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Old September 24th, 2009, 12:39 PM   #1
creeping death
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Default union drive.

my shop is having another one this year. but with all the talk of cuts at our plant it sounds like it's closer to happening this time.

i'v never worked at a union shop and was just wondering to expect if it goes through or if it is a good idea or not to sign on.

wage cuts
health care cuts
vacation cap on top of the cap in place now
call back rights (call back by attendance not seinority)
call back leingth if laid off. now 2 years before severed.
401k
and the list goes on......

i'm happy working where i do and completely accept that these cuts are happening everywhere and knew it was a matter of time before it hit us. i'm ok with that as i also consider myself lucky to live in michigan and still have a job.

just not sure if the union will help or hurt if this all goes through.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 12:44 PM   #2
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i'm for unions right now. i saw a company awhile back handing out flyers, they we're hiring for factory work assembling and inspecting medical equipment, $7.40/hour
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Old September 24th, 2009, 01:38 PM   #3
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depends on the pay situation they are offering for the union. Most likely once you are union you are on a set payscale. You will make the same as the next person with the same job and skill set, regardless of how much you bust your ass to get more work done that the average worker in your payscale. If you are a solid worker and think you are more valuable and have a higher output to the company than average, I wouldn't sign it. If you are being outworked by all your coworkers and don't want motivation, union is for you.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 04:00 PM   #4
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depends on the pay situation they are offering for the union. Most likely once you are union you are on a set payscale. You will make the same as the next person with the same job and skill set, regardless of how much you bust your ass to get more work done that the average worker in your payscale. If you are a solid worker and think you are more valuable and have a higher output to the company than average, I wouldn't sign it. If you are being outworked by all your coworkers and don't want motivation, union is for you.
I can't say that that is true at all. I work with many people who are all pro union and some love the fact they have a secure job because of the union. I do have to say we have some of the consumit union dirt bags at our shop. we even have a couple who bring in movies on their Ipod to watch while they are here. its all good when they are on breaks and lunch, but when they are telling people to wait til the movie is over to get off their ass it gets on everyones nevres. my second favorite is the guys whos daddy or mom got them a job and since they got in really young they think they got in on thier skills
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Old September 24th, 2009, 04:14 PM   #5
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I can't say that that is true at all. I work with many people who are all pro union and some love the fact they have a secure job because of the union. I do have to say we have some of the consumit union dirt bags at our shop. we even have a couple who bring in movies on their Ipod to watch while they are here. its all good when they are on breaks and lunch, but when they are telling people to wait til the movie is over to get off their ass it gets on everyones nevres. my second favorite is the guys whos daddy or mom got them a job and since they got in really young they think they got in on thier skills
Glad to see it doesn't only happen at non-unon plants. We pretty much have all that too.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 04:22 PM   #6
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I can't say that that is true at all. I work with many people who are all pro union and some love the fact they have a secure job because of the union. I do have to say we have some of the consumit union dirt bags at our shop. we even have a couple who bring in movies on their Ipod to watch while they are here. its all good when they are on breaks and lunch, but when they are telling people to wait til the movie is over to get off their ass it gets on everyones nevres. my second favorite is the guys whos daddy or mom got them a job and since they got in really young they think they got in on thier skills
How much more secure is a union vs. non union job?

Just wonder, I do not work in a union field at all. Seems like if there is not any work in your field or you company cannot secure business, the union has zilch to do with it.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 04:43 PM   #7
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mine job is secure...but construction / service trades union.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 05:32 PM   #8
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I would think a secure as one could hope for. I work in a salery unit doing development work so we have loads of skilled trades guys. we just picked up 7 guys from Huntsville and two from Albany on call back rights. they came with full seniority and union wage. even though the job grade is less then they had when layied off they pick up the next avalible job as if they had been hired there with full compinsation. they also don't have to wait a year for their senority to kick in if their jobs were eliminated.
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Old September 25th, 2009, 12:26 AM   #9
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the wage cuts to a certin extent i can deal with. i'm lucky my shop pays well right now and if they cut too much i am a skilled heavy equipment operator and still have my cdl. i'm sure i could find work somewhere inside or out of michigan i also have 3.5 years as an electrician 3 years as a pulmber among other things. i like the "9 to 5" it's why i went from doing what i did to doing what i do and am happy with it, my shop has always been a good place to work.

health care cuts, 401k match gone, cap on vacation will suck but i can roll with it if i have to.

severence cuts. are planing on laying off. so...
call back rights. now 2-4 years depending on seniority. looking to be "modified"
call back based on attendance not seniority. this is what i don't get. thats fucked.
we have always had 5 unpaid sick days to use at our own discression. at 6 you are in the system.
6 verbal warning
8 written warning.
10 three days off
12 fired.
it's a very fair system.
lots of people use these days as "un paid vacation" i am one of them. get to 6and go a year after that without missing any time and they all fall off.
now out of the blue they are wanting to take into consideration the people who are in the system at the time of lay off to call them back.
I, like many would have never considered using these days as such if this was in place before. it has always been "at your descression". there will be no chance to better your attendance once in effect. if layoffs happen tomorrow and the policy is in effect, this is what may happen:

example of proposed modification:
johny has been here 1 year and missed 3 days.
jane has been here 30 years and is in the system with 6.
johny will get called back first.

layoff by seniority call back by attendance.

this is what i don't agree with.
i honstly have a bad gut feeling about the union stepping in but i also don't agree with some fo the things the management it proposing to do either.
this is why i am confused. never being in a union i'm very hesatent about signing on to something i have no idea about. and if i do and it don't go through, will i become a target?
i work hard every day and am not worried about my performance. it's all this other shit that has me rattled.
still feel lucky i have a good job. i'm just worried how all this is going to pan out.
i am not bitching or complaining, just looking for advice from people experienced in a union enviorment to help me understand so i can possibly make an educated desision.

Last edited by creeping death; September 25th, 2009 at 12:40 AM.
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Old September 25th, 2009, 11:10 AM   #10
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Bringing in a Union will just mean that all those things like call back, etc will be bargained items.

The union bargaining committee (usually elected by you from your shop with one experienced rep from the union) and a group from the company will hash out all those items.

In my experience once you vote the union in, you will have a meeting in order to elect a committee/stewards or whatever and also decide what things are most important to you or that you want changed. That gives your committee some guidance when they bargain for your shop.

With the way most companies are treating workers atm, I think unions will start on the upswing again.

I have worked in a UAW plant for 20 years and am currently a union steward. There are good and bad things in a union shop just like in any shop, but at least most things cannot be changed on a whim by the company.
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Old September 25th, 2009, 11:50 AM   #11
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I know exactly where creeping death is coming from as I work in a different facility for the same company that is unionized. At this point in time it wouldn't make a difference. The company has the union backed into a corner with next to no option's out. The company wants 9-10 hour labor and as many temp workers as they can get mixed into their smaller and smaller full time workforce.
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