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View Poll Results: Make your Choice:
Bachmann 5 5.88%
Paul 20 23.53%
Perry 12 14.12%
Romney 9 10.59%
Other Republican or Independent 33 38.82%
Obama 6 7.06%
Voters: 85. You may not vote on this poll

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Old September 14th, 2011, 12:02 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by ovrlnd View Post
so you agree with the current "american shame and guilt" theory of our administration and in general.

we are #1 for a reason and it's not because of entitlement and legislation.
No, I don't think we should be shameful or guilty.

But I do think there is a difference between being great and others knowing and being great and reminding others of it. IMHO this country is quite good at the latter.
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Old September 14th, 2011, 12:07 PM   #62
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Link to him saying this please!

I am not up to speed yet on everyone who may be running, but I like Ron Paul. He seems to be one of the only ones with out an agenda. Lets reduce the size of the government and get the economy back on track. Yes he may be a little querky but WGAF? Time for some major changes and he would bring them. It is a long shot I know, but.....
I'm not going to go looking for specific clips, however I watched the debate and heard what he said. That's good enough for me. He implied that we had it coming.

I agree with Duffman. Yes, he makes good points but he mishandled himself in a simple debate where those in the debate are pretty much on the same side. He crumbled and stuttered. If he can't take the pressure from those people, I can't imagine him standing up to people that are 180 from him.
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Old September 14th, 2011, 12:12 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by mschaffer66 View Post
No, I don't think we should be shameful or guilty.

But I do think there is a difference between being great and others knowing and being great and reminding others of it. IMHO this country is quite good at the latter.
Why shouldn't we be? Every fucking country in the world is asking us for free handouts and then after they get free money/support/equipment/medical supplies, they badmouth us and vote against us at the UN. English is a universal language and the US dollar has been the universal money. (yes, that may change in the future) Every time there is a world crisis, the entire world thinks we should be the ones to fix it. So, if they don't like hearing we are better than them, let them solve the world problems. They have cultures that don't see things the way we see them. They want to change us, we want to change them. Therefore, we need to speak louder to keep it our way. Otherwise, fuckem.
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Old September 14th, 2011, 01:07 PM   #64
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Why shouldn't we be? Every fucking country in the world is asking us for free handouts and then after they get free money/support/equipment/medical supplies, they badmouth us and vote against us at the UN. English is a universal language and the US dollar has been the universal money. (yes, that may change in the future) Every time there is a world crisis, the entire world thinks we should be the ones to fix it. So, if they don't like hearing we are better than them, let them solve the world problems. They have cultures that don't see things the way we see them. They want to change us, we want to change them. Therefore, we need to speak louder to keep it our way. Otherwise, fuckem.
mega win!!!!!
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Old September 14th, 2011, 01:13 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by whiterhino View Post
I'm not going to go looking for specific clips, however I watched the debate and heard what he said. That's good enough for me. He implied that we had it coming.
He never said we deserved it, but he did say that our preemptive wars and military presence in these muslim countries are what motivate the terrorists to attack us on our own turf, not because of our freedom or our wealth as some whould try to make you believe. I dont think he is all rong either. I have never heard him say we deserved it or anything along those lines. I even used google and the Youtubes. I guess I will have to watch the debates to see where he said or "implied" that we deserved it.
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Old September 14th, 2011, 01:17 PM   #66
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Maybe you can find a clip where you see him squirm. I've liked him in the past and like some of the things he says. But I don't believe he's presidential material. Of course neither is any of the other candidates.
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Old September 14th, 2011, 01:58 PM   #67
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While eliminating the Dept of Education, Dept of Energy, etc... makes great campaign rhetoric, it's not that easy.

Blind, literal and unthinking "verbatim complaince" fundamentalism with the Constitution is just as bad an idea as Biblical (or Islamic) fundametalism. I agree that we need to "get back to basics: using the Constitution as our specification and thoughtfully eliminate/reduce/repurpose many parts of our government.

These things are going to come to an end one way or the other. Returning these powers to the states, per the constitution, is Mr. Pauls plan. The other path is to wait for the Federal Government to declare insolvency, which is coming soon. Which do think will be more orderly?

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And while I think we need to get a lot more defensive of our own economy/industries/markets and rework a lot of really bad "one way" (generally against us) trade policies and agreements, full-on isolationism isn't the answer either. And we can't just "cut and run" from "illegal" wars - while we need to get out sooner rather than later, it has to be done right.
I challenge you to use the man's own words to show me where he ever used the term isolationist or isolationism to define his position on trade or war. You need to listen to the man and not the talk radio mafia's propaganda about the man.

If you are pro-war that's a good reason to vote against Mr. Paul. I am not. I don't believe that war makes us safe and I don't believe we can afford to continue, we are beyond broke.

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And look at Paul's record: his inflexible, idealism results in his getting little done. As POTUS, he would generate such gridlock and paralysis that it would make Obie's first couple of years (with an extremely friendly House & Senate nonetheless) look like a master statesman.

So, while he's a great reminder of how we need to start doing things, he's too extreme to actually get anything done - hence "nutjob"...
Willingness to compromise on sound principle's does not make one a good leader. Compromise got us what we have today.

I see nothing nut-jobish about any of his positions, if you actually listen to him and not to other's opinions of him.
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Old September 14th, 2011, 01:59 PM   #68
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Do you believe 9/11 is our fault and that we deserved it?
No I don't think that, and neither does Mr. Paul.
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Old September 14th, 2011, 02:13 PM   #69
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To further the debate, here is Ron Paul's stance, quoted from his website.


by Ron Paul

Ten years ago shocking and horrific acts of terrorism were carried out on US soil, taking over 3,000 innocent American lives. Without a doubt, this action demanded retaliation and retribution. However, much has been done in the name of protecting the American people from terrorism that has reduced our prosperity and liberty and even made us less safe. This is ironic and sad, considering that the oft-repeated line concerning the reasoning behind the attacks is that they hate us for who we are – a free, prosperous people – and that we must not under any circumstances allow the terrorists to win.

Though it is hard for many to believe, honest studies show that the real motivation behind the September 11 attacks and the vast majority of other instances of suicide terrorism is not that our enemies are bothered by our way of life. Neither is it our religion, or our wealth. Rather, it is primarily occupation. If you were to imagine for a moment how you would feel if another country forcibly occupied the United States, had military bases and armed soldiers present in our hometowns, you might begin to understand why foreign occupation upsets people so much. Robert Pape has extensively researched this issue and goes in depth in his book “Cutting the Fuse: The Explosion of Global Suicide Terrorism and How to Stop It”. In fact, of 2,200 incidents of suicide attacks he has studied worldwide since 1980, 95% were in response to foreign occupation.

Pape notes that before our invasion of Iraq, only about 10% of suicide terrorism was aimed at Americans or American interests. Since, then however, not only is suicide terrorism greatly on the rise, but 91% of it is now directed at us.

Yes, the attacks of 9/11 deserved a response. But the manner in which we responded has allowed radicals in the Muslim world to advance a very threatening narrative about us and our motivation in occupying their lands. Osama bin Laden referred to us as “crusaders” with a religious agenda to convert Muslims, westernize their culture and take control of their resources. If we had targeted our response to only the thugs and criminals who attacked us, and refrained from invading countries that had nothing to do with it, this characterization would seem less plausible to the desperate and displaced. Blaming Islam alone is grossly misleading.

Instead, we chose a course of action that led to the further loss of 8,000 American lives, left 40,000 wounded and has hundreds of thousands seeking help at the Veterans Administration. We are three to four trillion dollars poorer. Our military is spread dangerously thin around the globe, at the expense of protection here at home. Not only that, but we have allowed our freedoms to be greatly threatened and undermined from within. The Patriot Act, warrantless searches and wiretapping, abuse of habeus corpus, useless and humiliating searches at airports are just a few examples of how we’ve allowed the terrorists to “win” by making our country less free.

Suicide terrorism did not exist in Iraq before we got there. Now it does. There are no known instances of Iranians committing suicide terrorism. If we invade and occupy Iran, expect that to change, too.

Sometimes it can be very uncomfortable to ask the right questions and face the truth. When a slick politician comes along and gives a much more soothing, self-congratulating version of events, it is very tempting to simply believe what we would like to hear. But listening to lies does not make us safer, even though it might make us feel better about ourselves.

The truth is that ending these misguided wars and occupations will make us safer, more prosperous and more free.


***********************************************

“I myself have never been an isolationist. I favor the very opposite of isolation: diplomacy, free trade, and freedom of travel. The real isolationists are those who impose sanctions and embargoes on countries and peoples across the globe because they disagree with the internal and foreign policies of their leaders. The real isolationists are those who choose to use force overseas to promote democracy, rather than seeking change through diplomacy, engagement, and by setting a positive example. The real isolationists are those who isolate their country in the court of world opinion by pursuing needless belligerence and war that have nothing to do with legitimate national security concerns.”
— Ron Paul, The Revolution: A Manifesto

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Old September 14th, 2011, 02:39 PM   #70
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I have liked Ron Paul in the past and many of the things he has said. But, the old saying of "actions speak louder than words" showed up during the debate. I thought he did a terrible job and he lost a lot of my respect during that time. Simple as that.
Go back to the days of Ross Perot running for president. His VP candidate blew his chances in one single debate. sucks but it's true.
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Old September 14th, 2011, 03:11 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschaffer66 View Post
No, I don't think we should be shameful or guilty.

But I do think there is a difference between being great and others knowing and being great and reminding others of it. IMHO this country is quite good at the latter.
I agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Teddy Roosevelt
"Speak softly and carry a big stick; you will go far,"
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Old September 20th, 2011, 03:49 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by brewmenn View Post
I agree.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teddy Roosevelt
"Speak softly and carry a big stick; you will go far,"
that's fine but we don't speak softly and when we hit someone with our big stick we apologize to them because we don't want to offend them
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Old September 24th, 2011, 12:13 AM   #73
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Rick Perry is finished.
His idea of education destroyed any chance he had.
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Old September 24th, 2011, 02:53 AM   #74
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that's fine but we don't speak softly and when we hit someone with our big stick we apologize to them because we don't want to offend them
Yep. Every once and a while we may need to remind someone that were not afraid to use that big stick.
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Old September 24th, 2011, 03:10 AM   #75
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we are looking at the wrong democrat candidate. in their desire to keep control of the white house, the dem party will see obama loosing the election. therefore they will pursue a behind-the-scenes "draft hillary" campaign.

slick willie has already started a low key campaign of publically questioning some of obama's decisions in his role of paving the way for his "wife".

when she's elected, she'll appoint him Sec of State in order to keep him and his pecker off-shore and out of the limelight.

as much as i do not like her (she's been caught in many many lies while first lady) she'd be easily elected as every woman in america will believe she is the real Hope-and-Change they are looking for.

therefore, pick a favorite candidate to run against her not obama.
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Old September 24th, 2011, 05:21 AM   #76
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where is uncle ted?
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Old September 24th, 2011, 07:11 AM   #77
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Rick Perry is finished.
His idea of education destroyed any chance he had.
Agreed.
Rick Santorum did a great job on driving home that point.
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Old September 25th, 2011, 06:14 PM   #78
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Rick Perry is finished.
His idea of education destroyed any chance he had.
x3
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Old September 25th, 2011, 06:24 PM   #79
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Rick Perry is finished.
His idea of education destroyed any chance he had.
Yup.
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Old September 28th, 2011, 11:09 AM   #80
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Cain commenting on the Mexican border:

"VAN SUSTEREN: All right, now let me turn to foreign policy. Mexico, as you know, is right next door. Everybody knows that. An enormous amount of violence. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton was described it as like Colombia 20 years ago and got rebuked by both President Obama and President Calderon.
If you become president, are you going to -- is there anything you're going to do differently about the drug cartels and the violence that -- down in that country from a humanitarian standpoint, as well as from a national security standpoint for us?
CAIN: Let's start with the national security standpoint. I am going to secure the border for real. That's step one. I don't know why previous administrations, including this one as well as the Bush administration, didn't get serious about securing the border. Maybe they didn't want to offend our neighbor. I'm not concerned about offending them. I'm more concerned about protecting Americans. So that's job number one.
Secondly, yes, I'm not -- I can't worry about humanitarian reasons inside Mexico right now until we make sure that we deal with what's happening in this country and what's leaving this country. You've heard about some of the scandals in terms of weapons, you know, that were going from the United States that ended up in the hands of the drug cartels. We have got to get serious about defending the borders and defending our laws here in the United States first.
Those are going to be my two top priorities. Then I'll deal with humanitarian issues that might be happening in Mexico.
VAN SUSTEREN: Mr. Cain, thank you for joining us. There are a lot of issues, and I sure hope you'll come back because it's going to be a long race.
CAIN: It's a marathon, Greta. And thanks for having me on.
VAN SUSTEREN: Indeed, it is. Thank you, sir."


He's speaking the truth and not pandering to Mexicans like candidates and Presidents from both parties have done to date.

Behavior likethat and his "9-9-9" flat rate tax (something I've long been a fan of) are why his stock is rising.
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