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Old March 25th, 2012, 01:36 PM   #21
dmcjeep
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Originally Posted by artistic_gore View Post
End social security! It's not going to be around when my generation is old enough to collect and I am tired of paying into a failing system.
And while we talk about ending failing systems that I paid into all my life and still pay into school taxs. Never had any kids but I continue to have to pay for yours and everyone elses to go to school. Let those that use the schools pay the price.
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Old March 28th, 2012, 11:47 PM   #22
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Care to elaborate?
Are you kidding?

It has been and is still being tried in many European countries. How about you show me where it works.

I don't need to elaborate the failings of that system, just look around.
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Old April 24th, 2012, 03:56 PM   #23
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Students attempting to pass around a petition to redistribute GPA"s and this is what happened.

http://cnsnews.com/blog/ron-meyer/st...r-their-grades
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Old April 25th, 2012, 07:40 AM   #24
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Is this really a statement against socialism or a statement against human society in general?

Socialism would work if people weren't greedy self-centered bastards. If they truly believed in their society as a whole and worked to better it for purely the sake of creating a better place for not just themselves but for the rest of society it could work.

The problem is how to get such a society started when laziness and selfishness is widespread in all societies and cultures.

Btw, I do not consider myself to be outside of the greedy self-centered bastard part of society.
I think you're partly right, but the biggest problem is this, most of these greedy self centered bastards are the ones at the bottom expecting free hand outs. How do you ever expect them to "truly believed in their society as a whole and worked to better it for purely the sake of creating a better place for not just themselves but for the rest of society" when they won't even work to provide a better life for themselves and/or own families.


IMHO - the more socialist type things brought into our system,
the more it seems to cause or bring lazy people taking advantage of that system. We need a "reward" for our hard work. Not a reward for doing nothing.
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Old April 25th, 2012, 07:54 AM   #25
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Socialism works just fine. Just ask the UAW or any other union where slackers get the same raise and benefits as the folks that bust their asses.
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Old April 25th, 2012, 08:14 AM   #26
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most of these greedy self centered bastards are the ones at the bottom expecting free hand outs.
Exactly.

How many dirt asses have wings of hospitals named after them?

The "haves" in this world give and contribute a fukc of a lot more than any "have not" will ever even dream of doing.
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Old April 25th, 2012, 10:00 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Stan View Post
Are you kidding?

It has been and is still being tried in many European countries. How about you show me where it works.

I don't need to elaborate the failings of that system, just look around.
You misunderstand me. I never said that it has worked. It would be quite an accomplishment to get it to work.

You would have to do something quite extreme like isolating an entire generation from outside influences and have them educated and mentored by a group of truly altruistic adults. Of course, this is really fantasy since isolation at that level is nearly impossible in our world of technology at this time.

So it would have to wait until a time where technology would allow for the colonization of other worlds. That might provide the necessary isolation for the social experiment to work.

Pretty much fantasy.

Just because something hasn't worked in the past doesn't mean that it can't work. You said that it was "impossible". I wanted you to explain why the concept is impossible.

I'm just in a philosophical mood today.
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Old April 25th, 2012, 11:32 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by SteelTherapy View Post
You misunderstand me. I never said that it has worked. It would be quite an accomplishment to get it to work.

You would have to do something quite extreme like isolating an entire generation from outside influences and have them educated and mentored by a group of truly altruistic adults. Of course, this is really fantasy since isolation at that level is nearly impossible in our world of technology at this time.

So it would have to wait until a time where technology would allow for the colonization of other worlds. That might provide the necessary isolation for the social experiment to work.

Pretty much fantasy.

Just because something hasn't worked in the past doesn't mean that it can't work. You said that it was "impossible". I wanted you to explain why the concept is impossible.

I'm just in a philosophical mood today.
I donít think even this extreme level of indoctrination would be sufficient to make it work. Human nature would still rear itsí ugly head. And the problem isnít just with the people who donít want to work for the good of the group, but also with the leadership. Thereís a reason why most socialist countries have been dictatorships. When the group is small (think family) itís fairly easy to get a consensus on what is best for the group, but once the group gets large, itís much more difficult. And itís not just that people are selfish bastards, it could just be different opinions on what is best for everyone. So what end up happening is that a strong central leadership is needed to impose what it believe is best for everyone on everyone. It then starts to justify mistreatment of some as what is necessary for the good of the people. Corruption and atrocities follow.
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Old April 25th, 2012, 12:00 PM   #29
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The gov has been corrupt since it started, to become rich you have to charge the poor and sell to the rich, gov takes from everyone, not nessisarily an equal amount, but enough to piss you off, There are lazy people and there are hard workers, in my experience the lazy-most of the time find a way to prevail while we bust our asses, take for example, I worked for a fabrication/hydraulic/robotics company, I bust my ass everyday to keep the company afloat, and since I was the young gun and pulled the weight of 4 other men (who worked half as hard) and they had family's I was the one layed off when the job slowed down, the "project manager"- (who literally did nothing but manage his lawn care bussiness at work)would purposely overwhelm me with the other guys half finished work (documented it daily) just to make me look like the Bad guy to keep the older men around and to cover his own ass...this is no different than the gov, they don't do much to help(project manager), they push work to others(lazy other guys) and we the working man(me) get the shit end of the deal....this country is so fukceddd up is it even worth fighting for any more?
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Old April 25th, 2012, 12:38 PM   #30
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The gov has been corrupt since it started, to become rich you have to charge the poor and sell to the rich, gov takes from everyone, not nessisarily an equal amount, but enough to piss you off, There are lazy people and there are hard workers, in my experience the lazy-most of the time find a way to prevail while we bust our asses, take for example, I worked for a fabrication/hydraulic/robotics company, I bust my ass everyday to keep the company afloat, and since I was the young gun and pulled the weight of 4 other men (who worked half as hard) and they had family's I was the one layed off when the job slowed down, the "project manager"- (who literally did nothing but manage his lawn care bussiness at work)would purposely overwhelm me with the other guys half finished work (documented it daily) just to make me look like the Bad guy to keep the older men around and to cover his own ass...this is no different than the gov, they don't do much to help(project manager), they push work to others(lazy other guys) and we the working man(me) get the shit end of the deal....this country is so fukceddd up is it even worth fighting for any more?
Holy fukc . Did you have to take a deep breath at the end of writing that? Holy run on...
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Old April 25th, 2012, 12:47 PM   #31
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When the group is small (think family) itís fairly easy to get a consensus on what is best for the group, but once the group gets large, itís much more difficult. And itís not just that people are selfish bastards, it could just be different opinions on what is best for everyone. So what end up happening is that a strong central leadership is needed to impose what it believe is best for everyone on everyone. It then starts to justify mistreatment of some as what is necessary for the good of the people. Corruption and atrocities follow.
This line of thinking applies to dictatorships, socialism, democracies, monarchies, etc. All governments can be corrupted.
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Old April 25th, 2012, 09:23 PM   #32
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This line of thinking applies to dictatorships, socialism, democracies, monarchies, etc. All governments can be corrupted.
Yes, and that is why I donít think your outer space socialist utopia would work. I donít think even a generation of indoctrination would be enough to undo millennia of survival of the fittest evolution.
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Old April 25th, 2012, 09:28 PM   #33
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Im gonna go live in Alaska somewhere deep in the woods where the government doesnt care about you. I feel like whatever happens in the lower 48, Alaska gives no fucks about
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