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Old June 24th, 2010, 12:19 PM   #61
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as far as i am concerned you can keep all those options and save me 1/4 the cost of the truck. I was thinking of an upgrade in trucks untill i saw the price and the fact that gm dosent even offer a man trans. I did not even get to the point if they still made the w/t option package. $42,000 are you kidding me! you say that they are givving people what they want, well maybe at te moment but when fuel goes back to $4-$5 a gallon it will prob stay there and the only people runing 3/4 and 1 tons will be the ones that have to. And im sorry if you dissagree but most of the people who NEED a 3/4 or 1 ton can live without all those fancy options, let alone afford them. Ha, I can just see it now all the construction workers and farmers running around in trashed out $50,000 pickups. And everyone will wonder why remodel work,concrete work, and groceries are so dog gone expensive.

Last edited by fabguy01; June 24th, 2010 at 12:25 PM.
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Old June 24th, 2010, 12:25 PM   #62
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Sitting around 14 loaded. Truck has 2200 miles on it and is headed to Canada now with trailer in tow. I will report back when it hits US soil with the latest fuel report.
Wow, 14mpg with a 35ft trailer? That's fantastic!
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Old June 24th, 2010, 12:26 PM   #63
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as far as i am concerned you can keep all those options and save me 1/4 the cost of the truck.

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Old June 24th, 2010, 12:33 PM   #64
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as far as i am concerned you can keep all those options and save me 1/4 the cost of the truck. I was thinking of an upgrade in trucks untill i saw the price and the fact that gm dosent even offer a man trans. I did not even get to the point if they still made the w/t option package. $42,000 are you kidding me! you say that they are givving people what they want, well maybe at te moment but when fuel goes back to $4-$5 a gallon it will prob stay there and the only people runing 3/4 and 1 tons will be the ones that have to. And im sorry if you dissagree but most of the people who NEED a 3/4 or 1 ton can live without all those fancy options, let alone afford them. Ha, I can just see it now all the construction workers and farmers running around in trashed out $50,000 pickups. And everyone will wonder why remodel work,concrete work, and groceries are so dog gone expensive.
So what should a new HD diesel truck cost? 20k? 25K? Get real....

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So, keep them. That is why they are called options and not standards.
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Old June 24th, 2010, 12:54 PM   #65
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1/4 of the cost not 1/2 smarty pants math 101.$42,000 x .75= not $20-25
I dont think that 30-35 is unreasonable for the option package i want, however they dont offer the beer can package anymore.they do this so they can make people buy the more expensive product, not "giving the public what they want. I know quite a few buisness owners and none of them want to spend one dime more than they have to, let alone it be for a cushy ride for their employees to trash. well i will be looking for a low milage used.
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Old June 24th, 2010, 01:00 PM   #66
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So, keep them. That is why they are called options and not standards.
i'm sure you're still paying for them in development and other costs.
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Old June 24th, 2010, 01:04 PM   #67
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1/4 of the cost not 1/2 smarty pants math 101.$42,000 x .75= not $20-25
I dont think that 30-35 is unreasonable for the option package i want, however they dont offer the beer can package anymore.they do this so they can make people buy the more expensive product, not "giving the public what they want. I know quite a few buisness owners and none of them want to spend one dime more than they have to, let alone it be for a cushy ride for their employees to trash. well i will be looking for a low milage used.
Don't you think that the more they put into a truck the more they need to get out of it dollar wise? If they only ofter the cloth seat that costs them 125 dollars vs the vinyl seat that costs 100, they are going to have to increase the price of the vehicle to get that extra 25 dollars back. The reason they don't offer certain things anymore is not to "screw" you, it's becasue they have stopped making what is not selling.
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Old June 24th, 2010, 01:26 PM   #68
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Don't you think that the more they put into a truck the more they need to get out of it dollar wise? If they only ofter the cloth seat that costs them 125 dollars vs the vinyl seat that costs 100, they are going to have to increase the price of the vehicle to get that extra 25 dollars back. The reason they don't offer certain things anymore is not to "screw" you, it's becasue they have stopped making what is not selling.
I give up you are missing the point, I as well as many others try not to buy things that i dont need and when i do buy things that i dont need i'm a cheapskate .It pisses me off that i am willing to pay alot of money for what i want yet is unavailable .my $ is better spent paying off my mortage than for neet little gizzmos and doodads that just add up to more chit to break and cost more$ I'm done with this hijacking session.

back on subject i dont know much about emissions stuff but how can an a truck that only burns one gallon of fuel per 20 miles be worse than one that burns one gallon per 14 miles maybee i,m just a stupid hillbilly but i think I need to start a company that builds the old 12 valve cummins engines and offers conversions
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Old June 24th, 2010, 01:33 PM   #69
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i'm sure you're still paying for them in development and other costs.
You understand that goes both ways, right?

You have to validate everything. So if 90% want cloth and 10% want vinyl, then you have to do both. now you can save the company money by getting rid of the vinyl, and 90% of the people are happier because its lower cost to them, by less development cost.

If they made a truck that was only a stripped base model, how many do you really think they'd sell?

Businesses with dirty employees are not the only buyers of 3/4 and 1 ton trucks. People with boats, people who haul loads, people who just want a deisel, god forbid people with big 4x4s that want to tow comfortably. That is a huge market. And options sell very very well and make the automakers money.



Hehehe, the automakers got out of the business of making homologation vehicles a long time ago. Seems that what you guys are looking for.


If you want to make the vehicle cheaper, then stop the madness of making engines beyond 700ft lbs of tq. Make them have 450 ft lbs and get 5mpg better instead, and be less damaging on drivetrain.....
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Old June 24th, 2010, 01:43 PM   #70
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I give up you are missing the point, I as well as many others try not to buy things that i dont need and when i do buy things that i dont need i'm a cheapskate .It pisses me off that i am willing to pay alot of money for what i want yet is unavailable .my $ is better spent paying off my mortage than for neet little gizzmos and doodads that just add up to more chit to break and cost more$ I'm done with this hijacking session.

back on subject i dont know much about emissions stuff but how can an a truck that only burns one gallon of fuel per 20 miles be worse than one that burns one gallon per 14 miles maybee i,m just a stupid hillbilly but i think I need to start a company that builds the old 12 valve cummins engines and offers conversions
I understand what you are saying, but you are the minority! They are simply giving the people what they want.
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Old June 24th, 2010, 01:51 PM   #71
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You have to validate everything. So if 90% want cloth and 10% want vinyl, then you have to do both. now you can save the company money by getting rid of the vinyl, and 90% of the people are happier because its lower cost to them, by less development cost.


If you want to make the vehicle cheaper, then stop the madness of making engines beyond 700ft lbs of tq. Make them have 450 ft lbs and get 5mpg better instead, and be less damaging on drivetrain.....
i doubt there's much development costs in cloth seats compared to gps navigation, stablity control systems, etc. plus you dont really have to validate products that have been around for years and years.

i do agree with you on that point.
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Old June 24th, 2010, 02:19 PM   #72
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If you want to make the vehicle cheaper, then stop the madness of making engines beyond 700ft lbs of tq. Make them have 450 ft lbs and get 5mpg better instead, and be less damaging on drivetrain.....
BINGO!!! I like the power alot, but with all the emissions stuff and the big 3 fighting to have the most power, the mileage and reliability is suffering.

An old cummins can put down the power and get the mileaga, but it has no emissions nor is it quiet.

I will keep my old cummins that puts down a pretty good amount of torque for a long time. I will admit, it would be nice if it were quiet and had a newer cab sometimes. But, usually I use my truck as a truck and it does that well.




How many break downs does everyone think the new ford will have?
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Old June 24th, 2010, 02:22 PM   #73
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BINGO!!! I like the power alot, but with all the emissions stuff and the big 3 fighting to have the most power, the mileage and reliability is suffering.

An old cummins can put down the power and get the mileaga, but it has no emissions nor is it quiet.

I will keep my old cummins that puts down a pretty good amount of torque for a long time. I will admit, it would be nice if it were quiet and had a newer cab sometimes. But, usually I use my truck as a truck and it does that well.




How many break downs does everyone think the new ford will have?

Zero
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Old August 30th, 2010, 11:48 AM   #74
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[/B][/COLOR]
Zero
hows that working???
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Old August 30th, 2010, 12:01 PM   #75
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what? i think a truck should be a truck and car features should stay in a car? i hate how the majority of people that drive truck go back and forth to work and to the store to shop. they dont do what the truck is intended to do but yet they bitch it rides to rough, its to loud, i dont like the seat, so now we have watered down trucks that ride like cars. im sorry that my opinion offends you. and by the way who are you again??

umm does Jesus ring a bell
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Old August 30th, 2010, 01:06 PM   #76
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good friend of mine traded his 6.4 in for a new 6.7, he loves the 6.7 its getting around
17 mpg, compared to the 6.4 which best he got was 12-13 not pulling
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Old August 30th, 2010, 01:32 PM   #77
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i went and test drove a new one. 65,000 dollars holy crap, i was not real impressed with it. it has alot of electronics i think are unnecessary but that was just the option package. it was so quiet( i dont like quiet) and smooth, i felt like i was in a mini van. it handled real nice for a crew cab long bed 4wd fully loaded truck. and the thing was quick, i turned the traction control off and it woulld just walk the ass end all over the place. i didnt really like the manual shift program it seemed a little to delayed to me. overall if i were to buy one id get the stripped down package with no hill decent warning, and navigation.

You'd love my 94 7.3 IDI turbo if you like noisy and manly truck like features. The injection pump is turned up, I'd guess its putting out around 250 hp and around 450 ft-lbs torque. Even though the power numbers are much less than newer trucks, this thing will pull anything you hook up to it. The truck will get 15 mpg if conditions are right and averages around 12 pulling 8k pounds of trailer. It's beat up pretty good but it serves my needs well. Also, no $1000/month truck payment.

Last edited by Nuggets; August 30th, 2010 at 01:36 PM.
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Old August 31st, 2010, 07:33 AM   #78
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You'd love my 94 7.3 IDI turbo if you like noisy and manly truck like features. The injection pump is turned up, I'd guess its putting out around 250 hp and around 450 ft-lbs torque. Even though the power numbers are much less than newer trucks, this thing will pull anything you hook up to it. The truck will get 15 mpg if conditions are right and averages around 12 pulling 8k pounds of trailer. It's beat up pretty good but it serves my needs well. Also, no $1000/month truck payment.
Close to the same with my 1996 7.3 DI, except I can get a bit over 20 empty and about 16 loaded with our camper and trailer in tow (I don't drive over 60 mph for those numbers).

Another data point - I recently returned from a 6.6L Duramax test trip and put just over 5000 miles on one over two weeks. I was working on some controls that require me to run regen probably 50% of the time.

I spent many hours sitting and idling, running up steep grades, driving 80 mph, regenning (all things that are lousy on fuel economy) - and averaged 16 mpg for those 5000 miles. That's awesome fuel economy seeing the hell I put that truck through.
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Old August 31st, 2010, 06:49 PM   #79
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Any news on the new super duty diesel?

Any inside info. on wether it will be any better than the last 2 motors they sold everyone?
Pro's/cons:

6.0L- issues with egr coolers, head gaskets, turbo vgt vane sticking, and injectors. Injectors are fired with high pressure oil, oil gets nasty, thick and causes stiction. This restricts the spool valves in the injectors from allowing fuel to enter the combustion chamber properly resulting in run roughs. Turbo VGT vanes stick/rust in conjunction with the unison ring. This results in some cases as a lack of power but recently, more overboost issues causing headgasket failures. EGR coolers flat out suck, internally fail and cause venting out of the degas bottle. Most commonly the silicates drop out of the coolant, plug the oil cooler and restrict coolant from flowing to the EGR cooler. This causes localized boiling in the EGR cooler, results in hot spots and leads to cracks. I would never own one outside of warranty and if I did, it'd have an egr cooler delete kit, good maintenance and head studs.

6.4L- insanely sensitive to fuel contamination. When water or any other contaminate enters the fuel system it damages the high pressure pump. The high pressure pump is lubricated solely with diesel fuel. When a lack of lubricity is present for a second it sends metal through the high pressure fuel rails and into the injectors. When contaminated, the entire HP fuel system needs to be replaced (9k avg. cost and non warrantable). The 6.4L also has issues with under valve cover high pressure fuel leaks. This overfills the crankcase and backs up the breather tube, and makes its way into the charge air cooler. It builds up until you romp on it, then results in a melt down, typically on cylinders 2 and 8. This is a catastrophic failure requiring minimum a short block and head. EGR coolers fail, typically the horizontal one. I would never own one out of warranty, period.

6.7L- front cover attachments are using self tapping screws. These break after one removal (water pump replacement etc.) and require front cover replacement to fix. Thermostat housing leaking issues. DEF lines getting crushed when the bed was dropped onto it. Equally sensitive to debris/contamination high pressure fuel system. If the customer puts DEF in the diesel fuel filler it will not trip a water in fuel light before it catastrophically damages the high pressure fuel system. The filler necks are next to eachother and a DEF filler will fit in the diesel fuel filler neck but not vice versa. The 6.7 is impressive to drive as it will throw your ass back in the seat and runs great. Much more technologically advanced then the 6.0 and 6.7L.

If I had my pick....7.3L all day long.

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Old August 31st, 2010, 10:41 PM   #80
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I'm pretty happy with my low mileage 7.3L
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