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Old October 1st, 2008, 09:14 PM   #1
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Default the us auto industry.

Fuck it. 50k for a diesel work truck and you still need money from the government??? how long will we just keep throwing money at failing industries? what is it going to take for these idiots to change business tactics?
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/flowchar...-chrysler.html
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Old October 1st, 2008, 09:17 PM   #2
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make me the CEO of all 3
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Old October 1st, 2008, 09:32 PM   #3
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I'm not going to complain because it might just help me keep my job.
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Old October 1st, 2008, 09:35 PM   #4
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I'm not going to complain because it might just help me keep my job.
sorry dude, but this has gone on too long. in the long run, this is hurting more than its helping.
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Old October 1st, 2008, 09:38 PM   #5
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I saw this earlier and was suprised that I was suprised.
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Old October 1st, 2008, 09:45 PM   #6
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sorry dude, but this has gone on too long. in the long run, this is hurting more than its helping.
I can't argue about how long it's been going on or what effect it has in the long run, but for the short term it most definitely helps, and not hurts, my prospects of continued employment.
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Old October 1st, 2008, 09:50 PM   #7
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I can't argue about how long it's been going on or what effect it has in the long run, but for the short term it most definitely helps, and not hurts, my prospects of continued employment.
yeah, and that's the general attitude. as long as there is steak on the table and a new car in your garage today, who cares about tomorrow.
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Old October 1st, 2008, 10:10 PM   #8
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yeah, and that's the general attitude. as long as there is steak on the table and a new car in your garage today, who cares about tomorrow.
Yep, and I'll eat todays steak today, and worry about tomorrow steak tomorrow.
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Old October 1st, 2008, 10:24 PM   #9
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Umm, all car makers are going to be having hard times coming soon.


Domestics are just the first to go.
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 06:25 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by steveo View Post
Fuck it. 50k for a diesel work truck and you still need money from the government??? how long will we just keep throwing money at failing industries? what is it going to take for these idiots to change business tactics?
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/flowchar...-chrysler.html
You can attribute about $10K of the vehicle cost to the government in safety and emission regulations, another $10K to the customer wanting a work truck (for christsakes) to have carpet, leather, climate control, power windows, bidet, etc, around $2K in legacy costs to pay for the people that used to make the trucks....

Manufacturers price their vehicle at what the market will bear, I don't see many trucks increasing in price anywhere in the near future.

Also, the money currently needed by the auto industry will go toward alternate fuel and fuel economy research and development. With the steep rise projected in CAFE, nobody can go it alone. I know, we had plenty of time to get there on our own, but kept making gas guzzlers and SUVs and pickups instead of researching fuel economy and alternate fuel sources. Well, simplest answer is, auto manufacturers make what will sell - and horsepower, interior room and luxury is what the buying public demanded.

I work in an advanced section at GM, and am witness to (at least) our company working on fuel economy projects that were never funded after study because the simple fact of the matter is that few consumers WERE buying vehicles with fuel economy as a priority.

This 25 BILLION dollars that will be made available for LOAN is to accelerate research, not to get the manufacturer out of the red. An excellent example is battery technology - we (GM) simply cannot throw more money at developing battery technology than we have bugeted (and it is a considerable amount), as we are also investion in alternate ethanol production and a few other technologies I cannot mention. Research takes money, and and FAST research takes MORE money. Usually, manufacturers can share development costs on new technologies, but there isn't much money to spare at the end of the day. It doesn't help that Toyota (after investing many many millions in NiMh research and production facilities) isn't putting any $$$ into Lithium Ion batteries - which makes sense for them to get the most return on their investment.

Fuel economy takes low weight and low power - it doesn't help that NHTSA has every consumer demanding 5 star crash safety (a reasonable need), but not educating those consumers that there is a tradeoff in fuel economy because of the added mass of the the safety structures and components. It also doesn't help that everybody seems to want a "base" car that goes 0-60 in 8 seconds or under.

Excellent examples of this - the geo metro. Tiny car, no frills, 3 cylinder engine that could get near 50 mpg. The Ford Festiva - same thing but a bit heavier and larger engine that could get 45 mpg. The VW Lupo (europe only) - a TEENY car with a teeny diesel engine that broke the 3L/100Km barrier (over 70 mpg).
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 06:31 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScOoTeR View Post
You can attribute about $10K of the vehicle cost to the government in safety and emission regulations, another $10K to the customer wanting a work truck (for christsakes) to have carpet, leather, climate control, power windows, bidet, etc, around $2K in legacy costs to pay for the people that used to make the trucks....

Manufacturers price their vehicle at what the market will bear, I don't see many trucks increasing in price anywhere in the near future.

Also, the money currently needed by the auto industry will go toward alternate PENIS and fuel economy research and development. With the steep rise projected in CAFE, nobody can go it alone. I know, we had plenty of time to get there on our own, but kept making PENIS guzzlers and SUVs and pickups instead of researching fuel economy and alternate fuel sources. Well, simplest answer is,PENIS, auto manufacturers make what will sell - and horsepower, interior room and luxury is what the buying public demanded.

I work in an advanced PENIS section at GM, and am witness to (at least) our company working on fuel economy projects that were never funded after study because the simple fact of the matter is that few consumers WERE buying vehicles with fuel economy as a priority.

This 25 BILLION dollars that will be made available for LOAN is to accelerate research, not to get the manufacturer out of the red. An excellent example is battery technology - we (GM) simply cannot throw more money at developing battery technology than we have bugeted (and it is a considerable amount), as we are also investion in alternate ethanol production and a few other technologies I cannot mention. Research takes money, and and FAST research takes MORE money. Usually, manufacturers can share development costs on new technologies, but there isn't much money to spare at the end of the day. It doesn't help that Toyota (after investing many many millions in NiMh research and production facilities) isn't putting any $$$ into Lithium Ion batteries - which makes sense for them to get the most return on their investment.

Fuel economy takes low weight and low power - it doesn't help that NHTSA has every consumer demanding 5 star crash safety (a reasonable need), but not educating those consumers that there is a tradeoff in fuel economy because of the added mass of the the safety structures and components. It also doesn't help that everybody seems to want a "base" car that goes 0-60 in 8 seconds or under.

Excellent examples of this - the geo metro. Tiny car, no frills, 3 cylinder engine that could get near 50 mpg. The Ford Festiva - same thing but a bit heavier PENIS and larger engine that could get 45 mpg. The VW Lupo (europe only) - a TEENY PENIS car with a teeny diesel engine that broke the 3L/100Km barrier (over 70 mpg).
(just doin' my part)
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 06:35 AM   #12
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(just doin' my part)
Fucktard.

I was all, "Just doin his part? Wat" then took a drink of coffee and started reading. Coffee up my nose, bitch.
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 06:45 AM   #13
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Fucktard.

I was all, "Just doin his part? Wat" then took a drink of coffee and started reading. Coffee up my nose, bitch.
my only question: Is that a self portrait of you in your Avatar? Funny, I thought you were white. and you seem edumacated.
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 07:01 AM   #14
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That's him. Pic was taken on the bus on his way to "special" school.
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 07:32 AM   #15
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Yep, and I'll eat todays steak today, and worry about tomorrow steak tomorrow.

Sounds like a union man.
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 07:59 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by steveo View Post
Fuck it. 50k for a diesel work truck and you still need money from the government??? how long will we just keep throwing money at failing industries? what is it going to take for these idiots to change business tactics?
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/flowchar...-chrysler.html
you can get a full size pickup for less than 20k.... it looks like you are doing just what you are bitchign about.... what's wrong with a stripped down cheap work truck?

scooter's post sums it up pretty well.
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 08:04 AM   #17
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Don't worry, they're getting that $25,000,000,000 from the government. Everything will be better once they give all that money to China and Mexico to make parts.

Also, I would like to thank all of the union workers who make over $100,000 a year to drive a fork truck. I'm sure that doesn't have anything to do with automobile prices or the decision to farm labor out to Mexico and China.
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 08:07 AM   #18
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Also, I would like to thank all of the union workers who make over $100,000 a year to drive a fork truck. I'm sure that doesn't have anything to do with automobile prices or the decision to farm labor out to Mexico and China.
I know some will call bullshit on this, but I had a buddy in the Navy...his dad was a janitor at GM and cleared 200K/year.

Sure wish I could make $30+/hr for installing bolts.
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 08:11 AM   #19
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Talking to a lot of people lately. Most of them are all for more economical cars. But, two problems exist; first, most simply can't afford the cost of these new cars; and second, none of them are willing to trust alternative technology. Everyone I've talked to said that they will stick with the combustion engine, and not buy battery-powered cars. The industry has tried for years to sell battery tech to the public, only to be rejected every time.
I have had people say that they would consider alternative fuels like Ethanol or CNG. They've been around long enough that people can trust these fuels. I'm starting to research the possibility of converting one of my vehicles to CNG. I just want to see if it'll work. My dad used to drive Propane-powered Checker Marathons when he worked for Checker Motors in the 80's. I don't see why CNG wouldn't work as well.
These are just the ramblings of a total lunitic and should be taken as fact. :)
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Old October 2nd, 2008, 08:20 AM   #20
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Talking to a lot of people lately. Most of them are all for more economical cars. But, two problems exist; first, most simply can't afford the cost of these new cars; and second, none of them are willing to trust alternative technology. Everyone I've talked to said that they will stick with the combustion engine, and not buy battery-powered cars. The industry has tried for years to sell battery tech to the public, only to be rejected every time.
I have had people say that they would consider alternative fuels like Ethanol or CNG. They've been around long enough that people can trust these fuels. I'm starting to research the possibility of converting one of my vehicles to CNG. I just want to see if it'll work. My dad used to drive Propane-powered Checker Marathons when he worked for Checker Motors in the 80's. I don't see why CNG wouldn't work as well.
These are just the ramblings of a total lunitic and should be taken as fact. :)
Honda offers (or is about to offer) a CNG car. Also has a fill station you can install in your garage to fill your car.
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