hope you're kidding because you sound nuts. I have gay neighbors (great neighbors btw and most people would love to live by anyone that takes such pride in their home as these guys do) and not once have they tried to "recruit" me or my kids. As far as giving kids a lifestyle to choose from, you don't chose your sexuality so that point is moot.
Scott2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 04:57 PM   #95
aber61
Senior Member
 
aber61's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-22-08
Location: Commerce Twp. Michigan
Posts: 5,978
iTrader: (3)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott2.0 View Post
Recruit our kids?! Wow, man, talk about paranoia. I hope you're kidding because you sound nuts. I have gay neighbors (great neighbors btw and most people would love to live by anyone that takes such pride in their home as these guys do) and not once have they tried to "recruit" me or my kids. As far as giving kids a lifestyle to choose from, you don't chose your sexuality so that point is moot.
No paranoia here. But I do have a different opinion than yours... and I am nuts. Name calling is no way to make a point nor discuss an issue. So leave the name calling on the school yard,k.
I am sure you have great neibours and they take pride in what they do, take care of thier yard and home. This is normal for most people to take pride in thier property. They are probably good people and friendly also. They live thier life and do so because they choose to live like that.
There are gay people that want to promote what they do and target the youth in schools to do so. Maybe not your neibours but I am sure they have friends that are part of or belong to a group that does.
As for choosing, do you choose to act like a man and are attracted to women?
It is a choice. One is born male and one is born female.
There are people that have made a choice to live the homosexual life and also have choosen to leave that life and seeing how they were living is and was wrong.
aber61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 05:09 PM   #96
Scott2.0
Senior Member
 
Join Date: 03-26-12
Location: Berkley
Posts: 197
iTrader: (2)
The fundamental basis to your entire recruitment, promotion, propaganda argument is that you believe people choose to be gay or straight. I completely disagree. I couldn't be with a guy no matter what so I am confident that I am "wired" to be with women and I believe it's no different for gays. When I banged a girl for the first time, I didn't debate as to whether I was going to try to have sex with a guy or girl, so there was no decision ever made. I knew girls gave me hardons and I never chose that, it just is what it is. Seeing it as something you're born with makes your concern of them turning our kids gay or "recruiting them" completely absurd. I won't try to convince you otherwise because I know it won't go anywhere so we'll have to agree to disagree.
Scott2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 05:15 PM   #97
opie
www.krissplicing.com
 
Join Date: 07-21-08
Location: Lansing, MI
Posts: 808
iTrader: (10)
Quote:
Originally Posted by red87chevy View Post
God made adam and eve not adam and steve!
Same sex partners should not be allowed to marry because that is meant for a man and women to enjoy as a gift from god.
Anyone that says it should pm me ill give you verses to surport my answer
Not everyone believes in God nor does everyone live their life according to scripture.

We broke away from religious persecution and here some 250 years later its being touted about as justification for legislated morality.

opie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 05:21 PM   #98
opie
www.krissplicing.com
 
Join Date: 07-21-08
Location: Lansing, MI
Posts: 808
iTrader: (10)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScOoTeR View Post
"Marriage" is a term used by the church to describe the union of a man, woman and God.

If people were smart enough, they would term the "marriage" of two same-sex partners something else to stop all the bitching. A civil union, partnership - whatever. It's sorta like using a religious term for something that is forbidden in religion, by God.

Name it something else, get legally bound to your gay partner and let the church continue their "thing" while "you" two start your own.
I do agree that the institution of marriage is largely between the people involved and their church. But what if a particular church chooses to sanction marriages between same sex couples? Is there one particular religion that has rights to the term and definition "marriage?"

In the absence of case law within our justice system, often times rulings fall back on dictionary definitions...

1
a (1) : the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law (2) : the state of being united to a person of the same sex in a relationship like that of a traditional marriage <same-sex marriage> b : the mutual relation of married persons : wedlock c : the institution whereby individuals are joined in a marriage
2
: an act of marrying or the rite by which the married status is effected; especially : the wedding ceremony and attendant festivities or formalities
3
: an intimate or close union <the marriage of painting and poetry J. T. Shawcross>
See marriage defined for English-language learners
See marriage defined for kids
opie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 06:05 PM   #99
aber61
Senior Member
 
aber61's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-22-08
Location: Commerce Twp. Michigan
Posts: 5,978
iTrader: (3)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott2.0 View Post
The fundamental basis to your entire recruitment, promotion, propaganda argument is that you believe people choose to be gay or straight. I completely disagree. I couldn't be with a guy no matter what so I am confident that I am "wired" to be with women and I believe it's no different for gays. When I banged a girl for the first time, I didn't debate as to whether I was going to try to have sex with a guy or girl, so there was no decision ever made. I knew girls gave me hardons and I never chose that, it just is what it is. Seeing it as something you're born with makes your concern of them turning our kids gay or "recruiting them" completely absurd. I won't try to convince you otherwise because I know it won't go anywhere so we'll have to agree to disagree.
Just the notion of telling our kids(6 yr old and up) about gay sex is NOT the business of the schools or the gay groups that push to inform minors that its ok to be gay.
aber61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th, 2012, 06:15 PM   #100
jeepinRRT
Senior Member
 
jeepinRRT's Avatar
 
Join Date: 09-13-08
Location: Grand Rapids,MI
Posts: 3,621
iTrader: (9)
Quote:
Originally Posted by aber61 View Post
Just the notion of telling our kids(6 yr old and up) about gay sex is NOT the business of the schools or the gay groups that push to inform minors that its ok to be gay.
You're right, we should hate, discriminate, and generally berate gay people for being gay. I think my God would approve of that behavior.
jeepinRRT is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Great Lakes 4x4. The largest offroad forum in the Midwest > General 4x4 Stuff > Politics, Government, or Religion Chat
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:43 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright 2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2005 - 2012 Cracker Enterprises - Powered by Linux
vB Ad Management by =RedTyger=
Page generated in 0.23759 seconds with 54 queries