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Old May 14th, 2012, 02:32 PM   #41
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If the U.S. was founded on the Christian religion, the Constitution would clearly say so--but it does not. Nowhere does the Constitution say: "The United States is a Christian Nation", or anything even close to that. In fact, the words "Jesus Christ, Christianity, Bible, Creator, Divine, or God" are never mentioned in the Constitution-- not even once.
The U.S. may not have been founded on the Christian religion, but it was based on a Judeo-Christian belief system upon it's creation. Things like the Ten Commandments being displayed in every state capitol, and "In God We Trust" on our currency didn't happen on accident.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 02:40 PM   #42
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I don't understand homosexuality. But, when a person I knew admitted it to me, his explanation caught me off guard. He told me he tried to like girls but in his words, "I have wires crossed somehow". So, it opened up my mind more. I still don't like it, approve of it or think it's right. But, on the other hand, I guess I really don't care. Yes, I am religious. Yes, I am a Christian. But, I don't see the sense in making a big deal out of an issue that only God will determine is right or wrong. It won't be determined by you or I.

Did anyone here catch the last episode of Boston Legal? Yes, I know it's only a TV show but the arguements for and against a gay marriage were outstanding. Should 2 people who have no one else but each other be allowed to love each other, care for each other, make medical decisions for each other and inherit from each other? Should they be able to live together, and purchase together? Does it matter if it is man/woman, man/man or woman/woman? I don't think so.

So, I am against it on a personal level and a moral level but I really don't care what 2 people do as long as it doesn't infringe on me or my family. My one caveat is that I don't think they should raise children. Why? Because I think a child will get a twisted sense of morality. I know I will get accused of a double standard but that's my personal opinion.

Now, back to the issues that are really important to our country.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 02:40 PM   #43
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If the U.S. was founded on the Christian religion, the Constitution would clearly say so--but it does not. Nowhere does the Constitution say: "The United States is a Christian Nation", or anything even close to that. In fact, the words "Jesus Christ, Christianity, Bible, Creator, Divine, or God" are never mentioned in the Constitution-- not even once.

Marriage is a legal term above anything else. Like others have said, a man and a woman can get married without any religious influence whatsoever and will have the same legal benefits as a couple who was married by a church. A religious group will ALWAYS have the right to recognize whatever they chose. I'm pretty sure gay people aren't protesting the Catholic church to let them in. (LOL!) The issue at hand is a civil one and by that definition, has nothing to do with religion. People tend to get way too caught up in the semantics of the term marriage.
Go read a book called "One nation under God". It's eye opening.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 02:46 PM   #44
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IMy one caveat is that I don't think they should raise children. Why? Because I think a child will get a twisted sense of morality. I know I will get accused of a double standard but that's my personal opinion.
After the last are you born gay discussion I started researching some stuff and there are studies that have said that gay parents don't make gay kids.

Do you believe that gayness is a choice or something people are born with?
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Old May 14th, 2012, 02:51 PM   #45
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Go read a book called "One nation under God". It's eye opening.
Thanks, I may. Fortunately, we have a separation of church and state so regardless of what anyone believes our country was founded upon, it doesn't really matter to civil issues such as this.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 02:52 PM   #46
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This is just a subject that the polititians use to distract you from the shit they should really be focusing on. If you are clamoring about this.... which they will pawn off anyway, then they can sleep late, play golf, take a vacation.... again, and we all look like idiots for arguing over something they don't care about anyway.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 02:54 PM   #47
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After the last are you born gay discussion I started researching some stuff and there are studies that have said that gay parents don't make gay kids.

Do you believe that gayness is a choice or something people are born with?
I believe for the most part you're born gay. We've been through this one before.

Gay parents may not make gay kids, but I do agree with it giving children a warped sense of reality.

BUT....we also said a kid with a black mom and a white dad, or whatever racial mix you want, was never gonna survive because he was "different" and those kids made it, so why can't the kid with two dads?

Now, I agree, that opens the kid up to incredible amounts of ridicule from classmates, but somewhere along the lines that too will become more acceptable.

Gay is weird as hell, but whatever your bag is I guess.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 03:44 PM   #48
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I believe for the most part you're born gay. We've been through this one before.

Gay parents may not make gay kids, but I do agree with it giving children a warped sense of reality.

BUT....we also said a kid with a black mom and a white dad, or whatever racial mix you want, was never gonna survive because he was "different" and those kids made it, so why can't the kid with two dads?

Now, I agree, that opens the kid up to incredible amounts of ridicule from classmates, but somewhere along the lines that too will become more acceptable.

Gay is weird as hell, but whatever your bag is I guess.
Most kids don't even have dads. Just look at any inner city.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 03:50 PM   #49
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why shouldn't they be?

I honestly don't really care about this at all, it will NOT affect my life.
When the schools start teaching your kids that it's ok to have two daddy's, and when they come to the schools to give speeches on homosexual life styles and the positive aspects of it you will have a different out look because then it will affect you and your life and your childrens life and your friends kids lives and on and on (like my run on sentence).
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Old May 14th, 2012, 03:54 PM   #50
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If the U.S. was founded on the Christian religion, the Constitution would clearly say so--but it does not. Nowhere does the Constitution say: "The United States is a Christian Nation", or anything even close to that. In fact, the words "Jesus Christ, Christianity, Bible, Creator, Divine, or God" are never mentioned in the Constitution-- not even once.

Marriage is a legal term above anything else. Like others have said, a man and a woman can get married without any religious influence whatsoever and will have the same legal benefits as a couple who was married by a church. A religious group will ALWAYS have the right to recognize whatever they chose. I'm pretty sure gay people aren't protesting the Catholic church to let them in. (LOL!) The issue at hand is a civil one and by that definition, has nothing to do with religion. People tend to get way too caught up in the semantics of the term marriage.
Look up wallbuilders.com this guy knows quite a bit about how this country was founded and whar the separation of church and state really meant.
He uses actual documents from the founding fathers.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 03:55 PM   #51
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Schools don't teach much, if anything now about heterosexual lifestyles, what makes you think they're going to start pushing homosexual lifestyles? Being accepting of homosexuals is one thing, promoting it is another completely.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 05:13 PM   #52
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Look up wallbuilders.com this guy knows quite a bit about how this country was founded and whar the separation of church and state really meant.
He uses actual documents from the founding fathers.
I'm not really interested in any recommendations you have. Your credibility went straight down the shitter based on your idiotic post above implying that schools will begin pushing gay propaganda. Schools don't teach about how great it is to have a mom and a dad so why the hell would they flip a switch and begin teaching about how great it is to have two dads? Do you really think that would ever happen?
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Old May 14th, 2012, 05:45 PM   #53
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"Marriage" is a term used by the church to describe the union of a man, woman and God.

If people were smart enough, they would term the "marriage" of two same-sex partners something else to stop all the bitching. A civil union, partnership - whatever. It's sorta like using a religious term for something that is forbidden in religion, by God.

Name it something else, get legally bound to your gay partner and let the church continue their "thing" while "you" two start your own.
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That statement makes me think the old Kingdom of God must be a pretty desolate place...
I tend to think that that verse points out how much EVERYBODy needs the mercy of God. I hate when people use this as an Anti-homosexual verse....Take that back, I hate when people use the bible to hate on other people. If anything that specific verse should make people realize that they are no different, as far as thier standing with God, as any other person. Most, if not all of us, fall into one of those categories. The only difference between Christian/Not Christian is that we (should, but often don't) realize that the only reason we are "saved" is because of God's mercy, nothing more, nothing less.

I would go as far to say that the only reason the Kingdom of God would be desolate is from people that use his word to spout off hate instead of mercy.

That being said, It's in a list of sins. The issue I have, as well as alot of Christians, is that homosexuals live a life in that sin. Part of being a Christian is repenting from your sin and trying not to do it. Living a homosexual Life style is living in sin just like looking at porn for a Hetro male is living in sin.

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It does not effect me one way or the other, I live my life the way I want....why you ask...because I get one shot at it, no do overs....Do I beileve there is a god, maybe.... I have to ask hows is me giving money to the church make me a better person? Will god move me up the list if I give enuff money or move me down....I have been to church seems like every week for the past month for funnerals, and even at the funnerals they talk about money, I thought money was the root of all eveil. I guess what someone else wants to do with there life is totally up to them, as long is does not effect me. WE have bigger issues to deal with....
Money should not be an issue. And I think the answer to most of your question is no. Giving money should not be forced, it should be something you want to do becuase you know the church is doing good things with that money. "God loves a Cheerful Giver". It's in the bible some where, but he doesn't want you to be forced to give money and giving more money won't give you a better place.

This idea, IMO, is derived from the Catholic church when they sold penitence (SP?) to people. 'Buy your way into heaven". No matter of money can change the fact that we are all sinners in need of a Savior. that Savior being Jesus Christ.

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Know the truth about what? That religion has existed for the sole purpose of explaining things that science couldn't at the time and controlling people?

You took it hook line and sinker.
Sounds like you took the Atheist Montra Hook line and Sinker.

Has Religion been used to control people? Yes. Does it point to God by using the creation around (Science or not)? yes.

Religion can be a horrible thing but, at this moment (in the Christian Form), Is one of the main ways people are being helped around the world. How many Charities, relief funds, missionaries, rescue missions, ETC are founded by a Church and run by one? Can you imagine the load on the economy if these organizations weren't there to help share the burden?


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Originally Posted by Scott2.0 View Post
If the U.S. was founded on the Christian religion, the Constitution would clearly say so--but it does not. Nowhere does the Constitution say: "The United States is a Christian Nation", or anything even close to that. In fact, the words "Jesus Christ, Christianity, Bible, Creator, Divine, or God" are never mentioned in the Constitution-- not even once.
The founding documents don't say anything about Christianity is because that would go against every reason they moved over here in the first place. They came from a Church state. They wanted to make sure that didn't happen. Not only to protect the state from the church, but to protect the church from the state. However, if you look at some papers predating our founding documents, such and the Mayflower compact, you'll see a very blatant mention of furthering the Kingdom of God through Jesus Christ. It was not solely founded in Christian Morals but the spreading of Christianity was, IMO, a main reason the USA is here today.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 05:53 PM   #54
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ITT: LC4X and redretard get gay for God.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 06:05 PM   #55
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I think being gay takes guts...I know I dont have the balls to stick a dick in my mouth or let another man stick his wiener in my butthole....I don't agree with their lifestyle however I respect their guts to do what they believe is right for them..
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Old May 14th, 2012, 06:51 PM   #56
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I think same sex marriage is great! There is no shortage of people in this country so at least they will not be adding to the problem in that regard.

As far as the Christian stance on this; let it go. You believe in a book you don't take seriously (you pick and choose what you feel is God's true word), so why get bent out of shape because two dudes (or dude-ettes) love each other and want a legal commitment. As long as you get to your "Heaven", why hinder other peoples lives. Oh, that's right, Christians as a general rule are hypocrites.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 06:57 PM   #57
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I think same sex marriage is great! There is no shortage of people in this country so at least they will not be adding to the problem in that regard.

As far as the Christian stance on this; let it go. You believe in a book you don't take seriously (you pick and choose what you feel is God's true word), so why get bent out of shape because two dudes (or dude-ettes) love each other and want a legal commitment. As long as you get to your "Heaven", why hinder other peoples lives. Oh, that's right, Christians as a general rule are hypocrites.
You still don't understand Christianity (and they way the bible works). Except that last part......Spot on. We are.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 07:09 PM   #58
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You still don't understand Christianity (and they way the bible works). Except that last part......Spot on. We are.
You, my friend, are one of the few Christians I like and you are not a hypocrite. We will have to agree to disagree on the gay marriage thing if you are taking the traditional Christian approach to it.

As far as understanding Christianity......... I don't because I am a logical/critical thinker, therefore I am not a good fit for most religions. We can debate this more in another thread sometime. If you start one, invite me to the party and we can have at it.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 07:13 PM   #59
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You, my friend, are one of the few Christians I like and you are not a hypocrite. We will have to agree to disagree on the gay marriage thing if you are taking the traditional Christian approach to it.

As far as understanding Christianity......... I don't because I am a logical/critical thinker, therefore I am not a good fit for most religions. We can debate this more in another thread sometime. If you start one, invite me to the party and we can have at it.
Oh, no, I'm a Hypocrite. I just understand that that is the reason I need Jesus and I'm willing to admit it and try and work on it. That is something that irks me about the modern church.

As far as starting another thread, I think we've been down that road before but if you have any questions, I'd be glad to start a new thread.
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Old May 14th, 2012, 07:36 PM   #60
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you're confusing laws and governement with your personal religious beliefs.

At one point I thought gay marriage was pretty stupid, but anymore, I don't even care. I just want to see less fat people, less people on welfare, less laziness, entitlement, etc. I'd like to see people give a damn about thinking about sustainable forms of economic growth and improvement, etc.

If two homosexuals would like to get married so they can make a commitment to each other than in a sense I am all for it.

Personally I think in a round about way it's a good thing for the level of commitment they are showing to their relationship, making it harder (more so financially then anything else) to get divorced.

Divorce sucks ass, it's not good for this country, it's not good for those involved, it's not good for the kids involved, and it soaks up a ton of government resources through courts, friend of the court, child support enforcement etc.

so if we can place more value on relationships and commitment in this country I am not so sure I am against it. Gay people will adopt children, just like straight people should be married, so should they. Sure, thats perfect world shit, but the point remains.

Do I agree with the homosexual lifestyle? No
Do I want to see them get married? No
Do I care if they do? No, I sure don't.

Let them have it and let's focus on more important things.
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Yes true it is something he will deal with but also it is our job as so call christians to let the world know in a loving way that christ is the only way to truly enter into the kingdom of heaven notice i didnt say queer or fag in any of my comment
Hopefully the person you seen in that accident understood what im taking about!
Ok, but what about those of us who aren't Christians and/or do not interpret Christianity the same way that you do?

Given the choice I would prefer that the secular world be secular, and leave people to privately practice whatever beliefs they want without oversight or intrusion by the rest of us, so long as those beliefs don't harm unwilling participants.
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